Ask the Readers: Is It Better to Invest or to Prepay a Mortgage?
Friday, 1st June 2007 (by J.D.)This article is about Ask the Readers, House and Home, Investing, Real-Life
Paul writes with a common question that illustrates how challenging personal finance can be, even when you’re doing the right things. Sometimes it’s difficult to choose between several good options. Here’s his dilemma:
I refinanced my house a few years ago at a great rate (5-3/8%). At the time, we had a lot of equity in the house so we borrowed against it in order to build an addition.
After we were finished, we had a significant amount of money left over, which is currently sitting in “callable” CDs. The CDs are collecting an average of 5.25% APY. I’ve been calling this our “emergency fund”. Doing the math, you’ll see that I’m losing 0.125% on this money (5.375% mortgage rate - 5.25% CD interest).
My financial planner recommended putting it back into the mortgage. I’m leaning more towards investing it (in index funds or something else).
- If I leave the money where it is, I’m losing money.
- If I plonk down this entire lump sum on my mortgage right now, it takes ten years off the loan, but it means I have no emergency fund.
- If I invest this money at an average return rate of just 9% for the 26.5 years left on my mortgage, I end up with almost 10x the amount of money I have now! (Plus the money is easier to liquidate in case I need it.)
This seems like an easy choice, but it’s not. There’s no guarantee of a 9% return, but I feel that these numbers are fairly conservative and support the idea of investing the money vs. putting it back into the mortgage, which is why I’m very surprised at the recommendation to do so by my financial advisor. What’s the best choice here?
This question has stumped smart people for years. Is it better to invest or to prepay a mortgage? Neither answer is wrong — there are advantages and disadvantages to both. But is one choice less wrong than the other? When I covered this subject a year ago, I shared advice from several personal finance books. Here’s what they said:
- Ric Edleman (Ordinary People, Extraordinary Wealth): Never own your home outright. Instead, get a big 30-year mortgage and never pay it off — regardless of your age and income. “Every time you send an extra $100 to your mortgage company, you deny yourself the opportunity to invest that $100 somewhere else.”
- Suze Orman (The Laws of Money): Invest in the known before the unknown. Paying off your mortgage offers a guaranteed return on investment. “You cannot live in a tax return. You cannot live in a stock certificate. You live in your home.”
- Elizabeth Warren (All Your Worth): Save 20% of your income. Use 10% for retirement savings, 5% to accelerate your mortgage, and 5% to save for future dreams. “Paying off your home also does something many financial planners neglect to mention: It gives you freedom. Once that mortgage is gone, just imagine all the freedom in your wallet.”
- Dave Ramsey (The Total Money Makeover): Prepay your mortgage if you can, but only after you’ve saved an emergency fund, and only if you’re putting at least 15% of your income toward retirement. Don’t use a program designed by a broker; use your own self-discipline.
Charles Givens (Wealth Without Risk): “On the first of the month when you write your regular mortgage check, [include extra] for the ‘principal only’ portion of the next month’s payment.” For example, if you have a $1000 payment with $200 designated for principal, pay an extra $200 (for a total of $1200). This effectively cuts the term of the loan in half. Note that Givens’ advice was written in the 1980s when interest rates were much higher.- Dominguez and Robin (Your Money or Your Life): “Pay off your mortgage as quickly as possible.” This book, too, was written when interest rates were higher. Also, the authors emphasize frugality over investing.
Financial authors don’t agree on this subject. Maybe the personal finance gurus writing for the web can clear things up?
- Liz Pulliam Weston at MSN Money: Don’t rush to pay off the mortgage. “You’ve got better things to do with your money, like saving for retirement, building an emergency cushion or even living it up a little.”
- Walter Updegrave at CNN Money: If you’ve funded your retirement, and if it will make you happy, then pay down the mortgage. Otherwise, it makes more sense to invest.
- Laura Rowley at Yahoo! Finance: Using very conservative figures, investing instead of prepaying the mortgage yields an extra $400 per year. If you feel compelled to pay down your mortgage, do it. But realize you’re paying a price to do so. (She offers more details at her blog, as well as tips on how to estimate the investment return you need to earn to make it worthwhile.)
- Bankrate: Pay down your mortgage if your investments would be conservative. Invest if you’re planning to do so for the long term.
- USA Today: It depends on your income, your monthly expenses, your risk tolerance, and your desire to own your home free and clear.
- Kiplinger’s: Invest unless you’re near retirement
- The Dollar Stretcher: Mathematically, it makes more sense to invest, but it all depends on your risk tolerance.
- My fellow pfbloggers, Blueprint for Financial Prosperity and Million Dollar Journey, recommend that a person do a little of both: pay down the mortgage some and invest some. Free Money Finance says: “If you have the discipline to save/invest the money you would be using to pay off the mortgage, it’s likely that saving/investing is the better option. But if you’re more the “average” person out there managing your money, I still believe it’s a better option to pre-pay your mortgage.”
The Rowley article offers some interesting background to this debate:
Why do so many people choose to put extra money into a mortgage when other options would likely increase their wealth? “This is really remnant of Depression mentality that has persisted from generation to generation,” says [one expert]. At the time, most mortgages had one- to five-year terms, with a lump sum payment due at the end.
“Any shock to income meant you couldn’t afford your payment — mortgages were much more susceptible to economic uncertainty,” [the expert says], and roughly one-quarter of Americans were unemployed during the Great Depression. “It’s fine to pay down your mortgage if it gives you peace of mind, but you should recognize what that peace of mind costs.”
If you’re facing a similar decision, you may find this calculator useful: prepaying your mortgage vs. investing.
Researching this entry was educational. I’d always been under the impression that it was better to prepay your mortgage. At best, I thought it was a wash. After reading advice from dozens of experts, however, it seems that unless your mortgage rate is high, it makes more sense mathematically to invest your money in an index fund. (Most experts agree that psychologically you should do what works for you.)
But doesn’t this imply that, if possible, it’s a good idea to convert home equity to stock investments? Kris and I have about $100,000 of equity in this house. Should we re-finance and put the money in an index fund? I can’t imagine doing that. What would the experts say?
Have you faced Paul’s dilemma before? Which did you choose? Which would you choose if you had the option? Why?
Note: For those of you wondering about the effect of taxes, I’m assuming that all evaluations made by these experts take them into consideration. I’m also assuming that they’ve considered inflation.


Thanks for the referral J.D!
I lean toward prepayment, but I see the point of investing the money. My fiance and I are just starting to get our finances in real order (i.e., opening IRAS, creating an emergency fund, etc.), but I think we’ll pay our mortgage off early because we are planning to build a house in two years that we will live in for the rest of our lives. For that reason, I think it makes sense to pay it off early, but maybe I’m wrong?
Nice article! We have been in this dilemma for a while too. We know that based on just number crunching, it is a better idea to invest than prepay the mortgage. But when you add psychology to the equation, things aren’t so simple any more. We are both very debt-averse. The feeling of being completely debt-free is something that will mean a lot to us - I don’t know if we can put a price on that! Which makes it hard to quantify (or justify to other money savvy folks) why we choose to pre-pay our mortgage quite agressively!
Thanks for the linklove! I think the little of both always helps to assuage fears that you’re going gung ho on the wrong option, even though there isn’t really a wrong option. Ultimately, flexibility is important and having those assets at a cost of 0.125% a year isn’t that big of a deal.
Given current market conditions, I’m leaning towards prepaying one’s mortgages. If we were in the early 1990s, I’d be leaning towards investing.
As has been pointed out by many others, including criticisms on some of my posts, we cannot assume constant returns. So I look to the market to guage how much this assumption stands to be violated in the next 10 years. My most educated guess is that there’s either not going to be much growth or its going to be unevn, unsteady growth (perhaps even negative).
How much is the Present Day Value of the 10 years of interest saved worth? That’s important to know, because that’s the return on using the money on the mortgage.
I don’t think I’d get worried about the 1/8 difference. Maybe what you’re doing is working best for you now?
If I were in your shoes, I’d be prepaying, but I’m a very risk-averse individual.
Great article today - and a good topic. What wasn’t covered in the scenario above (one either side) was taxes. If we assume 30% tax on investment returns, it means the actual return on 9% is 6.3%. Of course, there is also savings on the 5.75% of the same amount, making the actual cost 4.025%.
The real advantage is much closer to 2% than 3+% in the scenario given. I’m not sure 2% is worth the psychological advantage of owning my home free and clear. I can’t imagine the freedom that comes with not having a monthly payment - period.
I’d lean toward keeping 3-6 months expenses in an emergency fund and paying the rest on the mortgage. But, that’s just my psychology!
Having been burned by investing over the last 10 years (my investment account is now worth 1/2 of what it was 8 years ago), we’re sticking our extra money in our mortgate (this doesn’t include what’s going into the 401k for retirement). Housing bubble or no, there’s not much chance of my house being worth 1/2 of what it is now. We just feel like we’ll have a lot more financial freedom with the house paid off in 15 years.
Long time reader - First time poster.
I think the challenge of the questions is in the details of the math. There are pro’s and con’s for each approach.
Pro’s for “Pay down mortgage”: You live there, you know the return and you don’t have to decide where to put the money.
Con’s for “Pay down mortgage”: You usually can’t get the money back out if you NEED it. No return on the investment. Interest is usually deductible.
Pro’s for “Invest the Difference”: Liquidity in some investments, a cushion for bad times.
Con’s for “Investing” You have no idea what your return will be. You can’t live in a stock certificate.
On the posters comment “Doing the math, you’ll see that I’m losing 0.125% on this money (5.375% mortgage rate - 5.25% CD interest).” It could go either way when it comes to a gain. If your marginal tax is high enough he/she may be making a positive spread and may qualify for lower taxation on something like stock dividends.
IMHO the poster seems to be in a good position as long as they carry the necessary insurance to protect against a large loss.
(My dislaimer: None of this is advice, don’t do anything I have suggested, including breathing. Make your own decisions with the necessary research or advice of a professional. Past performance is no guarantee of future return.)
I agree with many of the above posters that the psychological benefit of being completely debt-free is more enticing than the potential gains from investing.
I also believe that people often fail to add up all of the costs of creative financing on home loans. For instance, with a three or five year interest only mortgage, you win only if the house increases in value in a short time frame, which is no guarantee right now.
Additionally, you still have to pay the mortgage company to refinance in 3-5 years or sell and pay all of the costs associated with selling.
All that being said, a mortgage payment is probably the best tax shelter available, so as you concluded J.D., this question really is a toss up.
First of all, there is a good reason why this is such an evenly divided topic, equity markets compete with debt markets for capital. If one market offers a significantly better risk adjusted return to investors, the other market suffers. So each market attempts to remain competitive with the other by pricing accordingly, whether it is stock prices or the interest rate on a new mortgage. This means, indirectly, that interest rates are such that the decision by a borrower to prepay should not be a no brainer across the board.
Sometimes, only time can tell us if one choice is “less wrong” verses another. I don’t believe there is a universally correct answer to this problem. For some the numbers may work better one way, but it is usually not an astronomical difference. This is one of those situations that I like to go with what feels good. Ask yourself which decision might you feel better about when you wake up the next morning, which one are you more comfortable with. If it ends up costing you a little bit of money if you make the wrong financial decision, but you may still benefit psychologically, there is value in being comfortable too. We all know that we can save a lot of money over the years by not running the air conditioner in the summer, but we trade that savings to feel better. The mortgage question is not that different.
I currently have a similar situation with my school loans. I paid for college all by my lonesome and am now realizing what that means. Currently about 30% of my take home is going to the minimum payments. In my case, I am going to invest and save extra money each month because I have the goal of buying a house in mind. If there was no house in my near future, I would probably do 50-50 or so.
When I do get a house though, I will most likely be trying to get the school loans out of my hair first.
Maybe I’m missing something, but since mortgage interest is deductible from federal income taxes, isn’t the effective rate on the mortgage more like 4%, thus making even the CD a profitable investment?
One option here, especially if your current mortgage payments are not a financial burden to you, might be to invest the extra cash by purchasing a rental home. Making sure that you can rent out the investment property for more than the mortgage plus the other carrying costs would mean you would be gaining equity in two homes while only paying for one. If an emergency were to happen BEFORE you had a chance to build up your own emergency fund, you could borrow against the rental home equity up to the amount the rent covered and you wouldn’t be paying anything extra from your own pocket to repay the loan. Of course, this is all stated with the understanding that finding a renter wouldn’t pose a problem in your area and that you have enough “leftover” money to purchase the rental property without having to add your own cash to make the purchase.
I think it’s better to pay down the principal on the mortgage. I don’t know if I’m nit picking, but pre-payment is not a good idea, but applying directly to the principal is.
You can’t just do the math to get the answer. You’ll be much better off paying down your debt and working your butt off to save up an emergency fund. It’s hard to put a price on the risk you’re exposing yourself to by having the debt over your head as well as the value of learning what it takes to buckle down and really save some of your income.
Learning how to budget your finances and become someone who can really save a portion of your income will pay off more than anything in the long run. Playing the numbers game will not.
I have been on the three sides to this fence, paying a mortgage, paying more than the mortgage, and owning outright. I must say it can be rather painful to pay more than the mortgage since it takes all your money to do so (for the average person like me). Owning outright feels great since you know you are in a strong position, however, it also puts a strain on your life since all your money is tied up and not accessible (get used to driving older cars if you choose this path). The best part about owning outright versus paying the mortgage is now you no longer have the bank telling you what you can and cannot do, think of this as a lesser landlord/renter type of thing and you will understand how nice it can be when they are out of your life.
One more piece that is never considered but very related is how many people are ‘renting’ their job instead of owning their income. In other words, how many of us are slaves to the 9-5 when we could be making our own futures with our own businesses?
Aaron is correct, and I’m surprised no one else has mentioned this yet. Once you take into account the mortgage interest deduction, its almost crazy NOT to invest somewhere else!
