Drama in Real Life: Wrecked Rental
Monday, 31st March 2008 (by J.D.)This article is about Cars, Choices, Insurance, Real-Life
When we arrived in San Francisco on Thursday, I rented a car. It was the first time I’d ever done so — we’ve never used one on vacation, and this was my first business trip. The whole car rental thing was a mystery to me.
When the man at the rental counter asked me what sort of insurance I wanted to purchase, I told him I had my own. In truth, I had forgotten to research my coverage. I was placing faith in what I’d read many times before — that car rentals are generally covered by your own auto insurance and by your credit card.
On Saturday we drove to Berkeley. Kris took me to a nice restaurant for my birthday lunch, and I made a stop at a comic book store. (Where I bought nothing, by the way — I’ve come a long way!)
We were driving back on University Avenue, stopped at an intersection, when a car slammed into us from behind.
My first thought wasn’t about the safety of those in the accident, but about how I hadn’t purchased the rental company’s insurance. I got out of the car and walked back to talk to the other driver, a Hispanic man about my age. “Are you okay?” I asked. He was. “Do you have insurance?” I asked. He did not.
We pulled onto a side street. While he called his wife, I phoned the Berkeley police. I had no idea what to do in the situation, but I figured I had to file an accident report to have any hope of settling with rental company.
As we waited for the police to arrive, I tried to convince the other driver to exchange information with me. He was reluctant to do so. Eventually he gave his name as José Hernandez. “I can just pay you cash,” said José.
“I can’t do that,” I said. “Maybe if it was my own car, but it’s not.” His English was fairly good, but he couldn’t seem to understand that the car was a rental, and that we were only visiting from out of town. Together, we looked at the damage to the vehicles. The rear bumper of my car was destroyed, but everything else seemed fine. The front end of his vehicle was scrunched, but the damage was entirely cosmetic.
I felt bad. I knew that by reporting the accident, the relative financial consequences for José would probably be far more severe than they would be for me if I didn’t report it. He might lose his job (he was driving to work when the accident occurred), he was likely to be fined, and if he were in the U.S. illegally, he might even be deported. By reporting the accident, I might be ruining his life. If I didn’t report it, all that would happen to me is that my emergency fund would be drained.
The three police officers who arrived on the scene grasped the situation immediately. When I expressed my concerns, one of them nodded and said, “Yeah, it’s tough, but you had to make the call. If you were in your own car, I can see trying to take care of it privately. But you’re in a rental. You had to do this.”
Did I? Leaving aside all the things that José was doing wrong — driving without a license or insurance, rear-ending somebody, possibly being in the U.S. illegally — was my own decision the right one? In the heat of the moment, I acted almost instinctively to protect myself. In retrospect I wonder if there were better options.
When we got back to the hotel, I called my insurance company. The rental is covered under my policy. From what I can tell, the $250 deductible will even be reimbursed by my credit card company. In theory, all this minor accident will cost me is a couple hours of my time. But it’s going to cost José much more.
Image by Incase Designs, and is not our accident.


I think if you really left aside that you were hit by someone without a license or insurance, you still made the right call here. As someone who was involved in an accident it’s really your responsibility to do this. I know the accident was pretty minor, but what would happen if you had some kind of medical issue as a result of the accident, or even José? The bumper might be nothing to replace, but suddenly you might have a pretty hefty medical bill.
I also think that although the consequences for the other driver are bad, it’s nothing that they couldn’t recover from. It also might be something that would get him to get a license and insurance in the future.
I’ve known several people that have been in accidents, given the other person the benefit of the doubt, and have been screwed over as a result. There is definitely a reason to be nice and helpful, but I can’t see the benefit of sticking your neck out financially in this situation.
I think that you’re right to be concerned that the effects on Jose might be catastrophic. And, I certainly think that if you had been in your own car and made private arrangements that might have been better.
Being the agent of bad thing sucks. But, it’s not your fault, sometimes the risks other people take on play out this way with consequences that may be out of all proportion to the offence.
