2007 Discretionary Spending: The Highs and Lows Print
Tuesday, 22nd January 2008 (by J.D.)This article is about Budgeting, Real-Life
I write a lot about personal finance, but how well do I practice what I preach? For the most part, I follow my own advice. Much of what I write here is based on personal experience. But my financial life is not without weaknesses. Last January, I tallied my discretionary spending to see exactly how much these weaknesses cost me. This year, I’ve done the same.
Looking at the Big Picture, 2007 was an amazing year for me financially. I not only increased my income, but also severely reduced my expenses. Last year I spent half of what I spent in 2006. It was my lowest annual spending since 2002. With such a tremendous positive cash flow, I was finally able to get rid of my non-mortgage debt.
Although the Big Picture was rosy, it was not without flaws. I’m still spending plenty (perhaps too much?) on certain aspects of my life. Most of these will come as no surprise to regular readers. Here are my biggest sources of discretionary spending:
- Books (2005: $1049.91, 2006: $692.96, 2007: $702.73)
- My book spending is down significantly from five years ago. I used to spend $200/month on books. Now I’m spending about $50/month, and even this number is inflated. Many of the books I purchased in 2007 were personal finance and self-development titles. Though I now realize these are a legitimate business expense, I often forget to use business money to buy them. Just last week I bought $80 worth of personal finance books with money from my regular checking account. My spending for non-business books is very low right now. My secret? Used book stores and the public library!
- Comic Books (2005: $2810.52, 2006: $3202.91, 2007: $897.08)
- Will you look at that? Although I use comics as a prop for laughs here at Get Rich Slowly, I’ve genuinely struggled with my spending on them in the past. I seem to have overcome this. Last year, I only spent $900 on comics, and $525 of that came during the first three months of the year. Since October, I’ve only spent $100 on comics, which is half of what I’d budgeted. This is a huge personal victory.
- Entertainment (2005: $479.31, 2006: $610.55, 2007: $1175.25)
- This number ballooned last year despite reduced spending on CDs, DVDs, and movies. I went through a bowling phase early in the year; Kris and I attended the opera; I bought some concert tickets (The Black Angels and my favorite band, The Decemberists, who play in Portland tomorrow night). But the real culprit was my Nintendo Wii. I’ve only purchased a few games so far, but “a few games” add up. This gives me additional incentive to keep my video game spending low.
- Food (2005: $5290.06, 2006: $5060.04, 2007: $4108.55)
- which includes Dining out (2005: $1648.63, 2006: $2018.81, 2007: $2051.93)
Kris and I worked hard to reduce our grocery bill last year, often putting to use the techniques I describe at Get Rich Slowly. We know that we spend a lot of money on food, especially for a two-person household, but we’re trying to improve. We actually dined out less last year than in 2006, but we were undone by our new favorite restaurant. An evening at Gino’s costs us $60, and we go there once a month. As usual, this category needs some work. (See also: How much do you spend on food?) - Pets (2005: $397.76, 2006: $471.03, 2007: $625.52)
- Many personal finance writers view pets as an unnecessary expense. But to me, $50 a month to keep four cats is a bargain. It costs me only fifty cents a day for each animal, and they bring much more joy than that to my life. If Kris would let me, I’d be the “crazy cat lady” on the block. (Are there “crazy cat gentlemen”?)
- Sin (2005: $1055.33, 2006: $768.95, 2007: $431.89)
- This includes wine, liquor, pipe tobacco, poker nights, etc. Looking at this category, you’d think I was a chain-smoking lush! It’s not true. I smoke a pipe maybe a dozen times a year. We serve alcohol at dinner parties and social gatherings. Because we like to entertain, we serve a lot of alcohol. I reduced my own alcohol intake sharply this year. (At one point I went three months without a drink just to test myself.) This made a huge difference in my spending.
For those keeping score, my 2005 discretionary spending was $11,082.89. It was $10,806.44 in 2006. Last year, it fell to $7,941.02. That’s $2,865.42 I was able to free to apply directly to my outstanding debt. Though I’m pleased to have done so well with my spending in 2007, I’m worried that this sets me up for disappointment in 2008. My expenses almost have to increase.
Please note that there’s nothing inherently wrong with purchasing things that bring you joy. But problems come when you finance these purchases with debt. If you’re meeting your other financial goals and have money left over, it’s good to indulge your interests and passions.
Addendum: How does my spending compare to others? Checking this thread about annual living expenses from the discussion forums, the numbers seem fairly typical.

RSS Feeds
Facebook
Twitter

January 22nd, 2008 at 10:50 am
Gino’s is quite good. Eating out was probably one of our biggest downfalls last year. My wife and I love to eat at China Delight and Queen of Sheba. Not to mention half a dozen other places. My personal downfall was board games. Funny that I keep stumbling onto blogs that turn out to be written by Portland residents. How odd.