Not sure why the author mentions 9%, even the much written about 7% is lauded as a conservative rate of return in the market.
Get your money out of your house, actual rich people do it - any reason why you aren’t?
Rob
I desperately want to pay off my mortgage to be rid of the payment and have less demands on my income. That said, my plan is to optimize my mortgage payment, interest payment and saving/investing funds. That is, I want the lowest mortgage possible so I can invest as much as possible while not overpaying interest during the time I’m expecting to be paying the mortgage interest. But I have a very healthy income which makes this feasible in just seven years. I think going much longer makes the decision harder.
The calculators I’ve seen seem to not offer the ability to calculate return you can achieve from your income once the mortgage isn’t consuming it. That is, I’ll have an extra $1000, $1500, $2000, … a month to invest after I’m free. And all that money is free of the ~%6 mortgage differential.
The first step is to determine exactly how much you can afford to save and invest. Next, calculate how long it’ll take you, at a reasonable return, to save the amount you need to pay off the mortgage, minus some savings and don’t forget the mortgage principle is dropping each month.
I’ve calculated that I can pay my mortgage off in seven years with a 9% return (I’m doing far better than this for now). After I’ve paid it off, I’ll be investing 100% of what was my mortgage payment plus what I was saving/investing for paying off the house. Continuing 9% return and it’ll take me 9 more years (16 total) to reach what would have taken me 18 years while retaining a mortgage. But my growth is accelerating far faster now without the mortgage. And in 20 years, a little before typical retirement age, I’ll have my retirement in the bag. It would have taken me 23 years if I retained a mortgage and after 23 years, still wouldn’t own my home.
I don’t consider a loan to be a source of emergency funds. This is no different from using a credit card in case of emergency–it’s just a slightly better interest rate. If you take out a loan, repay it. Be glad you didn’t need the whole loan to do what you wanted. Build up your emergency fund with the money you were using to pay back the loan before you knew you had funds remaining. THEN you are in a position to start investing. You can only start to accumulate actual wealth when you have paid back what you owe.
I work for a high tech company. When sales go down, they lay off 5-10% of the workforce. They tend to lay off people who have been there the longest. While I would like to think my performance makes me imune to getting laid off, they have laid off some of the best engineers and scientists I have worked with - it could be my turn next.
Some of my friends have found jobs quickly, some have taken 6 months to a year to find another job. If I do get laid off, I don’t want to have to grab at the first job that comes along so that I can make my fixed monthly payments. Yes, I have an emergency fund, but the monthly $1,500 mortgage payment will very quickly decimate that.
Given this uncertaintly, I want to drop my fixed monthly costs as much as I can. The only debt that I have is my mortgage. The best way that I can see to get financial security is to pay off the mortgage. Once that I paid off, I think that I can pay the rest of my monthly expenses (food, taxes, child support) with temporary or part time jobs.
If you have a job that you know is secure until retirement (teacher, police, etc) then sure, take more risks. If you have the typical job these days, where there is no job security, and finding a job with the same salary takes a while, then I would definitely try to get your mortgage paid off as soon as possible. In fact, I bought a cheaper house than most of my friends, so that I could pay it off. Once I get it paid off, I can save for a better house if I want, but I won’t risk losing the house if I get laid off.
In the millionaire next door, they talk about how long could you survive if you didn’t get any more income from your job. All of the people with the long survial times, and those with lots of capital, have thier house paid off, and paid it off as soon as they could.
I feel strongly that you should pay off your house as soon as you can.
Whatever Paul does, he needs an emergency fund, and the stock market is not the place for it.
This is strictly an economic psychology question. It boils down to, ‘how risk averse are you?’
If you value security and guaranteed return, prepay your mortgage.
If you value risk and the consequently higher return and volatility, pay your mortgage and invest the difference.
That’s why there’s no ‘right’ answer for everyone. Everyone has a different aversion to risk.
That’s why there’s no ‘right’ answer for everyone. Everyone has a different aversion to risk.
What’s curious to me, though, is how my risk aversion changes based on the situation. For example, I still lean toward paying down the mortgage, despite the math. I’m willing to wager that Kris does, too. (She’s out of town, so I can’t ask her.) Why? Because the mortgage is a sure thing.
Yet given the choice between bonds and stocks, I’d choose stocks nearly every time. Why is that? It’s because the house is a physical asset, something I own. I want to own it free and clear.
I’m not saying this is logical — it’s just how my mind works.
I would suggest that if your house payment is $1000/month, and you have the opportunity to not pay out $1000/mo anymore, why would you not jump on that and then invest. If you don’t have a mortgage to pay anymore, then you’ve got $12,000/year at least to invest without worrying as much if you lose it. What I mean is that if you own your house free and clear, you can have a higher risk tolerance. If you are set up for retirement then that $1000/mo is now money that you can do what you want with. If you invest while you still have a mortgage and you think of it as an emergency cushion, you would be crushed if you lost all that invested money. Yeah, it would still if your house was paid off, but you wouldn’t have to worry about foreclosure or bankruptcy. That’s my two cents.
Disclaimer: I don’t own a home, but I have a car payment. I am a public school educator and I am working on my Masters. I need to save $376/mo to pay cash for tuition, instead of taking out a loan. With my $300 car payment, I can only save $176. IF my car was already paid off, I would be able to save enough each month for tuition. Those are small figures, but the principal, I think, is the same. I need to pay my car off ASAP so I can stop taking out more loans for school.
There is no right answer to this.
But seriously, here is the correct answer - run the numbers. If you can, in the stock market, beat ON AVERAGE the return you’d get by prepaying on your mortgage, you should invest.
I strenuously object to Suze Ormon saying “Invest in the known.” This is so completely shortsighted. Your house is not a known - it’s just a place to sit and eat, and sleep. It is not a retirement vehicle!
The fact is that, without even considering the mortgage interest deduction, you can beat the return you get by prepaying on your mortgage. Today’s rates are low - the stock market has an annual return that beats the return you get by prepaying on your mortgage.
This is a question that we are also talking about and researching. Do we want to pay down our mortgage or do we want to invest that money.
Looking at the original question, I would vote to pay down the mortgage as it sounds like the money Mr. Poster is talking about is money that they already pulled out of the house via equity. I don’t think its a good idea to borrow against one’s primary home to invest. If its the more ordinary question of having extra money (not from a HELO) than I think the answer is different.
My husband and I are considering paying down the mortgage for the following reasons: (1) we are following the Dave Ramsy total money makeover plan and paying off the mortgage is one of his steps, (2) our primary home consists of a main home and a carriage house (2 structures) which living in South Florida requires 4 insurance policies (2 windstorm and 2 hazard policies) if we paid off our mortgage we would drop the insurance covering the carriage house thereby radically reducing our insurance costs.
I think a big advantage to owning your house outright is that if you do get laid off or have other unexpected hardships, you don’t risk foreclosure if you can’t find a new job for a long time. So part of the decision should be a realistic look at your own job security and your ability to handle a long-term financial hardship.
Maybe it would help to just rephrase this question a few different ways —
“Is it better to be in debt or to be debt-free?”
“Is it better for your life to truly be your own or is it better to be harnessed to an enormous fixed expense each month?”
“Is it better to move forward or backward?”
“Is it better to have payments or no payments?”
“Is it better to pay attention to the one in a hundred financial experts who tell you not to make accelerated mortgage payments, or is it better to pay attention to the 99 out of 100 who tell you to do this and live debt-free?”
This is a fascinating post for me, because I’m constantly discussing this particular point with others.
First, let me start by saying that each of my divorced parents (raised by their own Depression-era parents) scrimped and saved and worked and paid off their mortgages early.
Now they both own fairly valuable homes outright…and they have small investment portfolios, as this was the opportunity cost of paying down the mortgage early.
This concerns me because hundreds of thousands of dollars in the walls of their homes won’t generate them any income and, as a result, won’t support them in retirement or help them to afford high future medical bills (if they still want a place to live, that is). There’s simply no way to “get the money out,” as it were, except to take out a loan. The thing about loans, though, is that a loan isn’t a loan against your home–it’s a loan against your INCOME. Try going to your banker after losing your $100K/year job and saying, “I’d like a loan, but I don’t really have an income stream to pay it back…”
Economics teaches us that inflation is the debtor’s friend. If I borrow $1000 today, ten years from now, I’ll be repaying that $1000 with inflation-adjusted wages. Of course, it can be argued that lenders build this in when they offer a loan (i.e. interest rates), but I’d much rather still owe money I borrowed 10 or 20 years ago and have a healthy portfolio that has been compounding for all those years.
I was glad to see that Ric Edelman was mentioned. He wrote something that I’ve always remembered…a mortgage is the cheapest money you’ll ever buy. Not only are the interest rates generally low (and were ridiculously low several years ago), but the interest is tax-deductible. He points out that if one can earn 10% in the market, he’d gladly give 8% from his left pocket to earn 10% in his right.
I don’t currently have a mortgage, but I do have outstanding student loans, with a fixed interest rate less than 3%. I know many recent grads, like myself, who slave to pay these loans off so they can be “debt-free,” meanwhile missing out on the incredible opportunity to be investing that extra money and letting earnings compound. I plan take the full 30 years to pay back my student loans for the same reason why I won’t prepay my mortgage. At 3% interest, the money I borrowed is a steal. And 20 years from now, I doubt I’ll bat an eye at the monthly payment thanks to inflation, salary increases, promotions, and the fact that I have enough money in my portfolio to pay off those loans at any time.
All things being equal, I like the idea of using the money to purchase a rental unit. We currently have four units and have seen a marked change in the rental market as the bubble bursting effects of foreclosures are creating more renters who are willing to pay higher rents that are still less than their previous mortgages. But, and this is a big but, don’t ignore the part about putting extra cash into the purchase. The renter should pay your mortgage, taxes, insurance, and then some. If it doesn’t work out that way, then its just like any other long term investment - a risk.
Here are some thoughts from a Canadian perspective.
Up here, we aren’t able to deduct mortgage interest, so we have a bit of a disadvantage compared to our southern neighbors. We are, however, able to deduct interest paid on money borrowed to “invest.”
For any Canadian interested, I suggest taking a look at the Smith Manoeuvre. The basic principal is that you transfer your non-deductible interest (mortgage) to deductible interest (investments). This is done by having a dedicated line of credit, where you take out an amount from the credit line to invest in an amount equal to the principal you have paid down on your mortgage. At the end of each year, as you build up your investment portfolio, you will have paid more and more interest on the credit line, which gives you a tax refund (in theory - depending on your other tax situation). Take that tax refund and apply it to your mortgage. You eventually get the snowball effect - each year you will be able to put a larger and larger payment onto the principal of the mortgage.
Eventually, you will have taken the total principal amount of your mortgage and converted it equally to a balance in a line of credit, with the balance having been invested, and the added benefit of now owning your home much sooner.
At the end, one could then either start paying down the balance on the credit line, or could leave the balance intact so that the tax refunds continue to be generated.
For those of us who are self employed and don’t have the benefit of a company pension plan, it can be a way that we are able to invest more earlier on, while reducing our mortgage more quickly.
The hardest part that I’ve found so far is finding a bank that understands the concept and is willing to help out. It works best if you have a credit line that adds the monthly interest payments to its balance, instead of coming out of your chequing account. My banker suggested that we leave it as is, and then after the monthly interest payment comes out, take that amount back out of the credit line.
It’s a fairly simple concept, but can be a bit complicated to implement. One should definitely have a good financial planner and accountant to help with this - payments made to both are also tax deductible, of course
I haven’t yet started this myself, but will be soon. Our financial planner suggested that instead of waiting 5 - 7 years to find a larger house to start a family that we see if we could do it sooner. So we’ve just moved into a new, larger house. Now that we’re in here, we can start transferring our debt to the good kind - deductible.
For more reading on this concept, check out http://www.smithman.net - I’m not affiliated with them at all, just think that it’s a great idea for Canadians.
I actually think that its a better idea to invest the money. Assuming that there is already a real emergency fund. When I say better, I mean better for me of course. Eventually you’re going to pay the mortgage off anyway. Are you really going to invest the extra money you save in the payment?
This is different to borrowing extra cash against the equity in the house because there is other risk involved, specifically the risk that you will not be able to afford the higher mortgage repayments should you lose your job etc.
Great post!
I have been wrestling with this one for a long time, too…
I have chosen to split the difference and use my extra cash to partly fund the portfolio and partly fund paying off the mortgage early. I hope both turn out equally well. I like the 50-50 split so at least I am covered one way if either one falls through… I hope.
MGB
I’d also like to mention that Liz Pulliam Weston is indeed paying off her own mortgage early. She’s just gotten a few other things out of the way first, like an emergency fund and fully funded retirement accounts. But in her article “So You Want to be a Millionaire,” here is what she says about herself and her husband:
“We chose an old-fashioned, 30-year, fixed-rate mortgage because the low payments allowed us to invest more for retirement while still allowing us to gradually pay off our debt.”
What JD said is totally right on for me as well. I’m new in my mortgage, young, no family. I am in the probably the best possible situation to take that money and invest it, but I wouldn’t. Not because I’m risk averse. My retirement savings is almost 95% stocks (for now).
It’s because it’s debt. I hate debt, even good debt. I hate my mortage, I hate my student loans, and I really hate my credit cards. I am just guessing, but I would need at least 15% additional return. Not 15% return on my investment, but 15% additional return to the difference between market return and the dollar value of the saved 10 years of interest. That would mean I would need a garunteed investment return of 17-19%. Not likely to happen with any kind of consistency.
Like I said, it’s different because of what we are talking about. With my retirement savings I’m willing to gamble, but not gamble with using debt. Its 100% psychological, makes no sense. Its all because it’s someone else’s money I’m playing with. Which is why I will probably never take advantage of 0% interest credit cards. Even the 5-6% of savings accounts are way too low of a return for me to take more debt.
I’d always rather gamble with someone else’s money than my own!