I know how you feel: I’d be torn too. But, if you think about it, what if Jose is one of those reckless drivers that would have hit someone else, and this time killed them.
Wouldn’t you feel even worse? Yes, he may be in a lot of trouble now, but you may have saved someone else’s life. Just another thought!
$250 Deductible? Now that you have an emergency fund you should think about raising that to at least $1000. You’ll likely save in the long run due to a hefty discount on your car insurance. I’ve always been told you should only pay to insure what you can’t afford to insure yourself (with a good emergency fund that $250-$1000 deductible range is definitely affordable). Not to mention that filing those small claims (sub $1000) probably won’t go over well with your insurance carrier.
Hence the reason insurance is required. Good to know about the self-coverage situation, I’ll be sure to call my insurance company beforehand if I think I’ll be renting a vehicle.
I don’t think there is anything to be torn about. Why should you have to endure any risk because someone else whom you’ve never met chose to drive without insurance; or even a license?
I would be F’N P’Oed. To the point that I’d be asking the police about pressing charges and asking for whatever possible to ensure he never drives again. Of course, you can’t take the ignorant fools license away . . . because he didn’t have one. He should do jail time.
P.S. My insurance covers me in rental cars, I made sure it did when we signed up for it. Plus in any non-owned car since I don’t want to worry when I borrow a friends car to run to the store and some a-hole with no insurance drives like an idiot. I pay extra because other people don’t.
I think you did the right thing by reporting it.
I’m not sure what the local US laws are in relation to something like this, but in Australia, if the combined damage in a car accident is more than AUD$1000, you have to report it to the police.
Failing to report it can result in being charged with failing to report an accident, as well as causing issues when attempting to claim the repairs under insurance (the insurance companies will want to know the police report details).
Same as Scott and Plonkee here. I believe you made the right call here, even though it was a tough one to make.
I’d find it hard to feel any guilt for reporting the accident. The dude had no license, and no insurance, yet he accepted the risks and went out on the road anyways. Would it be different if he were drinking? Paying cash on the scene is what’s done in Mexico, but not here. He is 100% at fault. If you didn’t turn him in, he would just get in another possibly worse accident down the line, which he wouldn’t have been able to afford. If wealthy people didn’t prosecute less privileged people who damaged their property, we would become a lawless nation. What if Warren Buffett read-ended you, would you ask for more money than the actual damage, because he could afford it? Fault is fault, and the relative wealth of the at-fault shouldn’t be a factor.
You may feel bad about what happened - knowing that the guy will suffer consequences of his actions - but the truth is, he signed up for those consequences. I’m all for people coming to this country and making a living and becoming citizens. I think that’s a VERY American thing to do. However, once you live in this country, you need to be a law-abiding citizen, and that includes being licensed and insured if you’re going to drive a car. I’m sure he could have been on a bus or riding a bicycle instead of driving a car illegally and ruining your weekend.
I have to say I agree with Frugal Bachelor. Fault is fault, not to mention that since he rear ended you he is at fault. My personal feeling also are they if he is here illegally all the more reason to report it properly, he shouldn’t be here anyway.
Putting aside other considerations (rental vehicle, sympathy for at-fault driver, possibly minor damage), as Scott mentioned, the risk of the other driving suing you alone is reason enough to report it. A police report goes a long way in preventing insurance fraud by the other driver.
I do not say this to insinuate anything about the driver in particular that hit you, only that it is almost always in your interest to have it reported when you are not at fault, and always when there is the slightest chance of any serious damage (which anything over 3-5 mph is a risk).
As Frugal Bachelor said, you should not feel guilt over reporting an accident.
If someone is going to do something illegal, or stupid, he/she has to accept the fullest of the consequences before even starting. This applies to anything in a person’s life.
Everything that happened was the other driver’s fault. There is no question that you should have reported it.
Personally, I think you did the right thing.