Greg
January 22nd, 2008 at 10:51 am
The most useful point (to me) in Rich Dad, Poor Dad was the concept of categorizing things as assets or liabilities by his definition. Basically if the thing brings value or drains you.
I place books under education in my budget and don’t think a grand in books is bad at all and are categorized as assets. Your Sin category could be categorized as a liability if a guest gets a DUI, that comes back on you, or from the health factor point of view. But you could argue it’s an asset too socially, networking, etc.
Good job on not blowing money in 2007. Are you going to track what your debt cost you in ‘07 and ‘08? If your expenses go up, but your interest expenses go down from reducing debt you might find tracking it satisfying.
January 22nd, 2008 at 10:52 am
Thanks so much for being brave enough to share that kind of information with us. I think it takes a lot of courage: You’re not just speaking in vague terms about “I decreased spending in this area of my life last year”, you’re giving us actual numbers! It’s hard to do, but I think such habits will increase accountability. I think a lot of people would benefit from having a partner to divulge EXACTLY (down to the penny) how much they spend on certain areas.
January 22nd, 2008 at 10:54 am
You should start blogging about comics; then you could shift that expense into the business column.
January 22nd, 2008 at 11:05 am
I’ve been lurking on the site for several years now, and I just wanted to say thanks for sharing this information. My wife and I are doing our budgets for this year, and it’s always good to hear about someone else’s success.
January 22nd, 2008 at 11:11 am
One of the best comments that you have said is that “there’s nothing inherently wrong with purchasing things that bring you joy. But problems come when you finance these purchases with debt.”
You just need to make sure your needs are taken care of before you go on to wants, then desires!
Great post!
January 22nd, 2008 at 11:27 am
Your drop in comic book spending is particularly admirable, congratulations. Ernesto’s idea is kind of cool unless you think it’d lead to more spending problems. But you do so well with your blogs anyway that maybe when you cut back from your full-time job you might find time for a comic one.
January 22nd, 2008 at 11:36 am
JD,
Have you ever looked into using a website like Paperback Swap to obtain new, used books for just the cost of shipping? This has helped me to greatly reduce my spending on books.
And I love that you have a category called Sin, I got a good laugh from that!
January 22nd, 2008 at 11:37 am
Congrats on bringing down the spending. The Decemberists’ show should be pretty awesome… I’m jealous!
January 22nd, 2008 at 11:41 am
It’s impressive you tracked all that. The closest I come to something I track is “Entertainment” (which includes eating out). It went from $2,016 in 2006 to $3,870 in 2007.
Best Wishes,
D4L
January 22nd, 2008 at 11:46 am
I did this exercise fot the first time last year and was astounded at how much my fiance and I spend to feed a family of two ($10k - but that includes alcohol and food for dinner parties for friends).
This year I’m starting an ‘entertaining at home’ category so I can see exactly how much we spend on the get-togethers we host.
You did a great job keeping your pet care costs in the ‘reasonable’ category. I only buy my dog toys, my partner takes care of the vet bills and kennel expenses - I bet we easily spent $1200 combined caring for that mutt. But I wouldn’t trade her for the world.
January 22nd, 2008 at 11:56 am
I’ve seen the Decemberists in concert several times, the first few times I was lucky enough to see them for $9, $12 and $15, the next time they came to town (Montreal, Canada) it was more along the lines of $30. I sadly missed that show. Their increase in popularity is good for them, but bad for my wallet.
January 22nd, 2008 at 12:07 pm
I hate to think what I spend on my 80lb. Golden Retriever. He’s 11 so the vet bills are going up with his age. At his size he’s not cheap to feed. But we don’t spoil him much with toys or treats so those costs are low. But the benefits are something you can’t measure - my blood pressure actually dropped 8 points on average after we got him about 6 years ago. He has brought my husband and I closer because we walk him together and talk about our day. We’re exercising and laughing so much more now that we have this goofy creature in our life. No matter how bad my day is I know I can come home and have a living creature be overjoyed to see me. There isn’t enough money in the world that can buy that.
January 22nd, 2008 at 12:12 pm
Do you buy your books used? I love http://www.fetchbook.info where you can compare prices and find the lowest price.
Also - since your blog has wide readership, you should be able to finagle reviewers copies. My husband is an academic and you wouldn’t believe what a boondoggle it is for getting books, most of which we donate to their library anyway.
ANd… you can resell the books. A lot of them, I’m sure you’ve found out, are not very useful.
January 22nd, 2008 at 12:12 pm
Re-reading this entry, I see that there’s a little bit of ambiguity. I say that my spending last year was half of what it was in 2006, yet the numbers at the end of the article don’t reflect that. What I mean to say is that my overall spending was sliced in half. Discretionary spending is just a part of that.
Re: The Decemberists. This will be the third time I’ve seen them live. Should be fun!