Aaron and Rob bring up deduction of mortgage interest–Rob writes
I’m surprised no one else has mentioned this yet. Once you take into account the mortgage interest deduction, its almost crazy NOT to invest somewhere else
IMO the mortgage interest deduction is way overblown. If you run the numbers it only makes a big difference if you’re a single homeowner, or if you’ve got an enormous mortgage in the early years of amortization.
Remember that you only come out ahead if your itemized deductions are over the standard (last year, ca. $5k for single filers and $10K for married). So for married folks, $10K in mortgage interest has to leave your pocket for good before you start to see any (incremental) decrease in your taxes.
Single people have a lower threshhold. More power to you if you can afford to buy a house on your own in this day and age.
If your mortgage isn’t that big, the MI deduction is miniscule or none. If you’re more than a few years into the amortization curve, the MI deduction starts to rapidly diminish (unless you’ve got a massive, massive loan).
Not worth it.
FWIW, I’d rather pay down my mortgage. The projections on how investments are all “on paper”. Who knows how they’d actually turn out. The bill for my house comes every month, like clockwork, no hypotheticals about it.
One last thought, maybe one I’ve shared before. A friend of mine once quipped, “Buying a house is the American Dream. Paying off the mortgage is the American Fantasy.” Too true!
Wow. Great post. It’s interesting to see in one summary view many of the different opinions on the matter. I was struck by Suze Orman’s comments. You can’t live in your investments. I also thought she was spot on that paying down your mortgage gives you a guaranteed return on investment whereas investing is highly subject to the investment vehicle you choose.
I’m actually planning on conducting a very large experiment relating to paying off your mortgage in the near future. I’ll be posting about it next week. I’d love to get your feedback when I do.
I’m a young person and I have a long way to retirement. I’m fairly disciplined and believe that investing would be wiser. Clearly you net more money over the long run.
In our house, the discretionary savings gets allocated in this order:
1) 100% to emergency fund (until at least 3 months expenses)
2) 100% to pay off high-interest debt
3) 401K to point of company match
4) monthly contribution to a “big ticket fund”, which is savings for occasional large expenses, like semi-annual insurance, vacations, etc.
5) Roth IRA to contribution limit
6) 401K to contribution limit
7) remainder: 50% mortgage prepay and 50% taxable index fund
Dude! Do not refinance your house to invest the equity. Refinancing your house is not free, and the fees to refinance and the transaction costs associated with investing significantly cut into your returns. I would be surprised if you came out ahead in this scenario. Make sure you run the numbers carefully.
I don’t know if this was covered, but the article fails to note the effect of having your full mortgage payment to invest after your home is paid off. Sure, you may make a few bucks extra over what you “save” in mortgage interest, but having your full mortgage payment to dump into retirement is likely to very positively impact your retirement savings.
Some did note that investments are definitely not guaranteed. Paying off the mortgage is a sure thing - you will save interest. Investments have usually made money, but we could easily end up with many down years in response to the main up years until we return to the historical mean.
That said, the note on buying investment property and using a mortgage to fight inflation is not a bad idea.
http://www.lewrockwell.com/north/north532.html
Note the section Debtors and Creditors. He makes the argument that it would be better to buy investment real estate than to pay off your own home mortgage. I am not sure I completely agree, but it is an interesting argument.
Brad
I meant to say 50% mortgage “payment to principal”, not 50% mortgage “prepay”.
@20 Anne:
I couldn’t agree more. Paul needs a liquid emergency fund, and that is neither mortgage prepayment or equities.
@35 ThinkingMan:
It’s only a benefit to gamble with someone else’s money if you’re willing to abandon the debt when the investment goes sour.
One extra consideration is that mortgage rates fluctuate over time. If your rate is locked for the full term at a low rate, then it may make more sense to invest. However, here in Canada most mortgages have a 25 or 30 year amortization but a 5 year term. If you have a low interest rate now, odds are it will be higher when you have to renew your mortgage as the rate reverts to the mean.
Over the course of the whole 25 years, I would expect your mean interest rate to be fairly close to the historical mean, which is higher than most people are paying now. Therefor, it makes sense to use the mean interest rate in any calculations you do on prepayment vs investing. Right now it may make sense to invest because mortgage debt is cheap. However, it makes less sense if you run the numbers assuming a 1-2% higher mortgage rate over the full course of the mortgage.
Therefor, my personal choice would be to pay the mortgage down as fast as possible when interest rates are low, with the expectation that they won’t stay low. When interest rates rise, I’ll have to make higher payments anyway, but this way I’m paying more on the principle.
Also, I think anyone who would not consider leveraged investing on its own shouldn’t be using a home equity loan to fund investing, because it’s the same basic principle except now your house is on the line. If you do invest with leverage, then funding it with a mortgage may be a good idea since you can generally get a better interest rate.
Finally, those of you talking about the joy of having your house completely paid off are living in a different world. Us working stiffs are talking about the difference between having it paid off in 15 years vs 25. Whatever decision you make has to make sense now, not just when the mortgage is paid off, because a lot can happen in 15 years. For example, I would opt for a low monthly payment with the option to make extra payments or lump-sum payments ever year, rather than just getting a 15 year mortgage. When I lose my job (and I consider it pretty much a certainty that I will be laid off at some point in the next 15 years) I want my monthly burn rate as low as possible.
This is one of the most talked about subjects in personal finance. I like to focus on this statement:
“This seems like an easy choice, but it’s not. There’s no guarantee of a 9% return…”
I think it is an easy choice. Over the span of 26.5 years a return of better than 6% is very much guarenteed (if investing costs are kept down, and the investment is diversified, both things that the individual can control). The return is likely to be 8% or even 10%.
It’s also possible to deduct the interest on the mortgage from your taxes (for many people at least) and if you pay it off in advance, you lose that tax break.
In summary, the decision (as I see it) is basically between: Do I want 100% return of 4.5% (by paying off the mortgage and foregoing the tax benefits) or do I want 99.9999% return of 8-10%? I’ll take the later any day.
Put another way, if you don’t have confidence in the stock market return over the next 26 years, you should be putting your 401k and Roth IRAs in a 100% stable value fund. It’s the same thing, yet personal finance bloggers seem to think there’s a difference.
I like to keep it simple. Do I want to get rich quickly or do I want to get rich slowly.
If you want to get rich quickly, then pay off the mortgage fast, build up a cash reserve and be ready to spend that cash on investments such as stocks, business partnerships, joint ventures, capital investments or real estate.
If you want to get rich slowly, then capitalize on what ThinkingMan elluded too, compounding interest. Remember, it’s not just that you’re getting a better interest rate by investing [mutual funds for example], but you are earning interest on the interest. In the long run, this will far exceed the interest you pay on your mortgage.
So what it boils down to is what’s most important to you, get rich sooner or get rich later. Either way, you build wealth, it’s just a matter of when you want it.
I haven’t read all the replies carefully (there are a lot), so sorry if this is a repeat: RE DEDUCTIBILITY: ONLY the part over the standard deduction counts: you get the standard deduction in any case.
I paid off my house (8% loan, chose to pay off rather than refinance at lower rates) and I consider the money I’m not spending as my “bond income.”
My itemized deductions were only a few thousand over the standard deduction anyway.
That’s a point seldom mentioned.
@44 Lazy Man: Thanks for putting this so articulately. You’re spot on.
Simply directly comparing return and interest rates is naive. It’s not that simple. Having debt is a risk and it must be factored into any investment decision.
If you have a paid for house, and you ask most people with common sense if they would borrow against it, just to invest, the answer is no. That should give you an indication that it’s not simply comparing numbers.
Putting an entire emergency fund in stocks (even index funds) is not a good idea. IDuring a bear market, people are more likely to face the number one emergancy the fund is for: unemployment. It sounds like it might be a pretty large emergency fund though, so it wouldn’t be a terrible idea to invest part of it in stable index funds.
You may not be able to live in paper investments, but a house doesn’t pay for retirement. Unless you sell it, but then you can’t live it in.
Over the span of 26.5 years
Who says that the last 26.5 years were a good indicator of the next 26.5 years, or any future period of that length? That pretty much ignores all significant downturns except for a blip in the late 1980s and the tech crash in 2000. Normal stock history is a little less “up” all the time.
Brad
Oops, I forgot to turn that italics off.
Jason makes a good point that I had missed. How many of you would take a mortgage out on your house to invest? If you would, then paying it off early doesn’t make sense. If you wouldn’t, you should pay it off as quick as you can.
Brad
Like Jason said, the reason investing has higher returns is that the risk is higher. Investing with leverage always magnifies risk and returns. Taking out a mortgage to buy a house is, in and of itself, a form of leveraged investing. A person could, if they wanted, rent and save until they had enough money to buy with cash. That would be the lowest-risk approach.
The question is, how much risk are you comfortable with? If you invest in stocks you will probably come out ahead in the end. But you could also lose everything, including your house.
There is so much incorrect math in these comments… here are all of the factors you have to consider:
Mortgage:
-interest rate
-your tax rate (for after tax cost)
-if you qualify to itemize (and thus deduct) (will you have more than $10k worth of deductions if you are married?)
-other…
Investments:
-average rate of return you can earn, after tax and investment costs
-your tax rate
-tax rate on investments
-other…
Here’s how I see it, if you have a low interest rate (6.5% or less), do not prepay. Notice I did not immediately say invest. It depends on what you invest in. Stocks are not guaranteed. Tax-free bonds with a smaller return may do a bit better. I prefer liquidity. If you’ve got $50,000 “extra” equity in the house (versus $50,000 ’safe’ savings) it is much harder to pull it out. That equity isn’t going to pay off your mortgage like the liquid cash would.
I would much rather have $50,000 in cash in CDs or T-bills or Bonds than $50,000 equity. I’m not against paying off the house… but I think safe investments might even be a more safe choice than the ’sure thing’ of paying off the house.
Lots of random thoughts. Just my 2 cents.
Great post, and great discussion. I’ve been thinking about this a lot myself. Currently we round up our mortgage payment, so we’re paying an extra $90 a month to principal. Gotta go the kid (future 508 recipient) just got home.
I’d look at three factors that haven’t been mentioned, or have only been mentioned obliquely:
1.) How disciplined are you? That is, if you say to yourself that you’re going to put that extra $300 a month or so into an investment vehicle and keep it there, are you really going to do it? Because it’s a big pain in the tuchus to refinance it out of your house once it’s there. For some people, that’s a big deal. If you’re disciplined enough to do it, though, you will almost certainly make a lot more money with investments.
2.) Do you have any dreams of giving up your day job to pursue something non-remunerative (or speculatively remunerative)? If so, I’d definitely say pay down your house so you can get your fixed expenses as low as possible. Paying down would also give you a lot of collateral if you want to start a business. Those, to me, would probably be the two biggest compelling reasons to pay down.
3.) There’s probably no *wrong* answer here if you’ve planned well enough and been frugal enough to be in the position to be considering this dilemma. You can reasonably project a lot of your expenses into the future. Get good, portable long-term care and long-term disability insurance along with that emergency fund that you were presumably thinking about to be in the position to be making this choice in the first place. And then you can figure out what your expenses are and what they’re likely to be in the future. So long as you have enough, does it matter if you could’ve had more the other way?
I created a spreadsheet to perform a detailed analysis of the factors I think have to be considered. Feel free to have a look at the google doc or download the XLS to play with it yourself.
Forget about all the math for a second and consider all the CHOICES that suddenly open up to you once the house is paid off — you want to quit your cubicle job and try something else, maybe even something kinda crazy? Well, this is easier to do if there isn’t a house on the line. Let’s say all of a sudden your wife wants to be a stay-at-home mom. This could be doable now. Or how about this neat trick — with out a mortgage payment, you’ll have extra money each month, right? You could now buy another house and rent out the first one and use that rental money to help quickly pay off your 2nd house. Then you could use those 2 houses to quickly pay off the third … now you have a little real-estate empire that’s providing you w/ nice, steady streams of passive income.
GG Says: “…a house doesn’t pay for retirement.”
First, I been given to understand that it’s important to minimize monthly living expenses during retirement (which is easier if you don’t have mortgage payments.) This allows you use less of your savings and extend the time they have to grow.
And also, I’ve heard that there are ways to live off your house…”reverse mortgages”, similar to a HELOC, using the house as collateral instead of income. Yes? This makes it possible to use the investment in your house as a source of income even as you live in it.
But meanwhile, I vote with the risk-averse people. Investment returns in the _long term_ may be good, but in the short term they are risky, and for most people (perhaps all), employment income is also not guaranteed. So, unless you already independently wealthy or have excellent life/disability/unemployment insurance, getting out of debt–including your mortgage–is a good risk management strategy.
If/when we finish helping the kids through college, we will probably “invest” in both the matched 401K and paying down the mortgage.
I personally prefer to invest my excess funds in judgments that I purchase at a discount. I’ve bought one recently that yields 24.99% at face value for less than the payoff. It’s a first lien on a property with 80k equity above my lien. These are out there and easy to find with a little research. It’s a far better return than prepaying my mortgages (I’m also a landlord) and it’s also equity but just not in my home. Some of these can be purchased at a massive discount in the range of 5% of face value.
Post#44 by Lazy Man - nails it for me. Could not have said it better myself.
My current mortgage is around 5.75%. It’s actually lower than that when you consider that I get a tax break on much of that interest. So I can invest $1000 in my mortgage and get about 4.5% return on it, or I can put that $1000 in an index fund and get around 7 to 8% post tax on it. Plus the money in the fund is a lot more liquid and accessible. Seems like an obvious choice to me.
Gal
OK, I promise not to get overly into this discussion. I do think there is a bigger benefit to accelerating your mortgage payment even slightly so that it is paid off more quickly, so long as doing so doesn’t sacrifice other retirement savings.
However, I wanted to touch on reverse mortgages since somebody just mentioned them. These are the latest horrible scam. A reverse mortgage is exactly what it sounds like — you take a property you already own and re-mortgage it back to the bank, bit by bit. So you end up with cash in hand, but in return the bank now holds that part of your property again.
