So anyway I get this call and go for the interview and this well presented gentleman sells me this idea of being a sales man but the main goal of the company is to train salesmen into managers to fill the vacuum as the company is on high demand. Yeah, high demand (no offense) to fund-raise for charities and sell security systems.

Today was my first day from the interviews which started 2 days ago. I, honestly HATED it! I’ve been having second thoughts since yesterday! I love interacting and communicating with people but walking around an estate all day (I do not mean to sound lazy, I am not a lazy person) without getting paid and having to cater for your own journey to and fro to these ‘territories’ back to the office and then home, was too expensive. And doing it from 9am till 9pm sometimes 10pm was I’m sorry to say, a bleeding nightmare!

I was on the verge of losing my girlfriend because she would have had to cancel the plans and surprise she had made for my birthday and I certainly haven’t been eating good either.

Thanks so much again for this post and I’m glad I opened my eyes and saved myself spending £20 a day only on travel and food – making 0 sales!

Allow me to present the flipside of your account. Briefly.

I had a great amount of money from the family business but was very frustrated and underaprecciated. I left.

Insurance had me with a larger income in a matter of weeks. I have seen many like you. I was failing myself for a period of time, but kept going just like yourself.

I find the door to door strategy to be extremely rude and bad for business.

There are so many varied testimonials for insurance salesmen, which is a proffession that gets no respect, it doesnt matter when the cash flows in.

There is a saying that says that the fair is the fair, only he who tells the story imprints his point of view, and you will hear a different version from the man who won the prize and the one who went home emptyhanded.

I believed you failed before you began. Just like every battle is won before it is ever fought, it so works the other way around.

Like Mike, I am interested in the name of the company you are referring to – sounds like a great place to work

M7

I know it has been awhile, but what MLM company(ies) do you work with? I am looking for some with the qualities you mention, such as a good training program, a quality product, and professional sales. Would LOVE to learn more or hear from you on some ideas.

So for that reason alone these terrible jobs are a great way to manage expectations.

I’m sure that before taking this job JD wouldn’t be so happy going into the family business, but by comparison the family business is a great job.

-Mike

Let me point out that ALL businesses operate that way… it’s just not as obvious. If I go to Walmart and buy a bar of soap… a lot of people get a “piece of the pie;” the cashier makes money, the stockers, the drivers, the distributor who sold Walmart the soap and trucked it to their stores makes money, the manufacturer makes money, the ADVERTISING medium that advertised the soap for them (perhaps TV commercials), makes money, Walmart makes money, and the CEO (at the top of the pyramid) makes money.

All sales environments operate pretty much the same way. Insurance, Real Estate, Retail, etc. When I was a manager of a ladies clothing store I “recruited” salespeople, trained them and, when they sold, they earned commission on top of their hourly pay. I also got an “over-ride” on their sales, in the form of a bonus. The more they sold, the bigger my bonus, because their success was, in part, due to the training and environment I was responsible for providing to them. If I trained them well… they, and I, made more money. That is fair.

Did our customers care that they made commission and I made a bonus? No. They just liked the clothes.

The concept of network marketing replaces a “box” (a physical store) and replaces mass media advertising, with a “network” of sales people. Instead of advertising, the “reps” sell through “word of mouth.” Because the company saves the money they would have put into building/renting and stocking stores, (and/or advertising on TV, etc), they can take that money and, instead, give it to the sales staff. Most products you buy, whether you buy them in Wal-Mart, or from a network marketing company, have about the same % of manufacturing “hard cost.” It’s how the rest of the “pie” is divided up that determines what type of “category” the business falls into.

Admittedly network marketing gets a “bad rap” because there are LOTS of network marketing companies that, frankly, have “bad” products (overpriced, in an over-saturated market, etc) and the companies are poorly run. This makes it difficult for people to really be successful.

They also get a bad rap because many teach their people to do the same thing that insurance company was teaching… which is to “sell the world” – push it on everyone, regardless whether they are really interested, or whether they need the product (or push the “business” – whether or not they need, or want, a “sales job”).

In my opinion… this is stupid. It annoys your “prospect” and it is frustrating for you, because you have to suffer rejection over and over again. Of course, companies with BAD products have to sell this way… because not enough people truly need their product.

But for companies that have a quality product or service… they need to (and many do) teach their people what I call “professional selling” …you FIRST determine the customers needs. If you see they truly need your product… then, and only then, do you try to sell them your product. If you can see they don’t… just “walk away.” You will find, in some situations, that those same people will later refer someone to you that they see DOES need what you are selling. But if you annoy them by being pushy… you’ll never get referrals.