January 22nd, 2008 at 12:22 pm
I’m a little bit boggled by your numbers still. $702 on books — that’s $7000 over the course of ten years. If you have to own them, have you tried buying them on Half.com? I was shocked to find I really could buy anything I wanted at half price or less — sometimes 75 cents. Of course, the library is free even for personal finance books. And if they don’t have them, interlibrary loan is free too.
January 22nd, 2008 at 12:27 pm
J.D.
Though I don’t have a problem with debt, I enjoy reading your column as it helps keep me focused on using my money wisely.
I do have a question about this analysis. When I see these real world examples I often wonder if the amounts are for a household, a couple, or an individual - who may be part of a household or couple. In your example some of the totals look like they are couple expenses (food and maybe sin)and some look like they are particular to you as an individual(comic books), and some I’m unclear on (books for example). Does your wife have a category that is specific to her?
It’s not such a problem for this example but when people talk about retirement savings, retirement timing etc. it gets very muddled if you can’t sort the couple vs. individual stuff out. Especially if the couple are not the same age. In much personal finance writing this isn’t clear and its difficult to see how the ideas apply to them as a unit.
Anyway thanks for the great writing and interesting blog.
January 22nd, 2008 at 12:30 pm
I was working on this over the weekend as well and posted my numbers in the GRS personal finance forum under annual expenses.
I have some trouble figuring out what is discretionary and what is not. Books, eating out, gifts are all, charity, are, to me, discretionary. But what about dry cleaning, clothes, and vet bills for the dog? I think a $1000 dress is discretinary spending within the clothing category but are clothes, in general, discretionary?
I guess my question is as follows: are all spending choices beyond the very basics of food, shelter, clothing, insurance, transportation discretionary?
January 22nd, 2008 at 12:32 pm
Off topic, but The Decemberists are AWESOME live! I got to see them perform with the Baltimore Symphony Orchestra, and it was seriously one of the best concerts I’ve ever been to.
January 22nd, 2008 at 12:42 pm
I’ve been chronicling my spending on a “private” blog since December, I’m having a hard time breaking it down so much, I buy beer when I buy groceries often, so my beer spending often gets lumped into my grocery spending. Do you go through all of your receipts individually? and Do you use any sort of computer program/website to help you keep track?
January 22nd, 2008 at 12:45 pm
@ Christine
GREAT question. In this case, all of these totals are just for the money I spent. Kris never pays for anything in the sin category, which is a point of mild contention. We split the grocery bill 50/50, so whatever I’ve spent on groceries, she’s also spent that much. I generally pay for meals out, though not always. (To be fair, Kris has her own set of things that she pays for and I do not: gardening supplies and household stuff come to mind.)
I agree that when people talk about retirement savings and net worths, etc., I never know if this is a household number or an individual number. I read The Millionaire Next Door with this question on my mind the entire time. Great question.
@Sam
I think “discretionary” is largely subjective. In my numbers here, groceries are mostly non-discretionary, but I’ve included them. (Some groceries are discretionary, however.) Dining out, however, always is. I think that each person needs to decide how they’re going to track this sort of thing and just be consistent. The important thing is constancy!
January 22nd, 2008 at 12:46 pm
@Jordan
I split out certain things such as alcohol. If it’s something that I know I want to track, I make sure to split the transaction in Quicken.
January 22nd, 2008 at 12:50 pm
Great post. I’m a bit of a video game spender myself, but I’ve been able to really keep the expenses down by quickly selling back any games I’m not currently playing.
When you see a new game you want, but it right when it comes out, play it like crazy, then go on eBay/Craigslist/GameRush and sell/trade it in right away. Games usually don’t lose much value in the first month or 2, so you’ll end up paying about $10-20 per game, which can be a big savings.
If you’re still playing the game after that time, keep it, but just as you’ve said with movies/CDs/etc, it’s not really worth anything sitting on the shelf (and you can always rent it later if you get an urge - or rebuy it at a lower price)
January 22nd, 2008 at 1:01 pm
there’s nothing inherently wrong with purchasing things that bring you joy…I agree
You should rename Sin category to Vice
January 22nd, 2008 at 1:19 pm
Holy Cow!
You spend SO much money I had to finally leave a comment.
I will not be reading your blog anymore unfortunately…
You spent more money on eating out per month then I spend on rent!!!
I also should note that my discretionary spending is around $1200 per year, and I have NO debt whatsoever… no wonder you still have debt!
Im guessing you are American, for you spend the entire minimum wage yearly income on ‘entertainment’
UNREAL!!!
January 22nd, 2008 at 1:33 pm
I have kept a ’sin’ category for smokes (I smoke about a pack a month: social smoking, reaction to upsetting events, etc.)
This year I have seperated ‘booze’ from groceries and and eating out. I want to know just how much I spend on beer and drinks. I think I spend 10 bucks on a couple of drinks out with the guys every two weeks, and 15 more on a few six packs for the apartment each month. But I really have no clue, so now I’m measuring such things.
I’m really glad someone else has a sin category!!