The lesson here is to do your research on what’s covered by your auto insurance before you go on a trip. One little phone call, 7 buttons on a phone and you can get a little peace of mind at the rental counter AND if you have an accident.
It could have been worse for Jose, he could’ve hit a trial lawyer!
You did the right thing; no doubt. Think about yourself and your family first before considering the inconvenience to strangers. Especially those that ignore the risks of their behavior.
What made you think that the other driver was in the country illegally was it because he was Hispanic? Because we have a lot of great us citizens that are Hispanic.
You did totally the right thing.
I got in fender bender when I was a student, but had insurance. The woman who hit me, was my age, driving her uncle’s car.
After chasing her and her uncle for ages, hoping to settle it privately, and save my premiums, it became quite clear that none of them had any insurance. I ended up spending about $100 fixing my car and they were left with significantly more damage they had to pay for themselves.
Luckily no-one was hurt, but I stupidly didn’t call the police. Insurance should be mandatory for everyone’s protection, regardless of status.
I am sorry to say but you shouldn’t really feel guilty about reporting the accident. The other driver made his choices to drive without a license or insurance and then hit you with his car (ok maybe he didn’t choose to do this but he did do it) These are his mistakes and you should feel no obligation what so ever to pay for his bad decisions.
This is one of my worst nightmares. Can you even imagine if your insurance didn’t cover it???
Feeling guilty? Why? B/c some unlicensed, uninsured, illegal alien driver ass-ended your rental car? No Way!
The LAW requires you to make an accident report. Your CONTRACT with the rental company requires you to make an accident report with the police. This way both you & him are protected. Now any possible medical issues are also covered by your car insurance & health insurance.
Don’t let a bleeding heart make you break the law or expose yourself to financial ruin!
Think of the costs that illegals impose on your taxes b/c of the government services they use…most w/o illegals paying any taxes themselves.
Echoing the chorus above, you have nothing to feel guilty or torn about. Had your insurance NOT covered the rental car, should someone else have been responsible?
Perhaps a post on personal responsibility and the results of our choices, good and bad, would be an appropriate follow-up.
I cried reading this because I too, would have made the same choices but would have felt the same sorrow. I am so sorry you experienced this and your personal struggle with this really touched me. Thank you for sharing a very personal experience and it makes me think about being prepared if I am ever faced with this decision. Bless you for the struggle you feel in your heart.
JD –
Will your insurance cover the rental company’s lost revenue on the car while it’s being repaired? I believe that you agree to pay this in the agreements of many rental companies — and I thought that personal car insurance would NOT cover this portion of the claim.
Please correct me if I’m wrong — I’d love to know the “real” answer (versus what I think I know.)
I’ve never heard of the lost revenue being covered, but JD isn’t liable for this accident as he didn’t cause it.
As for reporting this accident, JD, I’ve been in a rental car accident before that I wasn’t at fault for. You did the right thing reporting it. And I would caution you to watch every little thing the rental agency does because mine, even though the accident was not our fault, still came after us for the cost to the point where we had to take them to court to get the to cease and desist with a fradulent claim. And its a national car rental company. Make sure you have every bit of supporting documentation.
And, as far as the consequences of reporting the accident, I can tell you a story about my father, who was hit by a driver who sped through an intersection. Turned out that guy was an international fugitive from justice, and him clipping my dad’s rental was the break the cops needed in catching him. I doubt your guy is such, but well, its an interesting story!
Oh, and many years later I front ended a car backing up into a parking space. Since it was his car and my car, I had little desire to involve the insurance company for what was cosmetic damage. We exchanged information and he got two estimates for repair, the lowest one we had agreed I would pay. It was 800 bucks, which I paid to him in a cashier’s check. No problems since. I’ve been a much better driver after paying real money for my lack of concentration.
I do however, take issue with some commentators about their attitude towards immigrants. JD doesn’t know if Jose was illegal. Jose could have been on a work permit, or had a green card. There are a number of possibilities. Why are we jumping on the fear that he may have been an illegal when we have no facts to back that up?