Also… when I say “sell them” … what a professional really does is EDUCATE them and remove any obstacles in the way of them buying (sometimes this is financing, for instance). A good salesperson is, essentially, a teacher. If your prospect is truly “qualified” (they need the product), and if you are a good teacher, and if there are no REAL obstacles that cannot be overcome, then you make a “sale.” When you do it right… your client should never “feel” like they were “sold.” There is a saying in sales… “Everyone wants to buy – but no one wants to be sold.”

There ARE a few GREAT networking marketing companies out there with great products (you just have to know what to look for). One clue is to find out how much money the company makes off SALES of products, versus “recruiting” of new “salespeople.” Also, how many people “drop out?” If those numbers are high, that is a red flag (it’s hard to find these numbers but sometimes companies will say how many “reps” they have, and if you know their sales volume you can calculate the average sale per rep. If it’s really low, that means they have a lot of “dead wood” – people on the books, but not buying or selling product). Another red flag is if they charge a lot to get into the business (not good if they make as much, or more, recruiting then they do from product sales). Interestingly most states have strict laws governing “network marketing” businesses, and actually require some token fee (less than $50) per year to maintain status. I’m not sure what the legal reasoning for that is…. but if you see a network marketing company that is charging much more than that to be a “rep” … that is not a good sign. Good companies keep that fee low, and the money you DO spend is spent on their product or service… and if you love and need it anyway, then it’s money well spent.

If you DO find a company with a great product (Rule #1 is never sell a product that you don’t truly want, or need, for yourself) … AND you ONLY sell to “qualified” leads (meaning you ask questions to determine whether that person would actually BENEFIT from your product as you do), then you can do quite well.

One of my friends currently makes over $10,000 a month after a little over a year with his network marketing company. He has never made that kind of money before… but it is a great company, with great products, and he focuses ONLY on selling them to people he has already determined will truly benefit from them. He asks the right questions, upfront. I was with him once and we got into a conversation about “what do you do?” with someone we met. He gave them a quick answer, then asked them a few questions. When he determined that they were not a prospect, he didn’t try to sell them… he simply said… “I can tell that our product is probably not something you would want or need, but people who…” he then described the type of person that his product DOES help, and why it helps them. It was a quick conversation… but the guy actually asked for his card and gave him his card… and said that his brother-in-law would probably love it. So my friend got a referral by NOT being a pushy salesperson. THAT is the right way to sell.

One benefit of network marketing is that, if you pick the right company, and treat it PROFESSIONALLY (like a real job), you can build your income over time to a level where, if you want to slack off for a month or two, it STILL pays you. You can work from home and be there for your kids, you have control over your own schedule, etc. There have been MANY millionaires made in network marketing. However… it is still “sales” …and that is not something that everyone can, or wants, to do.

I’ve worked in many different professions… restaurant, retail, hotel, car sales, and, yes, network marketing. I LOVE sales… because I will ONLY sell things I really believe in and I’ve met a LOT of fabulous people that I’ve helped with what I have sold to them. They also loved what I sold them (everyone wants to “buy” – but no one wants to “be sold”) because I didn’t “push” or pressure them, and because I don’t try to pound square pegs into round holes (if you get my meaning).

If you love people, if you find the right product or service to sell, AND if you learn “professional selling” … sales can be the BEST job in the world and a lot of FUN. If you pick the wrong product, if you don’t have the right personality, AND, most importantly, if you don’t get the RIGHT training (read books!), you will fail, and you will hate it.

I quit my “worst job ever” on August 6th and have not looked back. My strangest realization thus far has been this: I was eating between 10 and 15 full-sized candy bars per work week in an attempt to deal with the stress at that under-staffed retail bank with mostly commercial customers.

I have already lost EIGHT pounds since quitting, and I am finally almost feeling de-stressed. I have suffered that amount of stress before for reasons that meant something to me (father’s illness and subsequent death when I was 14 and others).

This JOB was NOT something in which I was willing to lose myself completely. Six years was far too long to spend there, but I am thankful to have learned what I do not want out of a job!

I was fortunate to be at the worst job I ever had for only three months. During my second year of college my small town didn’t have a lot of openings, but there was a new chain restaurant opening up in the next town over. I applied and interviewed to be a Server Assistant, which was explained to me as someone who assists the servers until they learn the ropes and becomes a server themselves. I wasn’t going to be tipped directly, but I’d get minimum wage ($5.25/hr at the time) and a share of everyone’s tips each night that I worked.

What I really was hired to do was to be the Salad Bar Bitch. I worked one of two shifts: I’d ether arrive two hours before opening to stock the salad bar (typically 10am-8pm), or I’d close down the salad bar at night (2pm-close).