January 22nd, 2008 at 1:39 pm
Tracking my expenses is something I’ve dabbled in from time to time. I’m single now (soon to be divorced), so the only person I have to make accountable to the spending and numbers is myself. I started tracking my spending the beginning of January and I’m still going strong.
I’ve said to some I’ve put myself on a financial diet. I’m working towards lowering the amount I spend, increasing the little bit I can invest, and knocking off some debt. I’m in the process of renovating my house to be able to hopefully sell it and move, so that is creating some outlay of cash, but I’m confident the return will be found in the increase in the value of my home.
Thank you so much for posting your totals and categories. The categories you’ve listed will help me in streamlining my own.
January 22nd, 2008 at 1:46 pm
A cat guy who loves comic books. Hmmmm.
January 22nd, 2008 at 2:02 pm
Not only do you have your spending under control, by not incurring debt or dipping into your emergency fund, etc., but you’re focusing on spending on your values, of what’s important to you, rather than random, meaningless things, and so that’s great! And with those conditions met, I agree with you that we should indulge our passions and interests. I just booked a 2 week flight to HI from CA and plan to book another one for March and a third in May. I’ve never booked 3 flights in one day. And why not? It’s to visit my daughter and grandchildren and like you, I’m not incurring any debt doing so. And about those cats — the guy who comes over to take care of my one cat while I travel is your age and has 6 cats of his own — so there’s no reason why you shouldn’t get 2 more!
January 22nd, 2008 at 2:02 pm
Interesting:
I can’t honestly tell you what our discretionary spending is spent on - but I CAN tell you how much. We each get $200 a pay for our “play money”. that covers dance classes, dinners out, books and sport for me - coffee, books and a heap of sport for Ryan.
January 22nd, 2008 at 2:12 pm
@wthell
These are annual figures, not monthly figures. My entertainment spending is not equal to minimum wage income.
I admit that I still spend too much, but I’m working on it. I’m making progress. I don’t think I spend obscene amounts of money, though. Perhaps I’m wrong…
January 22nd, 2008 at 2:18 pm
“The most useful point (to me) in Rich Dad, Poor Dad was the concept of categorizing things as assets or liabilities by his definition. Basically if the thing brings value or drains you.”
I still kinda like that too, but I wish I’d never read the book because I periodically catch myself remembering something from the book and then I’ll have to remind myself that he’s a complete charlatan and it’s likely that the whole thing is made up.
January 22nd, 2008 at 2:31 pm
J.D.
I am sorry to see such a negative comment from @wthell. Clearly this person has a hard time understanding the well written blog entries. How anyone can think the amounts you were speaking of were monthly I will never know. As for the last parting shot about being American and your spending well that was uncalled for. I think this proves that we have plenty of jerks outside the USA. Yes that was cheap shot directed at you (wthell) so leave your unfounded anti American comments at home.
Please note I am not a right wing defender of the USA. I just dont care for unfounded comments about anyone.
January 22nd, 2008 at 2:58 pm
I think wthell needs to reread the amounts.
JD said he spent $2051 in 2007 on dining out. Thats ~$170 per month, or one date per week. I think many married couples would LOVE to be able to go out on a date together every week.
On the other hand, I think I’m afraid to know where someone is paying only $170/month in rent.
January 22nd, 2008 at 3:49 pm
I’m glad theres actually another male that likes cats. I love my fat 28 pound black cat almost as much as I love my daughter
January 22nd, 2008 at 4:00 pm
$7,941.02 spent on discretionary costs is insane!
THAT total (yearly obviously) is crazy to spend if you are on a budget!
Thats $662.00 per MONTH.
That is well over the $350 per month I spend on an apartement rental per month.
My food costs are $130
Cell phone is $43
Entertainment is about $60
Insurance is $74
My TOTAL monthly expenses is less then your fun spending, and I make $140,000 per year after taxes.
Thats why I am rich, and you are poor.
January 22nd, 2008 at 4:03 pm
Also, Im assuming people read your blog who got themselves into trouble by over spending or not realising the value of money, thats why everyone thinks that I thought your bills were monthly not yearly… as I explain above, you are out of your mind to spend that much money when you have any debt… and mortgage is a HUGE DEBT.
Geez, you guys really think that almost 700 per MONTH is a good number to be at for fun spending???
Go read http://www.thesimpledollar.com
At least he tries to cut his bills everymonth and understands the value of a dollar.
January 22nd, 2008 at 4:12 pm
@wthell
I read The Simple Dollar every day. It’s a great site.
Everyone thinks that you mistook my yearly totals for monthly because you wrote “You spent more money on eating out per month then I spend on rent!!!” This isn’t correct, so we assume you made some sort of error.
Also: nobody would ever consider me poor. I certainly don’t.
January 22nd, 2008 at 4:28 pm
WOW, very detailed. That is exactly what my wife and I have been attempting to get to. Most of your spending looks very in line with what is considered ‘normal’, but I agree with some of the other posters, have you tried to find a book swap service? Slightly used books versus new are night and day.