I can hardly get upset at folks who are coming to our country to get ahead because their country is just that bad. Maybe its because I still remember being told 1 set of my grandparents came to this country through legal and non-legal channels to escape the Nazis. We don’t know if he was legal or illegal, and to assume that he is illegal because of his name and lack of insurance smacks of something this country needs to leave behind. We don’t know, and therefore, we shouldn’t assume. His status had no bearing on the fact that JD was right in reporting the accident.
I agree that Jose pretty much accepted these consequences when he opted to drive; I think you made the right call JD. As for the cries for jailtime for Jose… really? Your attention has never lapsed and *almost* got you into an accident? Do you think you deserve jail time for it?
And mayrland, would you rather bathrooms not get cleaned or houses built?
JD, the fact that he offered you cash indicates that he was aware of what was about to happen.
I do appreciate the compassion you have towards him though.
One thing confuses me…
Where do you get the idea that he might have been in the country illegally? Simply because his name was Jose?
Sorry about the accident. I’m glad no one was hurt.
That is a terrible situation to be in, but it may be instructive for the rest of us who empathize with folks in Jose’s situation.
Given that insurance covered the accident, what would have happened if you had let Jose leave?
I don’t think, I know you did the right thing. All of the bad things that can happen to Jose he did to himself. He chose his own path, just like you chose to have insurance and be responsible for your own life. He chose to not be responsible for anything.
That being said, I’m not sure how bad his life will really be. No way they collect any money from him. If he does lose his job and get deported, he will just sneak back over, and probably end up with a very similiar job. We end up paying for his mistakes, because we do the right thing and have insurance.
This is a minor example of the credit/mortgage mess. The responsible people get punished for the irresponsible people’s behavior.
I definitely understand why you’d be torn, but you did make the right decision. As others have stated, the next time he could kill somebody. This accident was his fault and you really had no other option. You did have to look out for yourself.
Unlicensed, Uninsured, and perhaps illegal alien hits you in the rear and you feel guilty for calling the police???
Oh my gosh. You must be kidding. The guy is a law breaker. He chose to get behind the wheel under those conditions.
Punishment is not necesarily a bad thing. It has it’s purpose in life. It teaches us good things. I think you should feel guilty if you deprive him of THAT!
JD,
I think you’re quandary is real and I would probably be concerned either way. I wanted to point something out in your post, and I am making remark of your comment about him possibly being illegal. Had you hit another non-Latino/Hispanic individual you would never have entered that into your processing so I think regardless of evidence that the Latino/Hispanic community makes up a large proportion of of our immigrant population both legal and illegal (http://usinfo.state.gov/
journals/itsv/0699/ijse/portrait.html), I think it is unfair to apply that to Mr. Jose and unfair to you to feel responsible for his consequences or choices. I just think it is not fair to him or you to project that unto him. If he is in all of those predicaments woe is him but he chose all of those things for whatever reasons not you.
Again, to H_Roarke and Maryland, we have no confirmation that Jose was an illegal. He could have been many things. Such attitude is just as frightening to me as someone driving without a license.
Let’s handle the facts, and not make assumptions.
You did what you had to do, legally and morally. You never know who you are dealing with, and by not reporting an accident you could set yourself up for a lawsuit later on (person leaves the scene appearing fine, decides they have a “neck injury” and sues you for pain and suffering). Without a police report you have nothing to help prove fault, and no written documentation of the accident. I would have done the same thing.
J,
“I agree that Jose pretty much accepted these consequences when he opted to drive; I think you made the right call JD. As for the cries for jailtime for Jose… really? Your attention has never lapsed and *almost* got you into an accident? Do you think you deserve jail time for it?”
Actually, I have a license that allows me to operate a vehicle. I have my car inspected every year to make sure all the safety equipment is functioning. I replace my tires and brakes when needed to ensure the safety of my family. Plus I have insurance that covers me in case all of those precautions fail and I just HAD to turn up the radio while the deer ran across the street. . . that’s why most accidents don’t require someone jailed. This one there is only one person at fault, and that person chose to break the law in order and risk everyone else; he lost his bet, we shouldn’t.