The problem with this is that when you want to sell the property (say, to enter a nursing home) or when you die, you or your estate will have to REPAY the bank whatever amount of the home you reverse mortgaged.
As far as I’m concerned, reverse mortgages are a part of the plan for those who have failed to produce a real plan (e.g., liquid cash) for their retirement.
DB
P.S. — JD, IMHO you are way better off leaving your $100K in equity alone and finding other money to invest.
DB
I meant to make this point in #44 above, but Paul summed up a very important point, “If I plonk down this entire lump sum on my mortgage right now, it takes ten years off the loan, but it means I have no emergency fund.”
If Paul pays off a chunk of that mortgage and loses his job the next day, he risks not being able to make the mortgage payments and losing his home. Sure he could get a HELOC (before he loses his job, after, he wouldn’t qualify), but he’d end up paying 8% a month on that sum instead of making 4-5% (by going the investing route).
However, if he invests this sum of money, he’ll still have access to it. Even if Paul loses his job and his diversified portfolio drops 50% (pretty rare, especially if he was diversified internationally), he can use the rest of the sum of money to continue to make payments on the home and put food in his mouth while he gets back on his feet and recovers.
In this case, it’s actually less risky to invest the money.
JD, if you could get that 100K out without paying interest on it to invest, then I think you should do it. Unfortunately, that’s nearly impossible to do. You’ll generally have to get a HELOC, in which case, you pay 8% to make 8%. However, if you are moving, you might be able to get access to that 100K by pocketing from the sale of your old home and only putting 20% down on the new home to avoid PMI.
#57 by Dave is exactly why I will be paying off mine as fast as possible.
I don’t have the patience to wait around for 30 years on a stock or mutual fund nor the desire to keep my day job for that long.
I’d much rather be sipping a cold drink on a sunny beach somewhere and collecting passive income.
[...] Is It Better to Invest or to Prepay a Mortgage? at Get Rich Slowly [...]
#57 Dave, and #65 Paul - If you can make 8-10% on the same money that you’d put in your home you’d be able to pay off your home much sooner. By making payments early you may be able to cut a 30 year mortage to 20 years, but by investing it (assuming the higher rate), you’ll realize that in year 15 you’ll have enough value to pay off your home if you wish.
It’s nice to not have a mortgage payment, but 30 years of 8-10% growth buys a lot of passive income as well. You could then put it in a bank earning just 4% or you could use it to buy that real estate empire.
I didn’t read through all the comments, but I got far enough down to recognize that something obvious was not being discussed, and too often it is forgotten….
If you pay off a mortgage, you now have whatever that monthly payment was in your pocket. If you pay off the mortgage and take the $1,200.00 a month (or whatever) and invest it (even half of it) - you’ve got the best of both worlds.
Lazy man — I’m talking about paying a house off in 10, 12, 13 years kind of thing, not 20. Read Dave Ramsey for how this can be done. My house will be paid off in less than 5 years from now, and I will have only had it for around 12 years. Also, I’m not really talking about getting rich here, only financially free. For example, my wife and I will probably move into a slightly nicer/bigger house once our current home is paid off, then we will rent out our current home. We will once again work like mad demons (also using the rent money from the first house) to pay off the second house in say 7 years. At that point, my wife and I would technically be financially free in the sense that if we were, God forbid, both outta work or whatever, we would have enough passive income in the form of rent money from our first house to at least equal basic spending requirements. It’s really not that hard to achieve *this level* of financial freedom. And, of course, all the while we will have kept up on our index fund investing.
I read most of the replies but not all. If I was in that position I would not pay it off. I am young, with no dependents and therefore I need to be more aggressive.
The interest rate that he has is really low. You’re borrowing the money at under 6%, which is less after deductions. I would just take that money and invest it monthly into an index fund or something more diversified.
After 10,20 years chances are your net worth is higher than if you just paid off the house. Just depends on situation.
Hi,
Paul here, the original poster. I haven’t read through all the
responses to this question yet, but so far, I’m very impressed with
all the discussion.
To clear some questions up that I’ve seen so far:
- I did not pull out the money with the intention of investing it.
The money was pulled out in order to build an addition. There was
a significant amount of money left over, and it is this money which
I’m thinking about investing.
- The total amount time it takes of the 30 year mortgage is 10 years.
- The total amount of interest saved in today’s dollars is ~$3,000.00
My wife is currently no working, but has plans to return to work once
the kids are all in school. At that time, chances are, her entire
salary will go towards paying down the mortagage. At that time, given
a conservative salary for her, we’ll be able to pay down the mortgage
in 5-7 years. Which means, in my opinion, taking the 10 years off
now, and taking the $3000.00 savings in interest payments isn’t a big win.
Also, from the psychological aspect, taking $3,000 off of my overall
mortgage doesn’t do much for me. Investing this money in the long run
and being able to use it for buying a summer home in 10-15 years,
that’s a psychological boost
Thanks again, everyone, this has been (and continues to be) an
interesting discussion!
Paul
Risk, risk, risk. You put your money in something risky enough to get the 9%, which is great in a LONG TERM investment, but you end up needing the money for an emergency, it isn’t there because it has lost principle in the SHORT TERM, and you don’t have any equity in your house to use, and you lose it. Just read the business bankruptcy in wikipedia and how well using the equity of real estate for his investments (in more real estate, but still, he supposedly knows what he’s doing in real estate…)
Actually, based on the information given, neither paying down the mortgage nor investing the money is a good idea. Before taking either of these step, you should prepare for the unexpected; this means having a cash reserve/emergency fund. Stocks are generally considered inappropriate for such a fund.
Also, to answer the question about doing a cash-out refinance and investing the money, while it might make sense mathematically (depending on your assumptions for return, interest rate, and taxes), it’s actually illegal, and any ethical stockbroker should tell you so. This kind of borrowing was one of the problems that lead to the Great Depression (or worsened it, depending on your reading of history). Also, because you can borrow against investments (margin), doing this could lead you to be more leveraged than margin laws allow.
Even if the debt and the investment were both at 5.25% rate, and you start out with the same principal for both the debt and the investment. The investment beats the debt hands down. 100k at 5.25% returns in an investment gives you 381,417.51 in interest over thirty years. The interest on 100k debt at 5.25% for thirty years is only 98793.33. Even if you pay off your mortgage right this instance, the most amount you can save is 98793.33. Compare that to 381,417.51 that you could be earning. If you don’t believ it, use the rule of 72. An investment at 5.25% will double twice in thirty years. 100k will double to 200k and the 200k will double again to 400k. 100k is your principal. Interest earned is around 300k. But for a debt at 5%, it takes about thirty years for the total amount that you have paid to double. The investment only needs to be around 2.3% to surpass a debt at 5.25%. Crunch the numbers.
Lazy Man has said it twice:
There’s nothing to stop you investing the money and then when it reaches the balance of the mortgage (or you need to reduce the payments drastically), paying the mortgage off at that point.
And also if you believe the stockmarket is a poor place to invest in over a long time period, why would you use it for your retirement accounts?
Hi,
Paul here again. Someone mentioned not having equity in my house and
this being an extremely risky proposition. My current mortgage
balance is less than half of what the house is worth. So, my equity
in the house, were I to sell it right now, even in the current market
would be > %50 of the selling price.
Also, as mentioned, the amount this money represents in interest not
paid is about $3000.00, and reduces the mortgage only by 10 years,
leaving still another 16 years on the mortgage. And also, as
mentioned in my previous post, my wife is planning on returning to
work within the next 5 years. From the point at which she returns to
work, using her salary to pay the mortgage (after all 401(k) and IRA
contributions), the time it will take to pay off the mortgage is less
than 7 years. So, she would have to not return to work for about
another 9 years for the time to pay off the mortgage to be equal to
the time when the mortgage is paid off if I pay it down now rather
than invest.
Thanks again for all the input, this is a very educational discussion!
Paul
Ordinary people can create great wealth when they OWN their homes. By keeping your current mortgage and shortening the lenght of the time you have to pay on it, will eliminate paying interest and keep your hard earned money in your pocket. If you did not have a house payment you would use those funds for investment, also you can use the equity in your home for other investment purchases.See how this works at http://www.U1stfinancial.net/keyworth
I did not pull out the money with the intention of investing it.
If you invest that money it will be just as if you did take that money out to invest. If your intention was not to take money out for any purpose than the addition, any extra money should go back on the principle.
The idea that money not put to prepay is the same as taking out money from a paid off house is quite valid. That is the root of the decision. Many here would seem to gladly take out the money invest it. It is possible they don’t realize this is what they are doing, but that is the root of it.
Brad
I would invest surplus income, using [some of] the income to service an interest only loan to buy dividend paying stocks.
In Australia mortgage interest is not deductible, the dividends make the investment loan deductible.
There are a lot of posts and I might have missed this point if it has already been brought up, when I skimmed though them…But I think the mortgage deduction is definetly over-rated.
When you pay $15k a year in mortgage interest, you do not get $15k off of your taxes, just $15k off of your AGI.
It is almost like me saying, “If you pay me $15k, I will give you a refund of $9k back”. Sound like a good deal?
That being said, I am more than happy to deduct my mortgage interest, but I would feel much better paying off my mortgage early than major investing before hand.
Post #69 talked about putting massive amounts of investment into just two non-liquid investments (houses) to gain financial freedom. Yes, this could be done. The most important part of the post was the last sentence however: “And, of course, all the while we will have kept up on our index fund investing.”
Not diversifying like this would make the housing-all-or-nothing strategy extremely risky (IMO), even when applied to the long term as in this case. (How many happy homeowners do you know with two houses in New Orleans?)
Is it better to invest or pay off your mortgage early?…
There’s a huge discussion happening both on Lifehacker and Get Rich Slowly regarding the pros and cons of paying off a mortgage early. Contrary to my own assumptions, the numbers (assuming current interest rates around 6%) seem to strongly……
[...] that he doesn’t have to worry about buying a home, he can invest his money rather than paying down a mortgage [Get Rich [...]
Is it better to invest or pay off your mortgage early?…
There’s a huge discussion happening both on Lifehacker and Get Rich Sl……
[...] Is It Better to Invest or Prepaid a Mortgage? from Get Rich Slowly [...]
Here’s my thought process on the matter:
The first math I did on this was to come up with a number I think of as the effective mortgage interest rate. I did that by looking up the 2006 tax rates, which tell me “25% of the amount over 30,650″
So if that interest rate is tax deductible and the poster earns, say, 60k a year and otherwise gets 5k in deductions that means changing his taxable income downwards from $55,000. So $1,000 in interest paid that year means not paying tax on the money from $54,000 to $55,000 which is taxed at 25%.
So I take 5.375 * ((100 - 25) / 100) and get a rate of 4.03125%
This is predicated on the poster earning a taxable income above 30,650. Below that point I’d get an effective rate of 5.375 * ((100 - 15) / 100) = 4.56875%
Personally I’m a big fan of mortgage pre-payment (assuming an emergency fund and retirement savings) since I like the idea of flexibility and options. However I think this is a slam dunk choice of keep the money invested.
Look at how many banks have simple savings account rates better than 4%! That’s FDIC insured no-chance-of-losing-a-dime return rates, something you can’t say with a home that’s subject to a variable housing market.
In the poster’s shoes I’d put 3 to 12 months of mortgage payments in the savings account and the rest in index funds. Or possibly even use it to offset income and max out my 401k to the $15,000 limit for the year.
Anyone that has mentioned that paying off your mortgage equals financial freedom is wrong, IMHO. A $5 million pile of retirement money is financial freedom. You give yourself the best chance possible to reach $5 million (or whatever a big pile of money is to you) by saving the maximum amount possible, starting at the earliest date possible.
You are not free once you own your house. Far from it!
Q - Except that retirement money has a GUARANTEED early withdraw penalty if you’re in a 401k or IRA. Selling your house may have a cost but on a fully paid off home it’s almost certainly not the 10% penalty for a 401k.
Don - you should not make early withdrawals from your retirement accounts. And not only because there are penalties - one should let that money grow for as long as possible.
My point is that owning your home doesn’t set you free. You have to have enough liquid assets for retirement. People underestimate how much they’ll need for retirement. Right now you’re sitting in an office (at least I am!), doing nothing but work. Not a great deal to do other than just work till dusk. But if I were retired, would I just sit around? Or would I be engaged in some fun, money-expending activity? People often underestimate how much money it’s going to take to not only survive, but stay interested in life.
Do not use your house as a vehicle to drive into retirement. Use that fat brokerage account instead!
Don> So if that interest rate is tax deductible and
Don> the poster earns, say, 60k a year and
Don> otherwise gets 5k in deductions that means
Don> changing his taxable income downwards from
Don> $55,000. So $1,000 in interest paid that year
Don> means not paying tax on the money from $54,000
Don> to $55,000 which is taxed at 25%.
Don> So I take 5.375 * ((100 - 25) / 100) and get a
Don> rate of 4.03125%
Can you please explain to me how you arrived at this? I understand the 25% from the tax-table lookup, but how does that figure into the formula used to calculate the effective interest rate of 4.03125% ?
Are you saying that the formula is actually:
InterestRate * ((100 - TaxRate)/100)
And if that’s the case, are you further saying that:
TaxableIncome = Gross - MiscDeductions - MortgageInterest
?
I’m having trouble understanding how you made the leap from $55K after deductions to $54K. $1000 deduction in paid mortgage interest isn’t the same as being taxed on $1000 less income, is it?
Thanks,
Paul
Paul,
If you itemize on your taxes, and you incrementally add $1,000 in paid mortgage interest, you are then taxed on $1,000 less income.
Paul, I am coming up with that 4% as a reflection of the actual number of dollars paid. If you pay 5% interest on the loan but it gets you a tax break equal to 1% then that’s an effective rate of 4%
Q answered the second question. People throw around the “you can deduct the interest!” so much that I feel it important to point out that exactly what this saves you is highly dependent on your income and the top of your tax bracket.