January 22nd, 2008 at 4:30 pm
wthell:
a) Where do you live?
b) Do you actually have friends or do anything outside of working? At $60, you sure aren’t dating.
c) Who gave you the rules as to what spending levels deserve moral outrage?
January 22nd, 2008 at 5:01 pm
@wthell: Is there a reason you are limiting your spending to such a low amount relative to your income? I’d be curious to see your personal financial goals and what you intend to do with all the money you’re amassing.
January 22nd, 2008 at 5:09 pm
Hmm… Mentioned paperback and dvd swap but do not see the comment.
Check those out for good deals.
January 22nd, 2008 at 5:27 pm
Since you started Get Fit Slowly, could you consider food a business expense, research or something?
January 22nd, 2008 at 6:05 pm
Wow @ wthell
You are certainly living on the smell of an oily rag - good on you for curbing your expenses. I am thinking you are single? It is much easier to be disciplined and accept a lot less in life when you only have yourself to look after. Renting is also considered by some schools of thought to be a waste of money whereas paying off a mortgage is creating a future investment….
We are all on different paths to the same destination - looking after our money and our future - but also LIVING in the present moment I would hope! Methinks I would rather be living J.D.’s joyful but careful existence….
J.D. - you are my first stop every morning - I love your honesty, your thoughtfulness and your largesse of spirit. Thankyou for sharing your progress - what a long way you have come, jolly well good on YOU.
Lorraine
January 22nd, 2008 at 6:34 pm
@wthell:
I am amazed at the restraint of my fellow commenters.
Assuming you are not just a troll, I think the difference between yourself and the rest of us here at GRS (including JD) is that we are trying to pay down debt and build wealth while actually living, and you on the other hand are following some sort of “deferred life plan” (to use Tim Ferris’s phrase). My guess is that you spend so much time at your job that you don’t have any time or energy for anything else — but you don’t plan on doing that forever. At some point you’ll cut back your hours and spring for a BMW and a house just off the fairway.
Some of us prefer a more balanced approach — saving a lot for tomorrow while still living today. Given that there are no guarantees in life and that you can’t take it with you when you die, I think it’s the most sensible approach.
January 22nd, 2008 at 6:46 pm
While I’m not sure what brought on the general tone of the comment, wthell does bring up a valid point. From a global perspective, Jd & I are rich. We can pay off our debt simply by focusing our spending in a smarter way and giving up some (but obviously not all) luxuries– things we had come to believe were necessities before we shifted focus. We are incredibly lucky. That said, we want to enjoy the present as well as prepare for our future. Do we occasionally spend more than we should? Definitely. Are we improving? Definitely.
January 22nd, 2008 at 7:30 pm
[chortle!] Did you realize researchers have discovered cats harbor and spread a parasite that causes some prey animals to lose their fear of cats, thereby making them…well, easy prey?
This has the led to the theory that Cat Ladies (and Cat Gentlemen) are infected by the parasite, explaining their infatuation with puddy tats.
Fifty cents a day for four cats is not bad! Especially if you’re factoring in the vet bills. The other day at my blog I calculated that I’ve spent something over $18,000 on my twelve-year-old German shepherd, all told.
She did chase off a prowler once, but since I don’t own 18 grand worth worth of stealable goods, it’s probably not an even deal.
January 22nd, 2008 at 7:33 pm
Yes from a global point you do spend a lot of money. We also live in country were electricity and indoor plumbing are considered basic needs. If we lived in shacks with dirt floors I’m sure your spending would be different.
I can’t even think of a reply to wthell. what you are saying is so asinine I don’t even know where to start. I hope that huge bank account your amassing is a real comfort to you when you realize how much of your life you missed living.
January 22nd, 2008 at 8:25 pm
Why are people fixating on dollar values here? Surely it’s all about the proportion of your income?
Anita Bell (who recommends everybody gets a Sanity Allowance - discretionary income for you to spend as you wish), believes your Sanity allowance should be 5-10% of your income. And it should be a higher percentage, the LESS you earn.
It’s going to be different for everyone.
JD maybe spends a lot, maybe doesn’t - the point is that he decided he wanted to spend less, and he HAS!
I’m enjoying this discussion a lot : )
January 22nd, 2008 at 8:37 pm
@Kazari
I’ve never heard of a “sanity allowance” before. I like the concept.
My discretionary spending used to make up 30% (or more of my income). That was crazy. Now it’s down in that 5-10% range…
January 22nd, 2008 at 9:41 pm
I can see wthnell’s point to some extent. I’d rather forgo the thousands of dollars worth of comic books and unnecessary book purchases and have that money invested or saved. I thought the point of the blog was to get rich, but most of the people here seem to want to live for today and not make any sacrifices.
January 22nd, 2008 at 10:03 pm
I’d like to add my voice to thanks and congratulations.