The problem was that everything – I mean everything – had to be handwashed. All of the bowls and utensils were pewter and the fake plastic lettuce decorations had to be scrubbed by hand because none of it was dishwasher-safe. Then I had to dry it all and reset the salad bar with clean decorations and bowls for the next morning.

Since I had classes during the day, I almost always ended up closing. It took about 30-45 minutes after closing time to get all of the leftover food back into containers and into the fridge (yes, we saved it). Then it took my nearly an hour to hand-wash and dry the hundred pieces of plastic lettuce, the 65 pewter dishes and the 50 pewter spoons. I didn’t mind washing the dishes except that the actual dishwashers got to use a machine AND were paid more than I was.

I was told that I’d get faster with practice, but even after 3 months I was almost always the last one to leave. I often didn’t get to leave until well after 2am. I could tell the management was skimming my tipout because they ALWAYS handed me a $20 bill instead of calculating what my share was. I remember standing at the sink with a huge pile of dirty pewter and stewing about how this wasn’t the job I applied and interviewed for.

I still don’t know how I passes calc 3 that semester; I had class at 7:40am 3 days per week and I always went, but often it was on 3 or 4 hours of sleep.

Incidentally, the job I have now is also not the job I applied for; I got shoehorned into a position that overlaps 80% with the advertised position but with a lesser title, less training, and less pay.

This sentence was a punch in the stomach. Glad to know you’re much better off and happier now.

@Somone Selling Life ins: Its not much, but my prayers are with you. Keep hope.

It’s been a few years since you wrote this, but it sounds like what i’ve been doing over the past 2 1/2 yrs. The paycheck is a rollercoaster and it has almost ruined my spirit. The only time there is respect or recognition is for the ‘Flavor of the Month’ which is the salesperson who sold the most of the month.

It sucks. And I can’t wait to get out of it!!! Because of the commission, timing of the fundings, the nature of the beast is what keeps you there. Waiting for your paycheck, waiting for the sale, waiting for the customer…waiting for the big sale. It sucks!

You live , you learn every day..

This was the post that got me hooked on Get Rich Slowly about a year ago or so, and after finding out that I was getting laid off 2 weeks ago, (this is my last week) it was good to come back and read it again. I’ll take from this that sometimes life throws you lemons, and what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger. Keep on writing!

Thanks for the story. I enjoyed reading it.

Ask yourself this, why would any legitimate business not operate out of an office but solicit other people to be sales people for a joining fee of $250? And guess what, that recruit’s money gets divvied up, from the bottom up to the top. The person who recruited you gets a small portion, then the person who recruited them gets a slighter larger portion, and so on and so on all the way to the top. You can almost imagine this flow of money in a shape, like I dunno, a PYRAMID.

I freely grant that sales programs are not inherently scams; I would just warn anyone being recruited for such a job to look at it very closely. Talk to people who have worked there for more than two years. Make sure they have an established training program. And never trust any company that will let you “fudge” or lie to a customer. Even if you maintain your integrity, the company as a whole will be shaky.

[...] part of women. I know that it would never have occurred to me to get the sort of job that Ron and JD have described. Most of the women I know (including fellow blogger Mrs. Micah) would get temping [...]

That sounds like an experience I had in the early 80′s after graduation, except it was under my Dad’s company, training with an old, chain-smoking, fast talking and gifted salesman also. I was treated like the “little rich kid” and never really taken seriously at all. I was treated like the Male Tori Spelling of the insurance world!

They were very similar in their sales approach in that “everybody needs the policy-get the signature”, etc. Problem was, I was too honest for the job, or something close to that.

They had me driving all over creation, and often into Philly’s worst neighborhoods, from day one. I swear, my Dad was trying to get me killed. When I finally quit, after a torturous two years of being broke all the time, Dad stuck me in the office shuffling papers, and never gave me any respect after that. In fact, weeks would go by without him saying two words to me. I left his company in disgust after another five years in a cubicle, and my relationship with my parents never recovered, nor did my career.

Today, I see my aging parents about once a year, if that, and I am struggling along, apparently permanently screwed.

That sounds like a really tough job; I can’t imagine having to recommend something that I *know* isn’t the best product or service in the marketplace!

Telling customers the truth doesn’t make you a ‘bad’ sales person…just an ethical one! I’m crazy enough to believe that those still exist, and I’m lucky enough to have several of them as my business partners!

I don’t have any employees, so I’m sorry that I can’t offer you a job. What I can share with you is how you can do the same thing I am doing: helping people with high-quality services they *actually need*, and earning a profit at the same time.

My company website is listed below; get in touch with me if you’d like to learn more.

All the Best!