Q,
Are you saying that $1000 paid in interest really *is* the same as a $1000 deduction?
If you’ve got time, don’t prepay your mortgage. Invest the extree in index funds like the SPY and DIA. Cheers.
Yes, mortgage interest paid is a tax deduction, as long as you itemize.
That’s why, when comparing prepaying on your mortgage to investing, you have to run the numbers. To do so, you need the following info:
Your mortgage interest rate
Your tax rate
Your expected rate of return on investments
The location of those investments (in taxable accounts or retirement accounts)
Run the numbers side by side. Investing will likely beat prepaying by several percentage points, which would mean that investing is a better use of your money.
[...] The last one is a little different for some though, at least for certain debts. Some are just fine with a little — or, more likely, a lot — of debt if it’s on your house. Or your student loans. Good debts. Debts on assets that earn. [...]
[...]Get Rich Slowly asked “Is it better to invest or to prepay a mortgage?”[...]
generally speaking mortgage interest and taxes are deductible on your primary residence, but what are the arguments for prepaying on a rental?
Several people have noted that the effective interest rate on a mortgage is lower than the quoted rate due to the tax deduction on mortgage interest. Very true, and it definitely lowers the appeal of paying down a mortgage rather than investing.
What I haven’t seen is the even bigger benefit investing it can bring: if you invest via your 401-K you are investing with PRE-TAX DOLLARS. You pay down your mortgage with AFTER-TAX DOLLARS.
As long as you have a good fixed-rate mortgage, invest in your 401-K. The advantage of investing tax-deferred makes it a much better move than paying down the mortgage.
I think that either paying down the home mortgage (I’ve done some extra paying on my home mortgage) OR investing (I’ve done some Roth contributions also) is just fine. The people who lose are the ones that don’t do either of these options which would indicate that they are uneducated on the subject or living above their means…
[...] ask the readers: is it better to invest or prepay the mortgage @ get rich slowly does exactly what it says on the tin, scroll down and read the comments [...]
[...] Ask the Readers: Is It Better to Invest or to Prepay a Mortgage? (tags: finance mortgage investing) [...]
[...] Is It Better to Invest or to Prepay a Mortgage? at Get Rich Slowly [...]
I’m prepaying (vs investing), here’s why:
1. My job isn’t 100% secure. The earlier I can be free & clear, the more choices I will have when I’m pounding the pavement. It will also reduce my chances of foreclosure.
2. What if I wanted a complete career change later? We go through 4-5 career changes in our modern lives, not every career progression is a salary progression.
3. If the math works so well for investing, why buy a house at all? Rent cheap (or take an interest only mortgage, drive a $500 car and invest the rest in the stock market, you’ll net out better than everyone else. There’s pride in owning a house, there’s pride in driving a decent car… that’s all psychological.
4. Why are banks lending us money to buy houses, when they can put 100% focus on stocks? They should get a better return, right? Who cares about diversification, why should banks get 5% on mortgages and 7% on stocks when they can get a full 7% on stocks only? They too, are risk-averse and believe in diversification. And us complying to a 30-year mortgage is merely optimizing their mortgage return.
5. Being free & clear, I’ll have extra $$ (and stomach) to more aggressively invest in the stock market, generating returns better than 7%. And if not, I will still have a roof over my head.
6. Guaranteed return of for a short-term 15 years (or whatever the accelerated mortgage life is). In the stock market, a low-risk 7%-10% return is based on a 25-30 year period, not 15.
So my takeaway is this: for the rational risk-takers: rent & live frugally & invest all into the stock market. For the emotional risk-averse: accelerate your debt payments to become 100% debt-free. And for everybody else: make sure you have an emergency fund and take advantage of company matches before you choose something in between.
[...] this month we debated whether it’s better to invest or to prepay a mortgage. Mathematically it makes more sense to invest, but from a psychological perspective, prepaying a [...]
I’m in this boat. My boyfriend and I both have homes. He has $55k mortgage on a house now valued between $150 and $180k. I have a house with a $95k mortgage valued between $160 and $180 also. If we sell his house, mine would almost be paid for. We have about $20k in savings but that will need to go to my house to make it livable (let’s just say it needs new everything as it was cobbled together). We’re pretty good at redoing homes as he is actually very competent.
Sooo, if I didn’t pay off the mortgage upon the sale of his house, we could invest it in his education to be a papered engineer (degree, he is really super bright but didn’t finish college). At 5 2/8 interest it would be a cheap way to ensure financing his education….
On the other hand, if there were no mortgage, I would be a little more free to quit my job to try to find one in teaching (which is horrifically competitive and I’m very conservative in finding jobs in fields that are full).
Ugh, it is a tough decision. Fortunately we have about a year to figure it out.
[...] June 1st: Ask the readers: Is it better to invest or to prepay a mortgage? [...]
[...] Is It Better to Invest or Prepaid a Mortgage? from Get Rich Slowly [...]
[...] Finance: How to Save Big on Your Mortgage In June, we discussed whether it’s best to invest or to prepay a mortgage. At Yahoo!, columnist David Bach writes: “In my 9 years of experience as a financial advisor [...]
Hi JD,
Really enjoyed this post and wanted to let you know that I blogged on it over at teaspoonfinance.com: Great Finance Blog Post - Ask the Readers: Is It Better to Invest or to Prepay a Mortgage? I’ve been a big fan of Ric Edelman for a long time. I love the way he drives home the change for keeping the big mortgage and investing rather than paying off principal. great post!
Teaspoon
As a public university employee in a state where pay is low across the board, I bring home just enough to live on. . .with no mortgage or rent. When I bought my house, I used the fee from a ghostwriting contract to make the down payment & ended up with an $80,000 mortgage–pretty low, in today’s terms. At that time I had $24,000 worth of alimony coming in, plus a modest salary–slightly above the state’s median income, which is breathtakingly low.
One day, a year or two before the alimony was due to end, I realized that the mortgage payment was more than half my salary. While my S.O. was living with me, he paid rent that I put toward the mortgage, defraying my costs and making maintenance & upgrades deductible. But when he bought his own place in the neighborhood, that arrangement disappeared and I was just making ends meet after I paid the mortgage and set aside enough to pay taxes on the alimony. Clearly, once the alimony ended, I would not be able to get by unless I changed my lifestyle from frugal to miserly.
Using some cash from an inheritance plus a couple of years of tax refunds, I paid off the mortgage in one swell foop.
Now I have ALL of my salary to live on, and there’s enough to invest in a Roth IRA and nondeferred mutual funds. When you own your house, you pay the taxes & insurance once a year, instead of monthly through your lender. So, the $350 I set aside each month from my salary for those bills goes into a high-interest savings account, where it earns a few dollars during the year that it accrues before being forked over to the government and the insurance company.
I bought the house about 12 years ago for 100 grand, & I’ve put about $60,000 into it. It’s now worth $325,000 to $350,000. When I retire–which I could do today, if I felt so inclined–I can purchase a house for $250,000 to $285,000 in a nearby retirement community. If I clear $325,000 on the sale of this house and buy a smaller house, newer house in a nicer, safer, and quieter neighborhood in said retirement community for $275,000, I walk with $50,000 to put back into retirement savings, negligible tax & insurance payments, and no mortgage bills.
I could not live on what I earn if I had to pay a mortgage. I would have a hard time living on my salary if I had to pay upwards of a thousand bucks a month in rent. So…was it better to keep the cash in mutual funds or to tie it up in the house?
Tho’ the money may not be earning as much as it would in the stock market and tho’ it’s illiquid, paying off the mortgage lets me put food on the table and clothes on my back. To my mind, that is a return on investment that’s worth quite a lot.
Interesting discussion, but I believe one factor is missing, which is the buying versus rent analysis. In just having (almost) sold our house and going to renting for a while, I can tell you that home ownership isn’t always the best investment choice. What is missing in the analysis is whether your home is in an increasing market or declining market and what is the equivalent rental prices for your area? If one can rent a place for $500 to $1000 less than they pay to purchase, this money can be invested (or pay down debt) and it is more liquid than trying to get money out of a home when a financial situation arises. So, what I would like to see in the equation is also factors considering liquidity of a house and mortgage price per square foot versus rental prices per square foot. This would better help make the decision on whether to pay down the mortgage. In our home sale, the commissions, excise taxes, and other sale costs amount to about 8% of the price of the home. Add to this 1% improvements that had to be made to get the home in sale condition, and a drop of 1% from original sale price, which was set at the previous market rate for the home, one needed to factor in the fact that your home’s value is really only 90% of its current “price.”
Can anyone provide additional factors to the equation to account for my question (i.e., how to factor in rental rates into the decision process)?
This also reminds me of another idea, should one stay in their home or rent it out? This would be a decision for the family looking to move up or the couple looking to scale down. One should not assume they will necessarily live in the same house. One may not have enough square footage for their needs, or have more than enough square footage.
Consider that keeping a roof over your head is a necessary cost of living, independent of investing. Rent is the market price of a roof-over-head.
Owning a house comes with a fringe benefit - free ‘roof-over-head’. To factor this into cost/benefit simple deduct the value of rent (that you would otherwise pay) from the cost of owning the house.
I am using Banks money and living in my house for free. My house is worth 1.5M.
I have mortgage 150K (cheap money) with 10 yr 3.75% fixed, 7 yrs left. I took HELO 700K and invested. My mo check pays mortgage,prop.tax,insurance,utility,phone,
car and ++cash……..Is it OK or not?
[...] Get Rich Slowly, Ask the Readers: Is It Better to Invest or to Prepay a Mortgage? [...]
I’ve been thinking of using http://www.mortgagecheckingaccount.com/ to organize a bi weekly mortgage payment strategy. I know there are cheaper budgeting systems available but feel like I need some form of organized budgeting to stick with a payoff plan.
Thank you for the great discussion! I googled this issue and found this gold. It covers all my concerns, and it helps to know there is no one definitive answer for everyone.
I lean toward the Dave Ramsey model myself — first make sure I’m funding my retirement, then put extra money into my mortgage. Like another commenter, I’m in sales, which does not have the same stability as other careers. It will be a huge relief to me when I’m able to pay off my mortgage, but I don’t want to short-change my retirement and its growth over the next 20-30 years.
[...] Is it better to invest or to prepay a mortgage? [...]
[...] Is it better to invest or to prepay a mortgage? [...]
There’s nothing like having a nice house and no debt. It gives you immense security and the ability to withstand unforseen events. I lost my job when the dot com bubble burst and was telecommuting from Lake Tahoe. Needless to say, high-paying jobs were non-existent locally and moving back to the San Francisco Bay Area was the last thing I wanted to do. Being totally debt-free with a year of emergency cash on hand gave me the option of finding another way to earn a living without giving up my home or moving.
Another issue might be a major illness — if worse comes to worse, you can get Medical without giving up your house, but you’d have to liquidate your investments before the government would step in to help.
Suze Orman paid off her house & Dr. Phil said when he moved from TX to CA, he bought his house with cash. I respect those 2 people. I paid off mine. Values probably come into play. Saving money and paying off debts are some of my most important values, while for others they might not be as important. It feels like a big weight has been lifted off of me. It really is immensely satisfying. I have peace of mind and a sense of freedom, and I’m sure the reduced stress will continue to have a positive effect on my health too.
I’m going through this very dilemma myself, I just bought a house and have a good chunk of available change for use as I see fit.
So far I have it sitting in CDs (tiered) while I decide. Based on what I’ve read above and elsewhere, I’m going to do it all. What?
I’m going to prepay a bit of my mortgage now, nothing major at all. But (!), 30 years of interest (or lack thereof actually) can really make a difference. Of course, prepayment assumes you are going to live in the house for a long time. If you’re going to sell prior to payoff, then prepayment is not a great option.
But I’ll also be investing waaaaay more than I prepay. Odds are low I’ll be here in 30 years, so I can do better than my 6.2% interest rate elsewhere given the odds.
[...] to note, the purpose of this post isn’t to debate whether or not paying off all debt is a good idea (versus only making mortgage payments and [...]
[...] and I will strive to repay our mortgage early. Though we’re aware of the drawbacks to prepaying our mortgage, it’s something we both want to do. We sat down tonight and drafted a plan, which I’ll [...]
ANYTHING THAT COSTS INTEREST LIKE A MORTGAGE, IS ALWAYS BEST TO GET RID OF
(BANK BALANCE) AND MONEY ANYWHERE ELSE WILL ONLY COST YOU MORE BECAUSE BORROWING ALWAYS WILL AND HAS ALWAYS COST YOU MORE, INTEREST FROM BANKS ETC IS ALWAYS LESS. NEVER SAVE IF YOU INCURR INTEREST ANYWHERE ELSE. PAY THE DEBT OFF FIRST, THEN SAVE.
AT 47 MORTGAGE FREE, I HAVE MORE DISPOSABLE INCOME, WE BOUGHT A TIMESHARE IN FLORIDA WITH BLUEGREEN, ON SOUTH INTERNATIONAL DRIVE PAID IT OFF THEY WANTED, TO CHARGE US OVER TEN YEARS NEARLY DOUBLE WHAT WE PAID. WE PAID 27,2 DOLLARS THEY WANTED NEARLY 50, THOUSAND, NO WONDER YOU HAVE THE FORECLOSURES YOU ARE SUFFERING. FORCE THESE THEIVING BANKS AND MORTGAGE COMPANIES TO GIVE YOU A BETTER RATE. DON’T PAY WHAT THEY TELL YOU, YOU TELL THEM WHAT YOUR PREPARED TO PAY, DRIVE THE PRICE DOWN, NOT UP.