As for comic books, two friends and I “partner” up— each of us buys a title we are following, and we pass them around. maybe the morals of this are questionable, but we get to donate directly to the artists— we’ve been able to commission artwork with our savings!— and to the causes the artists and publishers support. We’ve also generated considerable buzz for them, because we discuss the titles on a bulletin board we share.
Hm… we should do potlucks…
January 22nd, 2008 at 10:43 pm
Wow. Now I know what to spend my money on if I ever stop living in Vancouver (home of the $1M starter home).
January 22nd, 2008 at 10:44 pm
I’m amazed at how accurate some of you guys track your expenses. What do you use and does it help to track it that detailed?
I looked into my account statements and found the following for the period between Oct 2006 and Oct 2007.
Total spending on “personal wants”: $4349
This includes a $1499 alu-carbon bike which I have estimated saving about $600 on gas and wear and tear on the car because I use it to commute. (Of course that’s a cash flow I don’t see because it is mainly an accrued cash flow).
There is $950 on a certification and about $250-300 on textbooks to go with other continuing education. I put this under entertainment since it is not strictly needed and because it would be hard to associate it with a future cash flow, but you never know.
This leaves about $1600. I know that about $800 of that went to a full set of hockey gear since I just started playing in an outdoor league. Add about $300 in playing fees and we get a seriously expensive hobby. The rest of the money went to two very nice tailor fitted suits.
It’s a good thing that most of these were one time expenses associated with start up costs from moving to a new place.
January 23rd, 2008 at 1:17 am
Great to see how your numbers look - i’ve never done this before but since i now keep a record of everything i spend, i’m looking forward to tallying everything up this year. The idea of working it all out and being successful by being sensible with my money is even making me look forward to my upcoming house-move, which will mean higher rent and higher food costs!
January 23rd, 2008 at 3:40 am
“I thought the point of the blog was to get rich, but most of the people here seem to want to live for today and not make any sacrifices.”
The point of this blog is to get rich SLOWLY. Meaning — sanely, in a manner that doesn’t defy living in the present. It also reminds us that getting RICH isn’t simply a matter of MONEY, rich is more than a bank balance.
Look — JD just paid off all his debt except for his mortgage. He did it by putting a priority on paying off the debt. Now, it’s true, he wasn’t doing it with Dave Ramsey-style gazelle intensity looking at his discretionary spending, but what JD isn’t telling us is how much income went towards debt repayment. I suspect if you compared the numbers side by side, his debt repayment would far exceed his discretionary spending.
Now — personally I’d like to think my numbers came in lower than JD’s. Realistically, I know they wouldn’t. I have learned after a couple of years of attempting to practice Dave Ramsey-style gazelle intensity that I have a personal limit to how much I can forgo. That doesn’t equate to not making sacrifices — and JD also never said he wasn’t making sacrifices. In fact — THE POINT he was making was that he’d made sacrifices and lowered the money he was spending in these categories.
I can go for a few months of really pouring on the debt repayment and denying myself a few simple pleasures, but the longer I go, the nastier a spending binge I end up having at some point. (NOTE: I’m not talking thousands of re-debting — its usually hundreds though. If I deny myself my short list of small “rewards”, I just reach a point where I can’t stop myself from spending indiscriminately in some store without reason. Usually it’s a bookstore and I walk out with a few hundred dollars of books I really could live without, and then I start spending it up at restaurants twice a day until I get a grip on myself.)
So rather than do that, I allow myself a certain measure of “unnecessary” discretionary spending. A few times a week I go to a coffee shop (where I spend a whopping $1.77 on a cup of the house coffee, which I like better than the fancy drinks. The point is, it’s an outing.)
I allow myself to eat out at lunch rather than taking a lunch — I don’t really care for brown-bag lunches so if I take my lunch 25% of the time and go out 75% of the time I consider that ok. I also go out to a restaurant twice on most weekends, usually for a less expensive lunch or breakfast.
When a movie comes out that I want to see, I go see it (trust me, this is rare — I think most of the movies coming out lately are garbage).
I go out for a splurgy high tea for my birthday (the ultimate in unnecessary spending is $30 for somebody to give you all the tea, cookies, and hors d’ouerves you can eat), a spa experience and a play. I’d LOVE to go to the symphony and theater more often — not to mention I’d go to the spa once a week if I could justify the expense — but I limit to once a year.
And, YES — I still spend money in bookstores. I try to keep it at $60 or less each month. I know I could go to the library or do the used book thing — frankly neither of those options replace the joy of reading a crisp, clean new book. So I compromise. I use the library part of the time and I buy new books. I’ve never had the comic book bug, but I have a list of DVDs I want to own so periodically I buy one of those to build my private collection.
I know there are other people in other countries who don’t have the discretionary spending power Americans have. Frankly, it doesn’t change that fact for them if *I* were to try to emulate their spending power. It doesn’t change their situation if I forego because I feel guilty on their behalf. That’s not the point of trying to be frugal.