I know it’s hard, but remember not to feel responsible for putting Jose in this situation. His personal situation, his choices, the political situation, and his driving put him in this situation. Not you.
You did entirely the right thing, the police officer was right.
But dayahm, you’re lucky the insurance covered you! Naughty for not checking first. I mean, hell, that sounds like the sort of thing i’d do. :~P
I sympathize with you as I was in an accident with a truck driver, who probably lost his career as a result. And I was just some punk teenager who should have known better than to hang out in the blind spot of a semi. I think your compassion does you a lot of credit.
Now might be a good time to leaf through a Greek tragedy from high school. Sometimes fate just puts you in a bad situation.
let’s see what it’s like to comment from an iPhone. I’m in the airport.
First, of course there’s no way to know whether Jose is legal or not, and I’m not assuming he is. HOWEVeR based on a number of factors not germaine to this story, I do believe it’s possible.
Second, there’s no question he’s at fault and I know that. As someone else noted, I guess I just hate being the agent of I’ll fortune. Somebody else mentioned the possibility of a lawsuit if I had left the accident unreported. That’s a good point.
Finally, I do think it’s a good idea to raise my deductible!
More later when I get back to Oregon!
Hang on, folks. The feeling that Jose might be an illegal alien seemed to have been brought about by an unwillingness to share information.
That said, JD, that you considered how this accident, which was not your fault, was going to affect the other person, shows that you are a considerate person, and makes you a good person in my book. On the other hand, you are not, cannot be, responsible for other people’s decisions and actions. Let’s all hope that Jose learned something positive from the experience.
I like how the iphone turned ill into I’ll…
I admire the fact that you thought about and considered the impact on Jose.
In my book, that makes you a good man.
True, he might just be a careless driver and knock someone else and may cause more harm, or he may have just finished his 2nd job and on his way to his 3rd one. God knows.
JD, I have a lot of respect for you - you’re obviously a considerate guy. I would have felt the same way.
I think that it’s reasonable to suspect that he’s not a citizen - why else would someone drive without a license? I say this as a (legal) alien in the US myself (of course, I’m entitled to and have a license and insurance). I see the human side - he’s most likely a victim of circumstance.
You might be underestimating the trouble you could get into for not reporting it though - the truth would eventually come out - if not, you’d have to lie repeatedly in your dealings with the insurance company and the police.
Thank you for your comment JerichoHill!
Amen!
of course you did the right thing in reporting it immediately.. if you had tried to make private arrangements.. three days later he could have just decided it was your fault.. or just lied on the phone that it wasn’t him driving the car etc.. and you would be screwed… or he could have had a ‘friend’ magically appear as an injured passentger in the unreported accident.. who sues you for being responsible for stopping when the light wasn’t even red.. which is a semi believeable lie since you are new in town and driving on that road for the firsttime in your life… and then youd be really screwed.. the degree to which you are beating yourself up about this is just a measure of your liberal guilt.. get over it.. and of course thanks for hopefully stopping this illegal from being on the road and possibly injuring my family..
It’s extremely sad that a couple of commenters here jumped on the “Hispanic = illegal” vibe and ran with it. Come on, man. (Of course, J.D., you know the facts.)
That all said and at the risk of making this an echo chamber, you were absolutely in the right. If you took the cash or didn’t call the cops then you were taking an *enormous* risk. There’s no reason to put one’s self in that position, hence, insurance. And while I’m a pretty sympathetic guy too, Jose is the one who chose not to have insurance (and possibly break the law) - his reasons are his own, but he took the risk.
Sorry to hear about the accident, though… they’re not fun no matter whose car you’re driving.