NEVER BUY ANYTHING IN THE FIRST STORE YOU LOOK IN, ALWAYS SHOP AROUND, WEIGH UP ALL THE OPTIONS, PAYING THE TOP PRICE IS NOT ALWAYS THE BEST PRICE/VALUE, FIND OUT ALL SENARIO’S, ALWAYS SHOP IN COSTCO, THEY HAVE A LIFETIME GUARANTEE ON ELECTRICALS, YES PAY THE YEARLY FEE, YOU CAN GET THAT BACK ON SAVINGS MADE ON YOUR FIRST VISIT.
DAVE VERMIGLIO.
LIVERPOOL, MERSEYSIDE,
ENGLAND
I’d say the “right” financial decision is the one that gives the home owner peace of mind.
Risk is a part of finances, life, and decision-making.
But…who says you’ve got to go with 100% of either choice.
If you really want to enjoy the benefits of a mortgage and the index fund, then it’s also a possiblity to enjoy the benefits of both.
You would simply take one portion of the funds and invest back into the mortgage and the other portion to invest in the index fund.
That way, your diversifying your approach and spreading out your risk.
Most investments, over time, incur risk, so run the numbers and go with the investment choice that gives you a sense of peace.
I am not sure if anyone has mentioned this yet (this question seems to have sparked a lot of comments) but it depends also on how long you are going to stay in your home. if you are for sure going to stay for the full 30 years, then sure, investing would probably be a better option. but in reality, most americans move every 5-7 years. with that you have to take into account something called the “effective interest rate” which is the interest rate you are actually paying at the time you move. This changes because on a mortgage all of the interest is paid at the begginning and gradually decreases. so if you stay in your home for the full 30 years, you really will pay just 5% interest which is great, but if you move after 5 years you are actually paying an effective rate of over 100% interest. this is because over the 5 years you paid in x amount of dollars but not all of that went to principle. only a small part of it went to principle. so if you plan on moving before your 30 year term you will have to find an investment with over 100% interest to make it worth your money not to pay down the mortgage.
again, maybe this concept has already been mentioned, but that is why it would be odd to take out a 2nd mortgage and invest it in stocks or bonds. unless you are staying in that house for a long long time, it really would be ridiculous.
It seems like a lot of readers are leaving out one of the most important things to consider: interest on mortgage is tax deductible, and because individuals’ tax situations differ, there’s no “common formula” that works for everyone.
In general, paying down a mortgate with money that could be invested is not a good long-term decision, but to some people, I guess that instant gratification of being debt-free is too difficult to turn down.
[...] a great article over at getrichslowly.org that lets financial giants weigh in. The author of the blog researched respected financial [...]
Invest in stocks with “A” ratings, when they have gone to the low end of their analyst prescribed range. I’ve prepaid several of my homes, and this time around, find that I do better in the stock market than the 6-7% I pay on my mortgage.
Investing in the stock market also forces you to think differently, and to learn, since you should perform due diligence on companies you invest in. It’s a personal growth versus comfort issue.
Great blog J.D. and a great discussion on this topic. In my opinion, paying down the mortgage is the better option, without a doubt. Here’s a few reasons why:
1. Is it better to invest in the market than prepaying the mortgage? Think about it. If you can make 10% in the market and have a 7% mortgage, you’re coming out ahead, right? Well, not really. The stock market, especially now, is anything but a guaranteed return. Plus, whether it’s in a 401k or any other investment vehicle, you have to pay taxes, whether it be now or later. And if it’s later, while you might be in a lower tax bracket, chances are taxes will be higher too. So while some have argued that the effective interest rate is lower on your mortgage due to the taxes and interest being deductible, so is one’s return on investing because of paying taxes on their investments. Prepaying a mortgage is 100% tax free and is a guaranteed return on investment.
2. Why prepay a mortgage? I’ll lose that tax deduction! That’s just it, it’s a deduction, not a tax credit. Meaning that the interest you pay is deducted from your gross income that you pay taxes on. So if you are in a 28% tax bracket, for every $1 in interest you are paying the bank, you are getting 28 cents back. Personally, I would much rather pay the IRS 28 cents and keep 72 cents in my pocket any day.
3. Why pay off your mortgage when your interest rate is so low? That low interest rate is back-loaded, as anyone who has a mortgage surely knows. If you have a 30 year mortgage, you probably have an effective rate of 88% that first year and a 75% interest rate after the 10th year. Don’t believe me? Check your mortgage statement and see how much interest you are paying compared to principal. Yes, it eventually evens out over time. But if you have refinanced, you just reset the clock and you’re back to that 88% mortgage. And if you sell your house and move into another, you will NEVER have that 7% mortgage (or whatever your interest rate is).
4. Better financial return. Take 2 people, both with $1500 mortgage payments. One pays their mortgage off in 30 years while investing $100 week in his 401k consistently during the same period. The other paid off their mortgage 20 years early and did not invest anything into their 401k during this time but invested that $1500 every month for the next 20 years plus $100 per week into their 401k.
After 30 years, assuming a 10% annual return, the first person has finally paid off their house and has $940,906 in their 401k. Not bad. What about the second person? In that same period, they will have $1,461,658!
While it’s true that the first person was able to deduct their interest on their taxes for 20 years longer than the first person, the first person also invested $52,000 more than the second because they were putting in $100/week for 10 years while the second person wasn’t. Oh yeah, and the second person has an additional 500 grand…not too shabby.
5. Freedom. Perhaps the best reason of all. Quite simply, if you don’t have that $1000 or $1500 (or more) mortgage payment every month, what choices do you then have? You are not a slave to any job, you can work where you want, when you want for the most part, and still be fine financially. Yes, you still have taxes and bills, but who doesn’t? By paying off your mortgage early, you are truly your own boss and are downsize proof.
For Dave(previous comment)
I am a little confused by your comparison of the two people. In order for the second person to pay of their mortgage in 10 years, they must pre-pay a whole lot more than 100$ per month for the term of their mortgage. They can’t accumulate an extra 500 grand as easily as you made it sound. If I misunderstood, please correct me on this.
Well, the person not prepaying their mortgage is investing $100/week in their 401k, not $100/month. It is true, I did not consider how much the other person would prepay into the calculations. So I figured I would check how hard it would be myself.
I used a $150,000 balance on a 30-year mortgage at 7%, if the other person paid the same $100/week extra, they would actually eliminate their mortgage in less than 10 years (104 months to be exact). This person would also save about $150,000 in interest over the life of the loan. This would also give them an additional 16 months to invest this extra money, which means more in the long run.
Obviously, this is going to vary based on things like interest rate, balance on the mortgage and how much time left on the mortgage, but you get the idea.
This is not a black and white choice. Without knowing an individual’s situation, a lot of details, it can go either way.
The credit card debt needs to go first. That’s obvious, but I’ve helped people who told me the $100 now saves $1000 in 30 years on the mortgage, that’s 1000%! And the credit card is ‘only 20%!’ You can see how this is nonsense.
Many have a 401(k) that offers a company match. That’s free money, often dollar for dollar. This should come even before an emergency account, as the 401(k) $1 will cost 75 cents to put in, and be $2 after a match. If you lose your job, even after tax and penalty, you are ahead. Next, one should work on the emergency account. After you have the 6 months’ cash needs in the bank, you can ponder the pay mortgage vs invest decision.
Of course, the higher your mortgage rate is, the more compelling it is to pay it off early. But there’s another point that makes less sense. If, with property tax, and state tax, you are above the standard deduction, and all your interest is a write-off, a 5% mortgage may cost you just 3.75%. The DVY (an ETF containing high dividend stocks from the Dow Index) is yielding over 3.8% right now. With the current 15% rate on dividends, that yield is 3.28%, net. So, do you think the DVY stocks will rise more than just 1/2% year? You see, I’m not claiming 6-9% here. That index can even lag inflation and still be ahead of the mortgage cost. But is the average person disciplined enough to stay the course, not panic on drops, and not spend the money elsewhere? If not, the early mortgage payment is like buying a CD. Why would you buy a 4% CD, when your mortgage is 5%? You wouldn’t, you’d pay the mortgage early.
Disclosure - I plan to retire early, and even if it’s not the perfect thing to do to make the most return, I’ve planned to have the mortgage paid at the same time I retire. In fact, my letter of resignation will be printed on the back of the lien release I get from the bank for dramatic effect.
JOE
[...] the past year, Kris and I have discussed making accelerated payments on our mortgage. I’ve written about this choice several times at Get Rich Slowly, and it seems clear that mathematically it makes more sense to [...]
My approach to this question can be summed up in two simple thoughts:
“If you owe the bank $10,000 YOU have a problem. If you owe the bank $1,000,000 the BANK has a problem.”
I’d rather the bank have the problem.
I have a 403b without matching for 12 years. I think the overall interest gained has been about 4 or 5% (hard to figure as money is put in in increments). I really don’t trust the stock market because of the falling dollar and lack of honesty and accountability.
With that in mind, we paid off our mortgage at 5 and 3/8% interest. The $500 a month in interest can now be put into a retirement. Plus, with a paid house, you don’t have to fight the mortgage company to build a workshop, remodel, etc.
The house is paid for because it is really small and needs lots of work - so it was only $134k. With about $20-$30k we can build the workshop and remodel (ourselves). The money that used to go to interest can now go to slowly remodeling the house so that in 2-4 years the house will be fully remodeled using cash - and still have money put aside for retirement.
dickey - congratulations. For many people, the choice between a fixed 5-3/8% return and an average return of say 9-10% with a 16% standard deviation is a tough one. I’d be against what you did if you let matching contributions go, but you said there was no match. As the mortgage rates drop the decision gets tougher, as I mention in my earlier post, but again, it’s not black and white and you are far ahead of most people financially.
JOE
Paying off the mortgage early requires some discipline. Wondering if it a good thing to do or not is easier to do. Actually doing is more rewarding.
Another reason to pay off mortgage is to limit the downside risks. When people lose jobs, they end up dipping into their retirement savings to — pay the mortgage. If you don’t have mortgage then loss of employment is not as damaging.
No mortgage is also HUGE emotionally. Without it, one is more likely to do the job they like. My two cents from my personal experience.
But finkid - if I prepay my mortgage, until it’s fully paid I have a monthly payment on most mortgages, don’t I? But if I invest that money and lose my job, I can just tap that savings. For those for whom the emotional aspect is ‘HUGE’, they should certainly prepay as much as they can. Because they likely won’t sleep if the stock market has volatility as we’ve seen recently. But don’t kid yourself, in any 10 year period since 1871, there have only been 9 instances out of 128 where the return was less than 3%.
see http://www.moneychimp.com/articles/randomness/time_horizon.htm
JOE
It is better for most people to invest the money rather than pay off the mortgage. Consider that the rolling average return of the S&P 500 is around 10.5%. If you’re in the 20% tax bracket, the mortgage APR would need to be 12.6% or higher for prepayment to be advantagous. Prepayment of a mortgage may be advantagous if one of the following conditions exists:
1) the APR of the mortgage is prohibitively high
2) you are near or in retirement
3) the emotional satisfaction of prepayment is high
Note that, the stinger is this: past performance does not guarantee future results. In recent decades the average yearly return on stocks has been much less, around 7%-9%, and may be even lower in the near future. Therefore, prepayment may make sense if there is not much time left on the mortgage.
I’ve got 25 years left on my mortgage, and about the same amount of time left until retirement. I’m not prepaying.
In the world of equities nothing is ever certain.
Recent decades:
1990-9 ave 18.8% stdev 13.3%
1980-9 ave 17.8% stdev 11.7%
1970-9 ave 7.4% stdev 18% (not a great decade)
But the 2000s are shaping up to be lousy, I admit that. When your mortgage interest comes off your taxes (and your state tax and property tax is high enough to put you in itemized land)and if stock dividends and cap gains are favored, investing will pay in the long term over the pre-pay.
Joe
JT: Very optimistic data indeed.
Your 70’s data is incorrect.
The 80’s weren’t a great decade considering the eroding effect of high inflation.
The gains of the 90’s should not be interpreted without assessing the impact of the 2000-02 bear market.
I have provided corrections below.
S&P 500 data from 1950-2006:
8.0% growth
3.7% dividend
11.7% total return
7.8% inflation adjusted return
total returns
50s ave 19.3%
60s ave 7.8%
70s ave 5.8%
80s ave 17.3%
90s ave 18.1%
00-06 ave 1.1%
inflation-adjusted returns
50s ave 10.7%
60s ave 1.8%
70s ave -5.4%
80s ave 7.1%
90s ave 12.0%
00-06 ave -3.1%
The 70’s.
My number above was the average. Take ten year’s returns, add them, divide by ten. You offer the geometric mean, or annualized return, which I can calculate as well.
Both have meaning, neither are wrong.
We agree, the 70’s sucked.
Joe
We bought our house in Vernon British Columbia,Canada 6 years ago and if all goes well we should BURN the mortgage July 08. The house is being rented out to good renters and my wife and I are here in Kona Hawaii doing the work we love. Once the house is paid for we can start collecting the rent payments instead of the bank getting it, this will serve as a 3rd income for us!!! Pre Payments are a great way to go. With wise saving and financial counsel we have been able to invest in our Roth and Sep Iras as well As Dave Ramsey says”FREEEEEEEEDOM”!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Warren Buffett has predicted future returns will be closer to 6%. Everyone thinks he’s crazy, but they thought that when he said the tech bubble would burst.
Also, I don’t think anyone mentioned the psychological aspect of making you save more. I have heard a financial advisor say that it doesn’t make sense, but everyone that retires early, paid off their mortgage early. I think its because you start to feel rich with a big investment account, then you save less, then it bombs, and you are left with fewer years of saving.
Its like no one has a problem buying a 20k car when you have monthly payments, but if you actually had to pay it upfront, it seems like a ton of money. If you have to pay it at once, you buy the 10K car and save the rest. There is an additional psychological part, separate from the freedom thing.
I’m split on what to do.