But enough ranting from me.
January 23rd, 2008 at 4:14 am
@Jon G:
We emphasized living for today only in contrast to wthell’s claims of moral superiority through self-denial. Living below your means is a mantra (and a way of life) in this community, but it’s important that people understand that LBYM does not have to mean living like a monk. I’m afraid that people will read posts like wthell’s and be discouraged by the standard that is being set. People aren’t dumb — when presented with an all-or-nothing choice between saving and actually living, they will choose the only rational choice, which is living.
January 23rd, 2008 at 5:25 am
I’m still working to determine our discretionary spending from last year, having suffered hardware failure just after the first of the year. It’s caused me to be just a little behind. I expect ours to be up this year in the entertainment category as there are now two of us attending Faires and Festivals as often as possible. Other categories, like food, will be down as we tend to stay home more during the week.
Thanks, by the way, for sharing the URLs for the two band’s. I love finding new artists to listen to.
January 23rd, 2008 at 6:35 am
We track our expenses with Quicken. (somebody asked about that).
While we are working towards a better and more detailed budget, I like the idea of looking at
income - living expenses - saving/investing = discretionary spending.
For example, if you earn $100,000 and $30,000 goes to living expenses (house, utilities, insurance, transport, groceries) could you put $50,000 into savings/investing/paying off debt and then the remainder, $20,000, goes to discretionary spending?
Could you live on 1/2 of your income? Or if you are a 2 income family, can you live on 1 income and bank the 2nd income?
January 23rd, 2008 at 9:42 am
To all those people talking crap, living frugally means allocating your money and spending/not spending where YOU see fit. There are no set rules or magic formulas.
You don’t HAVE to live with one car if you are able to have two. And, you don’t have to invest.
J.D.’s out of debt. Enough said. The point is to inspire you to find your own way…so go do it and don’t point fingers.
January 23rd, 2008 at 11:05 am
vh:
I definitely caught that puddy tat parasite early on in life
JD:
Thanks for sharing your numbers with us. Sorry you have to deal with ridiculous personal attacks from nasty people.
In the past couple of years, when I was starting my new career, a large proportion of my discretionary spending went towards clothes and shoes. I decided that my clothing/shoe budget for 2008 would be $0 and I would use what I saved to pay off my law school student loan early. This took a huge leap of faith for me because I love to buy clothes and shoes! I decided to be radical on this one category because I knew I did not really NEED more clothing. Now that I’ve made the decision, I am really excited about it. I know it will be hard for me to stick to my decision, but it will be huge victory if I can do it. Have you considered doing something like that with one of your discretionary categories?
January 23rd, 2008 at 11:13 am
this is great, man!
also, the decemberists make me wet myself, they’re so good.
I need to crunch some numbers and specifics, this post is great.
January 23rd, 2008 at 1:30 pm
First off, live your life as you see fit (so long as you are within your means). $10 on comic books would not be worthwhile to me but I’m sure $700 is worthwhile to J.D. I spend almost $1,000 a year for my HD satellite TV service and I think it is worth every penny. Because I strive to be frugal I will regularly look for competing offers that are less money for an equivalent product. I also spent around 5% of my gross income on meals and drinks at restaurants/bars last year and $1,250 every month for my house payment. That is nothing like wthell. He will probably get richer, faster than I ever could.
Why should you still read my blog about money? Because I also invest over $1,000 a month and that money, if invested wisely, will make me a wealthy man one day. It is GET RICH SLOWLY and that is what J.D. and his readers and myself are all about. Lets lead a balanced life and have some fun. wthell obviously doesn’t get it; it’s his loss.
January 23rd, 2008 at 3:13 pm
Congratulations on getting out of debt, JD, and on lowering your spending.
Generally I like this blog and the comments, but I am somewhat worried by the “whatever works for you is great” argument. Spending money almost always means making ethical choices, but I don’t hear much about them on this blog. Paying off debt I agree is #1–debt is slavery. Building emergency funds, #2, sure. But where does charity, buying green, etc., come in? I think it should come maybe after debt and emergency funds, but before discretionary spending. I have a similar question for ultra-frugal people like the angry commenter. I am ultra-frugal, too, and I do not feel that I am “not living” (and it is insulting for others to assume what the good life is for others), but if I were more ethical I would spend more to buy organic, fair trade, local, union-made, sustainable, etc. Not “treating” myself with luxuries.
I do understand that people take one step at a time, and asking too much too soon makes people throw in the towel. So this isn’t a finger-wagging comment. I’m just sharing a discomfort I have with most personal finance blogs–the ethical component of how our spending effects others and the environment is usually an afterthought, if there at all.
January 23rd, 2008 at 5:37 pm
For Ruth
Ruth, you make some very good points there, and now I think about it - you are right - the green/ethical side of life is overlooked on a lot of the finance blogs. I have found the simple living/frugal type genre a lot better for the concerns you speak of.