I’ve come to believe that even in more “normal” circumstances (e.g. driving your own car in your home town) you’re best off calling the police and going through insurance. I was in an accident a while back where I was hit from behind; the damage to my car looked minor, but I called the police anyway. I did agree to let the other driver pay cash for the repairs rather than go through insurance, though.
Of course, once I got estimates it turned out the entire bumper had to be replaced - the cost was well over $1000 including painting, rental car, etc. The other driver gave me an extremely hard time over this - claiming I was ripping him off, offering to have a friend “bang out the dent” instead, etc. In the end, the police report was the only leverage I had, and I still wound up losing $$$ on the deal.
The end result was that it cost me a lot of time and frustration, and it probably wound up costing the other driver more than if he had just filed the claim and moved on. I now think that in these situations it is best for everyone if you just keep it simple and follow the rules - don’t complicate things by trying to be a nice guy.
The other thing that I’ve learned is that if you’re in your mid to late thirties, don’t let anything you think you know about cars cloud your judgement about how severe an accident is - cars now are nothing like the cars I drove (and worked on myself) in high school
It’s natural to feel bad about potential consequences, but — maybe take a step back and be grateful that he got a wake-up call about driving uninsured, without the consequences being worse. He could have hurt someone, but instead this was an accident where everyone walked away, and ultimately, that’s all that matters.
iPhones are lovely devices but need to be trained.
I absolutely hate it when people drive without insurance. It’s a mortal sin, in my opinion, not venial. Sometimes, a driver is in an accident with someone who doesn’t _need_ insurance, like, say, a pedestrian in a crosswalk.
The driver who did that actually had insurance. If she hadn’t, I might have been put in the position of having to really mess up her life in order to get my medical bills paid. As it was, I think all that happened was that she lost her license for a few months and had to pay the deductible on her insurance, instead of having to pay for doctor visits, MRIs, lost work, etc.
That was a difficult choice to make, but I feel it was the right one. The driver should consider himself lucky that you were not hurt. It could have been a lot worse for him and for you.
Definitely check into increasing your deductible!
I second FMF’s question about the so-called “loss of use” of the rental car while it’s being repaired. Please let us know how much trouble the car rental company gives you and who (auto insurance or credit card company) pays for what. Thanks!
Offering cash, reluctant to deal with the cops…give me a break, PC Police. The guy’s doing something shady. Get off your UN high horses.
You did the right thing, JD. It isn’t your job to coddle people who are knowingly breaking the law.
I’ve worked in immigration law. He won’t be deported. Our country is way to bogged down in other stuff to follow through on deportation (typically) unless a felony is involved (or a few other crimes) or unless they do a specific raid looking for “illegals.”
Plus, car rental companies are insane regarding how much they often try to charge for damage on cars. If this wasn’t covered by insurance, you might have been out more than your emergency fund.
You did ABSOLUTELY, the right thing. No question. You must always cover your own behind. Don’t worry about what it “may” cost someone that may be driving illegally, or worse.
Your blog is dedicated to personal responsibility - for your own finances and family. I’m a little surprised that you would be so gung-ho to help someone avoid personal responsibility.
If you feel bad, why don’t you just give Jose your emergency fund? That would be a way to show mercy without allowing him to avoid his responsibility.
Andy, there are lots of reasons people would not have a license. I don’t think I personally know anyone who is in this country illegally, but I do personally know several people who don’t have a license but drive anyway.
JerichoHill Says:
“March 31st, 2008 at 6:36 am
Again, to H_Roarke and Maryland, we have no confirmation that Jose was an illegal. He could have been many things. Such attitude is just as frightening to me as someone driving without a license.
Let’s handle the facts, and not make assumptions.”
I was commenting based on the assumptions/possibilities made in the post:
“He might lose his job (he was driving to work when the accident occurred), he was likely to be fined, and if he were in the U.S. illegally, he might even be deported.”
JerichoHill, you weren’t unhappy I assumed he was illegal. You were unhappy because I didn’t show any empathy for Jose. Thus, this makes me anti-illegal in your book. I don’t care if he is illegal, legal or natural born citizen. Not having a driver’s license or any insurance makes him irresponsible and deserved of any consequences. I feel no pitty for him.