Isn’t our end goal wealth? I think when someone says “mathematically” they haven’t taken everything into consideration. If you look at the match you have to make sure that you have just about as much in investments as you do in outstanding mortgage debt. What’s the point in having 100k in mortgage debt and having only a few thousands dollars making 10% while trying to have your investments make more money? Your investments won’t make more money for you until you PHYSICALLY read that they are making more money for you every month than what you are paying in interest to a mortgage company. If the goal is wealth wouldn’t you want what gives you the most amount of money each month? That being said, you should always put at least ten percent of your money into your retirement account out of every paycheck. When people “do the math” they forget to think outside the box.
I also understand that some of the interest is “tax deductible” but that doesn’t give you as big of a break as one would think. Figure out what yields more.
What I personally would do is prepay the mortgage. There is nothing like losing your job for an extended period of time and not being able to pay your bills. And if you have to pay them and are forced to take out of retirement you’re screwed that way too. Now you’ve lost money in your retirement and on interest. I would refuse to be a slave to the lender any longer than I need to be.
We’re going go assume that someone makes $48000/yr.
If you have a $200k mortgage @ 5.85% you’ll have a monthly payment of $1179.88 (compliments of BankRate). Now, if you pay that off in the thirty years you’ll acquire $225k in interest. But, if you pay an additional $400/month (the money you’d put towards retirement (this is equal to ~10% of income)) you’ll pay off the mortgage in 16 years and you’ll have acquired $112k in interest on the home loan. That would be a savings of more than $100k.
That’s at least in terms of prepaying the mortgage. Now if you took that $400/month and put that in a retirement account for the sixteen years at 8% interest you would have $157k and you had to put $77k to make that much. So, you “made” $80k on your money in sixteen years. Given that you would have lost $20k in wealth by not prepaying your mortgage.
Now, if you saved fourteen years on prepaying your mortgage and put that monthly mortgage payment with the additional amount per month into a retirement account you would be at $1600/month for the next 14 years at 8% which comes out to ~$500k. So, now you’ve made $500k in investments and throughout that 14 years you saved $100k in interest so you have accumulated wealth totaling $600k. But now you have to subtract the amount you put into the account which is about $288k which brings total wealth accumulated to $312k plus you saved 20k by not putting it into the retirement. You’re at $332k. And this is not assuming that you put that 20k saved into the fund initially. You would make even more money if you did that.
But, if you had only put the $400 dollars per month towards retirement for the thirty years and still paid the monthly mortgage payment you would have had $587k in money but you would have also paid an extra $100k in interest. Bringing total money earned to $487k. Now you have to subtract the money you put into the account which is $144k and that brings total money earned to $343k. And you have to remember that you have to subtract taxes from that when you take your money out at retirement. This is also assuming that you don’t acquire any fees along the way with a perfect no-load fund and no expenses along the way. Some places charge as much as 5% for a load. If you had a load you would have put ~$380/month or 4560/year into savings. If you did this at the 8% (no expenses) for thirty years you’d be at $557k in totals minus 136k that you put in which is $421k minus the ~100k in savings which equals 321k total earned. Not including taxes that you would have on the money upon withdrawal. So, take it for what it’s worth.
Maybe I’m looking at it wrong, and if I am, please someone inform me. But it looks that mathematically having saved all the money in interest and money that could have been earned actually yields a slightly better scenario. Now, that’s with only 48k in earnings. I’m sure some people make much more than that. If the money is changed the scenario will change. I think that means that it should be taken lightly.
Allen,
It’s not so complicated.
If you earn precisely the same rate as your mortgage, and instead of prepaying it from 30 years down to 15, you save the difference, you will have the savings balance equal to the mortgage remaining after 15 years. Now, if your mortgage is fully tax deductible, as your state tax and property tax puts you above standard deduction, but your savings are somehow tax advantaged, either through deferral or cap gain / dividend rates, your breakeven is lower, and/or you’ll be ahead if you earn the same rate.
My mortgage is 5.24%. My post tax cost is 3.77%. If I can net more than that, pre-paying is not beneficial. If one can take their tax break while in a high income bracket, but take their earnings after retiring, presumably to a lower bracket, they should consider saving vs pre-paying.
Joe
[...] Is it better to invest or to prepay a mortgage? [...]
i would consider mortgage as an asset group with a rate of return that is fixed (your interest rate). i would build a portfolio with this as an asset and allocate capital(prepaying the mortgage) just as i would between stocks, bonds, cash etc.
In the Great Depression, many people lost their homes because they didn’t have them paid for. If we don’t have another depression one could argue that is makes more sense to invest, but if we do have a depression - the owners will win the day.
It’s a bet either way, but who is willing to gamble with your mortgage? The only reason people do is because they have a backup plan - it’s called bankruptcy.
The math is compelling - investing instead of paying off the mortgage is likely the most rewarding option in the long run. It’s a matter of risk tolerance. Nonetheless, my wife and I paid off our $320,000 house last month (at age 30) and we are now completely debt-free. This is great for our peace of mind, notwithstanding the $18,000 a year that we will now be able to invest. Obviously, this is not within reach of everyone, but prepaying is a great option instead of holding bonds or other fixed income investments, since the interest rate is likely higher on the mortgage.
So many comments! You can’t predict the future, so you can’t predict investment on return no matter what the length of time. However, if you can historically average greater returns than your interest rate for the term specific to you (i.e. the amount of time left to pay off your mortgage without overpayments?), then it’s probably mathematically superior. But are returns on investment taxed? How much tax do you pay on them?
I’ve be struggling with this. Right now, with my investments in the gutter, I think I would be absolutely sick right now had I taken out a new mortgage 12months ago.
However, you could look at today as an opportunity, as Mortgage rates are low, and it’s likely a good time to invest in some bargains…..
I still feel better knowing my home is paid for! If the markets perform like the experts say it will in my lifetime, I’ve already got enough invested! If they markets crash, at least I still have a place to live!
I plan on enjoying being debt free by prepaying my mortgage, as well. However, for those who are interested in investing, at least get to the point where you have at least the old norm of 20% equity in your home.
Too many bad loans have let people take on a mortgage with little or no money down, and getting to 20% equity would allow them access to more conservative refinance offers, or home equity lines of credit, etc., as well as removing the need to waste money on PMI.
@Mike,
I think what you wrote makes a lot of sense. Even though I only put 5% down, I have no PMI and a pretty good rate. I still think I’ll wait until I have or saved 20% equity before I start investing outside of tax advantaged retirement accounts. Thanks!
‘Suze Orman (The Laws of Money): Invest in the known before the unknown. Paying off your mortgage offers a guaranteed return on investment. “You cannot live in a tax return. You cannot live in a stock certificate. You live in your home.” ‘
Suze Orman is a tool!
Her monetary advice always makes me angry. I can’t watch 5 minutes of her show without throwing the remote control at the television.
You can’t live in a stock, but you can live in a rental and you can always sell stocks.
Think about the return on investment if you stick money in your house (above and beyond your down payment). If you stick $10,000 into your mortgage - your payments don’t get lower. You also have to wait until you sell your house to get it back. How long can you wait to get the money back? In this market you will be waiting a while unless you live in Atlanta or here in Austin.
Keep your money liquid (especially since it’s an emergency fund)
Admittedly, things suck right now, but I would split your emergency funds and keep some in the guaranteed CD, (I prefer High Yield Money Market accounts), and take the rest and stick it in an index fund that out performs the market. There are a number that earn far more than 9%/year.
You will have to do your research, but it shouldn’t be too hard by looking at Morningstar and Google Finance for the comparison chart.
… And don’t listen to that dunce Suze Orman.
I like how everyone tosses around the “average annual return of 7-10%”.. Doesn’t anyone realize the “average” return of the S&P for the last DECADE is about 2.6%, NOT including taxes and fees… OH, and don’t forget about inflation. In reality your real return would be ZERO to SLIGHTLY NEGATIVE.
The nonsense about lack of access to your home equity is silly. You can set up a HELOC and have access to those funds IMMEDIATLY, as opposed to the T+3 wait you will have when selling securities. I would even think that could serve as your emergency fund..
The best advice I’ve received is this: “There are two kinds of people, those who pay interest and those who get paid interest. That is the difference between those with money and those without”.
JMHO: Pay into your employer’s retirement plan up to the match, put all the rest into paying off your mortgage. When your house is paid off use the excess liquidity to max out your 401K, IRA, and buy some investment real estate if you need the tax shelter.
Chris, funny, when I do the math, and look at the ten years from 1998-2007, I see a gain of 52% (including dividends), which is a not so bad return of 4.27%/geometric mean.
BUT - when I drop the spectacular 26% of 1998 and add the -12% so far this year, I see a total return of 6%, which is <1%/yr.
I bet you are under 40.
I hear you citing a decade that began with a 3 year bursting bubble of hi tech, and ending with whatever this mess is now. It’s possible that we never regress to the mean again, but I expect a recovery and anyone not invested for the long term will miss out.
On the other hand, A Boston-based financial services research firm, Dalbar, inc, concluded that
“For the 20 years ended Dec. 31, 2006, the average stock fund investor earned a paltry 4.3 average annual compounded return compared to 11.8 percent for the Standard & Poor’s 500 index.”
Which, if we take it at face value, backs up your position. Unless one is committed to the buy and hold, it appears the average investor buys high, sells low, and lags the numbers quoted. Even when we choose a stellar 20 year period, the average investor would have been better off following your advice above.
(And I bet you did not expect me to conclude in agreement with you… life’s funny.)
Joe
Joe,
Disclaimer: I am under 40
I may be splitting hairs, but if you run the Morningstar report on the Vanguard S&P 500 Index Fund - VFINX - (I don’t trust my own math, apparently) which is about the cheapest you can get, the average yearly return is 2.81%, which is lower than the Lehman Brother’s Agg Bond Index and even the 3-month T-bill.
Color me bitter, but I started investing in 1997. Perhaps in the next 20 years we may see something resembling the historic “average”, though I am inclined to believe we will not.
Check out:
http://seekingalpha.com/article/90892-the-great-consumer-crash-of-2009
I may be falling victim to the “This time it’s different” mantra, but….
Best of luck.
Chris
I came into windfall and can afford to pay off my mortgage with 1/3 of the money. Should I pay off my mortgage or invest all of it for growth and income?
Thanks.
Mox - What is the rate on your mortgage? Do you itemize your deductions? i.e. is your interest fully deductible? What is your tax bracket?
Do you (or your wife) work for a company that matches your 401(k) and do you deposit up to the match at least?
You see, if you said that this is chance to have deposits to the 401(k) doubled, and you’d use this money to do that depositing over the next X years, that might be better for you. If the mortgage interest dollars are low enough that you can’t itemize, and your 401(k) is loaded up, paying the mortgage isn’t a bad idea, esp if it’s just 1/3 the windfall. It’s not a black and white answer.
Joe
Inflation is probably about to heat up big time. This means you can pay back a loan with cheaper dollars than you borrowed. Wages go up. Payments on fixed loans stay the same. Payments get easier. Pay back in the future with cheaper dollars. This is my advice. Personally I’m making two house payments per month just because the thought of debt suffocates me.
I would like to cut Five years of my martgage, could you direct me to a calculator that tells me how much of extra principle that I need to pay every month.
Regards
George
George, if you post your numbers, you’ll get a reply here. It really depend how far into the mortgage you are as well as the rate. For example, at 6%, to drop from 30 to 25 years requires only 7.5% higher payments, but to go from 25 to 20, takes payments 11.2% higher.
Do you have excel? If so, the equation is simple. I will post it, if you wish.
Joe
This was written by Don Taylor of Bankrate.com
The Federal Housing Administration provides a loan guarantee program in lieu of private mortgage insurance so qualified borrowers can get a mortgage loan with a low down payment.
The FHA doesn’t lend you the money, they guarantee the loan, so the lender doesn’t take on a financial risk by extending you credit. The U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development Web site can help you find HUD-approved counselors in your area who can answer your questions about FHA loans, specific to your situation.
The most popular FHA loan has a minimum cash investment requirement of 3 percent but permits 100 percent of the money needed at closing to be a gift from a relative, nonprofit organization or government agency.
FHA lending guidelines are not as strict as the Federal National Mortgage Association (Fannie Mae) or the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation (Freddie Mac). Sellers must pay part of the closing costs, while some of the borrower’s closing costs can be included in the loan amount.
FHA loans are assumable, meaning you can transfer your loan to the new owner if you sell your house. That allows the new owner to take over your FHA loan without the additional cost of obtaining a new loan. To assume the loan, the buyer has to meet the credit standards for the loan. This feature can make it easier to sell your home.
There are three FHA loan programs:
1. FHA 203(b) fixed-rate mortgage (15- or 30-year loans)
2. FHA 251 adjustable-rate mortgage
3. FHA 2-1 buy-down loans
There’s also an Energy Efficient Mortgages program that allows homeowners to finance adding energy-efficient features to new or existing homes as part of either their home purchase or FHA refinancing.
The biggest disadvantage to FHA loans is the mortgage insurance premium. In most 15- or 30-year FHA loans, the borrower pays 1.5 percent of the loan amount at closing, along with a 0.5 percent annual renewal premium paid annually over the life of the loan.
( Josh said - You speak of the PMI, FHA has a lower monthly PMI rate then the My Community, but with the upfront PMI the payments come out to be the same regardless. If you were to ever give a borrower the choice between a FHA and My Community loan, the borrower will most likely take the FHA. Ask any expert out there, they will 99% of the time tell you the same thing )
Unlike private mortgage insurance, the mortgage insurance premium isn’t canceled when the homeowner’s equity reaches a target level. You may qualify, however, for a partial refund of the upfront mortgage insurance premium if you owned your home for less than five to seven years. It’s five years for loans closed after Jan. 1, 2001 and seven years for loans closed before Jan. 1, 2001 and after September 1983.
You need to shop rates when looking for a FHA mortgage just as you would with a conventional loan because the rates are established by the lender, not the government. FHA loan rates are typically higher than conventional (nongovernment guaranteed) loan rates but shouldn’t be a lot higher unless you have credit problems.