I am very guilty of just what you emphasise and have to be honest and say the need for my young family to make the most of our money does not extend to environmental concerns as yet. I have to say though that as a by-product of living frugally, we have almost halved our electricity expenses and I would say we are buying generic goods which have so much less packaging so are probably throwing away 1/5 of the rubbish we used to. In our march towards living frugally we have started composting, and are starting a garden. I buy my fruit and vegies at the local market more for price but again, I am buying mostly organic and supporting local growers almostly accidentally. By buying secondhand clothes/goods etc, we are saving money AND keeping things from being landfill. By shunning consumerism as much as we are able, we also send our small message every time we refuse to buy Barbie or Gucci or McDonalds. I guess what I’m trying to say is that by virtue of living more carefully and moving towards frugality, there is probably a bit shift towards those ehtical concerns as a by-product.
And I have to say that comments such as yours make people like me sit up and think harder about my decisions. Thankyou Ruth.
Lorraine (the Accidental Greenie!)
January 23rd, 2008 at 8:46 pm
J.D.,
I looked on your spending. I need to remind you on one thing. I usually tend to increase my meal & entertainment costs whenever I am putting high pressure in lowering my overall spending while increasing income.
Colin Joss
East Lothian, Haddington
United Kingdom
January 23rd, 2008 at 10:38 pm
I thought I was obsessed about my detailed list but now I’m encouraged. I am planning to spend $30-40 a month on food this year. I am single, vegetarian,I eat no junk food, and I just realised I easily feel full but being with people who eat too much puts a toll on me because I constantly feel full (through eating to keep us with the Joneses). No more of that! This year, I have changes already being implemented. This is cool, thanks J.D.
January 24th, 2008 at 3:23 am
I’m still working to determine our discretionary spending from last year, having suffered hardware failure just after the first of the year. It’s caused me to be just a little behind. I expect ours to be up this year in the entertainment category as there are now two of us attending Faires and Festivals as much as possible. Other categories, like food, will be down as we tend to stay home more during the week.
Thanks, by the way, for sharing the URLs for the two band’s. I love finding new artists to listen to.
January 24th, 2008 at 8:02 am
[...] weekend. If you’re looking for a great example of tracking discretionary spending, check out this post by JD at [...]
January 24th, 2008 at 2:57 pm
I’m a little late getting to the party on this one, hopefully you periodically read the comments.
You mention that you bought some of your books with personal money when you should have (legitimately) used the business account. Expense the damn things and get your money back!
January 25th, 2008 at 7:00 am
Please note that there’s nothing inherently wrong with purchasing things that bring you joy.
This is a point that many of the personal finance bloggers I’ve seen overlook far too often. In fact, I tend to detect a decidedly ascetic undertone, almost to the point of religion, in most of the personal finance blogs I have seen. It’s almost as if they hate happineess. Yeah, going into debt for pleasure isn’t terribly smart, but it’s worse to forego all pleasure. If one has no pleasure in one’s life, what’s the point in living?
January 25th, 2008 at 11:16 am
To Flaime and others,
I agree that joy is a legitimate and good thing for people to pursue, and being miserable just to have money in the bank is overdoing it. Yet I also think that if we want to live in a better world than the one we currently inhabit, we need to think of other people’s joy as well, and to think of joy in a more long-term way. Some of the things I enjoy are bad for the environment. Some of them undermine workers rights. Some of them require the pain and death of other living creatures.
I don’t think that being ascetic is necessarily a virtue. I just would like to see more understanding and action (in my own life too) that our money choices are more complicated than “save it” or “spend it on whatever brings you pleasure.”
To Lorraine–It sounds like you are making great strides toward being both responsible and ethical with your money. I agree that often the frugal choice is also the ethical choice (like riding a scooter or a bike instead of a car when possible). But sometimes it isn’t. Local organic veggies are expensive where I live, and it’s hard for me to talk myself into buying them, although they would also be better for my health!
January 25th, 2008 at 7:45 pm
Actually, there is a simple rule to use with Frugality.. Keep your cost as a floor low and your earning as your roof high..
But we have to separate this from simply living cheap, because with frugality we can get healthier mean like eat more vegetables or even eat non-pesticide vegetables.. Also free from clutters.. and so on..
January 26th, 2008 at 4:35 am
[...] news, JD is not a chain-smoking lush. Okay, I mostly just wanted to lead with that sentence. (Read it at Get Rich [...]
January 27th, 2008 at 10:31 pm
Speaking about purchasing your joy..
We may also need to consider of optimizing the length of enjoyment and benefit of a product. If we want to be frugal, we should not purchase a product just because ours is rather old or doesn’t have the new features.
Colin Joss
East Lothian, Haddington
United Kingdom
February 5th, 2008 at 5:01 am
[...] re-evaluated my spending. I paid particular attention to recurring expenses. (I cut back to basic cable, for example, which [...]