In California, car insurance is mandatory as is a license, so this guy was breaking the laws. When someone makes a choice, they must live with the consequences and outcomes, be it driving with no insurance and no license or calling the police. This guy tried to buy his way out of the consequences of his decision. You refused to be bought and did the correct thing by calling the police and reporting the accident. If he had no license, it means either he didn’t feel he could pass the test or the state of California felt he was not fit to be a driver of about 2,000 lbs of destructive metal.
I really respect your thought process and appreciate that your heart is in the right place. However, the decisions we make are the ones we live by. Your decision to obey the law and the contract you signed with the rental agency had to be honored. Jose decided not honor the law and broke the “contract”.
If it’s any consolation to you, living in the Bay Area is one of the best places to be if you don’t have a car. Compared to the rest of the country, the public transit there is amazing (I could have lived there without a car).
So even though Jose will have to pay for the accident and may not get a license in the future, the Bart and bus systems there are great and I bet this won’t ruin his working life not having a car.
To even be concerned about Jose being deported is insane.
That has nothing to do with the fact that he hit you.
And if he was here illegally and does get deported, that’s one less bad driver here in the US.
What if you had actually been physically hurt in the accident, J.D.? Broken arm, broken leg? What about your wife? What if she had been hurt? Some type of injury that could have affected the both of you for the rest of your lives?
When it comes to situations like these, YOU and you’re family are the PRIORITY. You’re feelings about what might happen to the other person are of no consequence.
Just to clarify: He did hit YOU, right? You seem like a really nice guy, but don’t be such a bleeding heart, especially when you let that take precedence over you and your own.
And you went to a comic shop and bought nothing?! Are you insane! There is so much good stuff coming out right now! Here are some suggestions:
The Incredible Herc
Kick-Ass
Gravel
All Star Superman
Avengers: The Initiative
Uncanny X-men
The Walking Dead
Scalped
Punisher
Iron Fist
And the list could go on and on!
Anyway, you could save a lot of money just waiting and getting the in trades or getting the entire runs off of eBay.
Personal responsibility is a cornerstone of sound personal finance, yet you seem to be happy to ignore that in this case. When there is an accident, you call the police. That’s what the law prescribes. IF someone is here illegally, and this causes a problem, that’s they way it goes. Remember, IF that’s the case, and he was here *illegally* that’s on him or her.
PLUS, he was breaking the law by not having insurance.
We are responsible for our actions, or inactions.
I am glade that all of you are ok, although this is such a hassle.
I hope Jose is ok as well.
In the case that he does happen to be here illegally:
Who cares if he gets deported, he doesn’t belong here in the first place.
I too am from another country. I am here LEGALLY…it’s not that hard to do…fill out the forms, pay your money, wait…
I married a US citizen and moved here. There were MANY hoops to jump through to gain my status, and I jumped every one of them because I wanted to be here.
Who cares if he loses his job. As an illegal it is probably not income reported the IRS and therefore not taxed. I pay my taxes, insure my vehicles, have a driver’s license.
By his actions he obvioulsy knew what he was doing was wrong…he CHOSE to act illegally. Good for you for getting something done.
Stand up for your country USA…if people aren’t here leagally, get rid of them PERIOD
IF they claim they cannot return to their home country for whatever reason, file the appropriate paper work at the border…you know, at a crossing where there are guards…not some fence you jumped to get here.
I’ll get off my soapbox now
You are not responsible for someone else’s life decisions. I wouldn’t have felt guilty at all. Did you choose to be run into?
I have been in this situation before, rear-ended by someone with no insurance & no license. he ended up showing up AT MY HOUSE to try & “convince” me to drop it.
Wow, what a horrible experience. Sadly, Jose will pay for his mistakes, but your situation didn’t warrant you making any other call. For that, you did the right thing.