( Josh Said -the My Community mortgage has a much higher rate due to rate and or pricing hits )
Before you start applying for loans you should request a copy of your credit report from at least one of the three major credit bureaus and get a credit score from them as well. Review the report for errors. If you find any, use the dispute-resolution process to correct the report. Bankrate provides contact information for the credit bureaus and a guide to handling the dispute-resolution process.
I am someone who never quite understood how to respond when someone asks if I am a homeowner. Because as far as I’m concerned - until the deed is in my hands ‘paid in full’ - I do not consider myself to be a home’owner.’ So I respond, I’m making mortgage payments if that’s what you want to know.
Recently I structured out my payment plan for the year including a few ‘off months’ when I anticipate heavier than usual bills / vacation / etc … so that my yearly payments will be done in July with an average of $215 extra against principal. By the end of December I will be up to March and will continue this trend in order to pay off my mortgage 10 or 12 years early.
On that day I will take great satisfaction in saying, ‘yes … I am a homeowner.’ I understand it’s simple semantics … but it’s important to me. Based on this article that will cost me $12,000 or so in potential investment earnings … but I’ll have peace of mind.
First, I guess I should clarify the $215 extra is per monthly payment - not total. Secondly, I read Jason’s comments below and was struck by his comment because for me the great difference is that - yes, I realize rather than pre-payments I could make huge strides against the principal - but - that equates to equity and wouldn’t help me at all if something happened and I suddenly found myself in dire straits. By getting 6 months to 1 year or more ‘ahead’ I can relax, and strategize next steps without the burden of having NO SAVINGS and staying current in my monthly payments. Right now, I’m two months ahead - after Friday I’ll be 4 months ahead, at the end of next year (God willing) I will be one year ahead which is crucial in the current economic crisis. That would leave me ample time to find a similar position and/or accept a much lower paying position for the time being. Even then, I’d start pumping money back into mortgage as soon as possible while continuing to avoid credit card, thankfully my natural pessimistic nature keeps me relatively debt free (owe $117 on CC).
Jason Says:
June 1st, 2007 at 7:10 am
I think it’s better to pay down the principal on the mortgage. I don’t know if I’m nit picking, but pre-payment is not a good idea, but applying directly to the principal is.
Bob - how do make the extra payments? If they are to principal, the next due date does not tick forward. If you are actually sending “two coupons” representing the next two payments, you need to make sure your bank actually credits these upon receipt, otherwise they use your money,but you save no interest. (I say ‘otherwise’, because banks can use either method. You need to check with your bank how they credit the account.
Mine is a fixed 15 yr home equity loan. I send 12 payments today, I have nothing due for a year. If I do nothing else, in one year, I’ll see I’m ahead on principal by the int rate times about 1/2 years payments. So I’m with you, but most mortgages do not work this way.
A lot of the ideas here are more about budgeting.
The reality is, the tax deduction I get far outways the paying off the mortgage.
Because up till sep2008 I could easily earn much more than the 6.5% I pay onthe mortgqage.
In fact till sep2008 i was avgeraging about 15-20% on funds, and up to 30% on stocks.
Since then, of course my stocks arent doing great… some of my funds arent..
But I am diversified enought that I only lost 10% while I know people who have lost the whole range from 0% to 100%.
Once i get my investing done, If I have spare $$ laying around then I pay extra on the mortgage.
I do about $500 on drip related investing.
I have about $1500 a month I do on general.
I have no intention of paying a mortgage that costs me 6.5% when I can earn much more than that.
Note that in my mortgages I always try to not include the various fees/closings as part of the payments.
Even the BPP (buyers protection) i pay seperately (normally thats required to be part of the mortgage but not nececcesarily).
Also even if i did want to pay ahead on mortgage it will always be ona 30yr.
I will never do 15yr unless the numbers jive, because so far I can have a 30yr and pay extra during the good times and hold back during bad.
Dont forget, there are still lenders out there that dont allow prepayment (early payoff).
In my case I never ever go with a mortgage that doesnt allow early payoff and also doenst allow a way of paying extra at any time I choose or similar.
also I give serious preference to online access to mortgage details of the mortgage (though i dont usualy need it after closing).
Also, I never ever buy a house where I have to pay PMI (I have in the past done more than 1-2 mortgages on one house and paid off the smaller one though.
Rarely will I actually pay off a mortgage soley for the paying off.
Investing is always better and a true financial analyst wont want you to pay off the mortgage early unless the numbers work and often investing is better.
The reality is if you have cc debt or other issues, the mortgage is the last item to be paying on (and also investments).
However, if you are automatic on some investments, then they too are part of the cycle of whatever you have to do.
Mortgage payoff is a good idea but can be dependent on each persons situation.
For most, if the interest rate on your mortgage is high enough then payoff instead of refi or invest might be of value.
But for many,even if I were to do the same dollar amt as the price of the house I can even now, find bonds & cd’s that will give me nearly the same rate.
In fact 2 months ago I just got a 6% 25 year deal (bond), and i consider it a better deal than paying off the mortgage.
Yes I could have paid off the mortgage in full but why? I can use the tax deduction as well.
Hi,
Paul here (the one who asked the original question so very long ago…
As an aside, I’ve long since decided to NOT pay off the mortgage. Why?
- I’ve got a great rate, still lower than the current “lowest rates”
- I can earn more with the cash in my accounts
- If I lose my job, that cash will allow me to pay my mortgage for several months. If I pay it all toward the principal, I’ll have nothing, and lose the house.
Another thing to consider is the power of inflation vs. the power of compounding. As time moves on, the dollar loses value due to inflation. Dollars properly invested today keep up or exceed inflation. By paying my mortgage off over time, I’ve borrowed money I get to pay back at significantly devalued levels. I.e. In the future, a dollar paid to my mortage may be worth only $.50. Whereas $1.00 paid out today, is $1.00 at today’s rates. And $1.00 invested today, is worth more in the future.
Paul above (not me) said:
“Yes I could have paid off the mortgage in full but why? I can use the tax deduction as well.”
I think this is a bad reason to keep a mortgage. A deduction is not a credit. In other words, you can only deduct a small percentage of the interest paid on the mortgage, not the entire mortgage payment. If you have no mortgage, you don’t *need* a deduction, you have the full amount of the payment in cash, up front, every single month. Saying that having a mortgage is a good thing because of the deduction is essentially saying that paying Fred $10 now is a good thing because next April Sam is going to give me $1.
I’d rather not spend the $10 in the first place. I end up $9 ahead
Pll has it right, what I meant was I can invest the extra $$ and do better than the mortgage rate I pay.
Ie; why settle for a 6% savings by payoff when I can invest same at 6% or better and often do better and still have the cash.
But since Im not in high end of $$ making anymore (since 2003) I think not paying off is better… and I do get about $5000 in deduction each year on this alone (doesnt include the medical I get to deduct too (yea the % over agi is subtantial).
2006 was $17k in deductions despite being on $40k combined income.
The keeping a mortgage has more to do with investing the same.
But hey, each persons situation may be different enough to justify more of one or the other?
“But hey, each persons situation may be different enough to justify more of one or the other?”
This is exactly right! Each and every person’s situation is completely different. As J.D. is wont to say, “Do what’s right for you!”.
And, no one here can tell you, or me in this case, what to do, all anyone can do is provide insight and opinion based on the very incomplete situation presented here. No one here knows my entire financial situation, nor are they familiar with what I’m comfortable with. So, while I may be comfortable investing this money in small-cap growth stocks, this may horrify others. (No, I’m not doing this
Ultimately though, it all boils down to doing what you’re comfortable with. I am deeply appreciative, however, of all the thoughts and opinions expressed here. It’s given me a lot to think about and definitely helped me make certain decisions regarding the initial questions I posed.
Paul
A lot of people are touting a mathematical proof investing over buying, but there is one factor they are not including… risk.
The market pays better because you are paying a premium for risk. Are you sure investments will grow 9% _forever_? What if they bottom out? What if something catastrophic were to happen at a global or even national level? Can you eat investments? Sleep in them? There was a time in Germany where it was cheaper to burn money than firewood.
Being wealthy is a mindset. You live simply, frugally. A person with this mindset eliminates their debt first.
The people who are theorycrafting that investments are going to win out in the end are doing so with fuzzy logic. You have no idea what the future of the stock market will be (period). You have no idea of what the economic may evolve into (ever heard of Steady State economics? - wikipedia it). It’s perfectly plausible that this mad charge of growth and consumption will sizzle out and the huge amount of money invested in the market will produce a reasonable rate of return, one that is sustainable, and a lot less than 9%.
Finally - why bother with maximizing and minimizing. Owning your house _meets your needs_. That should be your first priority.
It also depends how fast you payoff the mortgage. I’ll give you my circumstance for example. I plan on paying my 30 year mortgage on a 180,000 mortgage in 4 years. After that I plan on plowing money into investments (stocks and 100% paid for real estate). I think I’ll catch and surpass the person that is tied down with that mortgage after about 5 years. Just my 2 cents!
It depends on the details naturally.
Overall, it does in fact depend on the investment in the end.
If one is unsure about their regular income, paying off mortgage in accelerated fashion is good idea.
But if you are paying 5% on mortgage and can earn 10% then it depend on the $$ amt I would think.
In my own case, it also depends on how much $$ we are talking about.
If i got new $$ that was less than $150K I would not pay off mortgage, but I would invest the $$ in such a way that a portion of the investment growth would pay for the mortgage for me.
Its totally possible to earn sufficent from investment to pay the mortgage and still earn more.
But paying it off can also allow bigger investments when its paid off.
For most its a ‘feel good’ deal.
In my case my mortgage is $50k and I would have to have more than $150k in new $$ to consider paying it off in accelerated fashion.
As it is, per the crash in 2008 I can use the deductions currently.
Another key factor in everyone’s decision making is “Time”, which relates to “risk”
We all forget, that the most expensive factor for us all- is time, and all of us - have a very limited and finite amount of that.
So plan accordingly.
Thats it.
It all comes down to time and what it takes to do what you need.
Paying off a mortgage is not a advantage unless you have spare $$ to have around.
If you are not that wealthy the mortgage is in fact a healthy good tax deduction.
If you have the cash, then it really depends on peace of mind.
Otherwise, if you can invest the difference in something that earns you more than u pay on the mortgage then invest instead of payoff.
Timing is a key element.
If you have 5 years left on the mortgage, then there is little to be gained by paying it off now since the interest on the mortgage was paid up front. Take a look at the table of payments and see how little is now going to interest… add those numbers up and you’ll see that you can easily get an investment that pays more over the next 5 years, plus you’ll be liquid rather than “house rich & cash poor”.
If you still have 20-25 years to go on the mortgage, then consider things like:
a) will you be retired before the mortgage is paid? living on a retiree’s earnings is a whole lot different than living on a wage.
b) will paying it off early (extra payments or refinancing to shorter term) squeeze your budget so you’re no longer adding to savings?
c) are you likely to move soon and end up selling/renting the house?
d) what’s your plan if your income drops?
e) how much longer will you still be able to get a deduction for interest on your taxes (e.g. is your standard deduction more than the interest)?
Right away, you’ll see that many of those questions can best be answered by referring to the amortization table for your mortgage.
********
It’s also worth a second look at the advice many have given in the comments:
- Hindsight shows that relying on HELOCs to help you through tight times was crappy advice since many of those HELOCs got yanked out from under the people just when they needed them most.
- “Risky” investments in mutual funds lost 25-50% this past year. This is an exceptionally lower return than prepaying a mortgage.
- “Safe” investments in short term CDs and savings bonds went to a rate barely above 0% (it actually is 0% for savings bonds right now!). This is a much lower return than prepaying a mortgage.
- Unemployment is pushing 9% nationally (it’s over 10% in my state). If your budget was tight because you were prepaying your mortgage and now your family has less income, you no longer have a cushion and probably aren’t prepaying your mortgage now.
- If all you care about is income (rather than net worth), then there are investments paying more than a mortgage - check the “risky” stock market for companies which are paying dividends higher than mortgage rates and, in many cases, have actually increased them. Or maybe you can rent out your house now for more than your mortgage payment?
Its a good debatable topic and I think it will depend on what situation you are in.
I recommend
for example for a $200,000 Loan try to prepay where you have just $50,000 loan left as at that point the interest you will be paying will be much less most of the repayment you will be making after that will be more toward the payment of Principal.
Invest rest of the money in Another property or any asset which Appreciate with time even Stock market can be considered provided you should not look on ups and downs too often at this volatile market.
Make sure your investment is not emotional but thoroughly researched as its your money and anyone advicing you where to put is not to be blamed if you make more money in short span what you invested in make a move and take the profit and then invest again.
Cheers Amit
Ask yourself, would you be willing to bet your house on the market? Overall past returns do not guarentee future returns…They all say it. I say find a balance; i.e., balanced portfolio.
Max out 401k’s, ROTH IRAs, have 1 year of savings in reserve (mortgage payments and all other expenses including home repairs), then balance the other extra money in paying down the mortgage, mutual funds and bonds paying at least 2% more than the interest your paying on the mortgage.
Doing this gives you cash reserves for emergencies (you can’t eat the house) and other options for investments if and when interest rates rise. Pay extra toward the mortgage (I’m on a 15 year with 10 left). If interest rate rise above the interest your paying paying on the mortgage, then stop paying down the mortgage and put it into FDIC insured. Remember CD’s paying 18%. I do.
When people look at the tax “write off” on your mortgage, just remember your only getting back a percentage of what you paid to the bank (mortgage co.)
Before you pay off the house make sure you have at least 2 years of property taxes and repairs in reserve.
One last thing. Consider your age. I’m 50.
The big assumption and flaw in the thinking that investing is better than prepayment is that you are assuming that you are guaranteed a certain amount of return on investment and that the guaranteed return is in the higher single digits. Now tell me who actually pays me a guaranteed return of 7-10% on my investment. No one as far as I know.