Nicole A. Dunbar
Independent Associate
Prepaid Legal Services, Inc.
http://www.prepaidlegal.com/hub/nicoleadunbar

I’m currently working as a sales associate in a high-sales retail store. We’re expected to harass our customers to help them better get the computer/printer/digital camera/etc. that suits their needs. I have no problems helping people, and we do sell products I firmly stand behind, the only problem I have is that I have to semi-lie to the customer and tell them they’ll need a new Microsoft Office Suite with their new computer. This is a lie because the computer comes with a trial and you can enter your old serial number in the trial, assuming your old serial is for the same program. I’m also expected to attempt to sell the higher up Norton Internet Suite before going to the lower-end stuff.

I don’t mind that, except that as far as *I* know, AVG Antivirus, Zone Alarm Firewall, Spybot Search & Destroy, and Lavasoft Adaware are the best antispyware, firewall and antivirus programs out there. I’d like to be able to sell *those* specifically, instead of the stupid Norton thing. Especially since all of these are available for free on the ‘net. Yes, I want the business I’m working for to benefit, but not at the excuse of the customer’s wallet. I’m told that it’s not my money, and if the customer wants to spend $1000 on a laptop + overpriced software (obviously not the phrasing my boss used ), it’s not my concern.

I’m also supposed to sell a “remote help” kind of thing. It does antivirus and spyware scans for the customer from a remote location. It claims it does everything so “you don’t have to!” Well, I don’t like selling this because a) I wouldn’t trust *anyone* accessing my computer from a remote location, and b) antivirus/antispyware can do the same thing, if you set it on a schedule.

Perhaps I’m a bad salesmen, because I will flat out tell the customer, “I’m sorry, but I’m paid to harass you with these questions.” So far, people have kindly understood what it’s like having to do something you don’t agree with for a job.

Meanwhile, I’m semi-seriously contemplating developing a ‘schizophrenic’ side like I read about in Mother Night.

My coworkers are awesome, and I love working where I work, I just don’t like selling things that are over priced (ie: You can buy the same thing for cheaper at WalMart, and WalMart makes enough money to thrive 5 times over, so why can’t my company?).

Company’s name omitted to help protect my identity (because I’m überly paranoid that way).

I do want to make a cautionary comment based on what others are saying: Not all sales people (insurance or otherwise) are sleazy and focused on separating old ladies from their money! My new favorite book is “Top 10 Distinctions Between Millionaires and the Middle Class” (by Keith Cameron Smith) He says to ask yourself (when evaluating a business opportunity):

1. Do you LIKE the people that are doing this already? Can you see yourself being around them, and enjoying it?
2. Do you BELIEVE in the product?
3. Do they have an established, supportive TRAINING system?

It is virtually impossible to be a successful entrepreneur unless you 1. Know how to sell/promote, 2. Are willing to learn how to sell/promote, OR 3. Have a partner/other staff member that will sell/promote your service or product!

I have what many would consider a good education, and a solid resume of corporate and (recently) non-profit management & operations work. I’ve always wanted to work for myself, but I hate selling. Hate it!

It wasn’t until last year when I met a successful entrepreneur that owns her own executive recruiting firm that I learned the truth: If you want to work for yourself (and earn an income), you MUST learn how to SELL/PROMOTE.

After getting a glowing performance evaluation and a CRAPPY RAISE (due to company performance) I realized that J.O.B. stands for Journey of Broke(!). So I’ve decided to set out. Slowly.

I’ve kept my job, but I’ve found an established, NYSE traded company and I’ve launched my own ‘virtual franchise’. I’ve learned that when you actually believe that what you are offering has REAL merit, it is no longer selling. It’s sharing.

I’ve also learned that no one likes high-pressure techniques, so I don’t do it. In my business, ‘Some will (buy), some won’t (buy), So What? Next (person)!” I can say that because I KNOW I’m offering something meaningful that most people need at some point, and don’t typically have!

So, the morale of the story is, don’t judge ALL sales opportunities by the cover!

I’m currently in the process of looking for a new job after being laid off from my previous one, the first job I’ve ever had. It was a good job, in management consulting, but it really didn’t make me excited or energized to get up every morning. And although I didn’t accumulate financial debt, I definitely incurred an “emotional debt” through the level of second-guessing and self-criticism I’ve put myself through as I didn’t succeed as much as I hoped I would.

Like you, I think this was the result of uninformed choice (in my case, taking the most prestigious, first job offer I got) instead of taking the time to think about what I really wanted to do. Now that I have some time (due to unemployment!) I’ve been giving serious thought to the next step. Even if it doesn’t work out perfectly, I know my next job will help me advance closer to my career goal of producing positive social impact in education.

So in sum, I agree completely with your thesis – never put up with a shitty job, and move your career forwards in jobs that reinforce your goals and principles.