As an insurance rep, I’d like to offer one piece of advice. Always ask the rental car company the cost of their insurance and what their policy is on “loss of use”. This is why:
Your insurance policy might cover the cost of repairs, but it will NOT cover the rental car company for “loss of use.” That means you might end up having to pay for the days the rental car could not be rented to others while it’s in the shop being repaired. In most cases you will not be responsible for loss of use if you purchase the insurance coverage the rental car company offers. It might cost a few dollars more initially, but it’s better than paying for time on a car no one is able to use…
You did the correct and right thing. If the man lives in San Francisco, then driving without a license and insurance is not only stupid, it’s criminally so. San Fran has a very good pubic transit system that tens of thousands of people use to get back and forth to work every day.
As for loss of use on the rental car, it depends on which credit card you used to pay for the car. MasterCard has some pretty strong policies that many rental agencies refuse to follow (they want fleet logs). Visa has a more forgiving policy and, from the information I have seen, will cover a lot more of these types of charges, to an extent.
It’s funny this should come up today…I was just reading an article about it on Friday (though, I can’t for the life of me remember where…USA Today maybe?)
We rent occasionally. We have personal insurance for passenger cars, so if we rent the same class of car, or smaller, we are covered. If we rent a larger class vehicle, such as a truck (sometimes SUV), we are not covered. That’s a different category of insurance coverage. And, as someone else said, you are pulling against your own insurance company. All-in-all, as we usually only rent for 2-4 days, we find it worthwhile to buy the rental car comprehensive they-take-care-of-everything for $15 per day extra. Worth it for peace of mind to me. We have had the company “take advantage” of that, I think, by claiming a nick in the bumper so they could have their insurance cover it. Not reported anywhere (so they say). Now, Clark Howard always says take full photos of car going out and getting returned (if your phone can take photos, terrific!) But I’ve never had a camera that would allow me to walk around a car and take every fender, and interior-exterior photos at beginning and end of trip. Overall, we’ve probably rented cars about 30 times over the past 8 years, and we’ve only had that one nick to deal with.
Illegal alien drivers with no license or insurance get off a lot easier than you would in the same situation. In fact, if I am ever in an accident, I can only hope that I get the same treatment as an illegal.
If there is one thing I’ve learned about finance is that we are our own agents of fortune. You didn’t make him drive without insurance, you didn’t make him run into you. Whether he is here legally or not would be his own choice as well. If he’s in a ditch - he dug it himself.
On the flipside - had you not had the extra money to pay for the deductable or didn’t have the proper coverage - would you feel so bad for him? Granted I can’t answer for you, but I think the running majority of people still struggling with finances would be massively PO’d at yet another expense.
Rotten things happen to people every day. All you can do is take care of yourself and your family and hope everyone else has enough sense to do the same.
I’m glad no one was hurt though! That’s way worse than any loss of money.
Don’t beat yourself up over it. Anyone and everyone is welcome in this country, but only if they follow the rules. The same is expected of any person visiting any country — follow the local laws, or get out. Jose was not abiding by the rules, and considering how simple it is to follow those rules in the first place, I don’t imagine he cared to bother.
Another thought…I’ve worked for insurance companies and lived in California…so I’ve seen both sides of the picture. But California has the highest rate of insurance fraud related to cars in the nation (and perhaps in the world). That’s part of the reason California has the highest insurance rates for similarly populated areas. Reporting accidents and getting people who drive without adequate insurance and proper licensing is the first step in reducing the fraud and dangers that make California insurance so high.
I am actually a claims adjuster for a national insurance carrier, and situations like this arise way more frequently than you may think.
First off, the rental company is going to handle all of the repairs to the rental car. They will charge you the deductible when you return the damaged rental car, and will follow up with your insurance carrier seeking reimbursement for any outstanding amounts. In my personal experience, rental agencies will always ASK for loss of use and frequently an administrative fee for handling the claim. However, the insurance carrier is not required to pay the administrative fee because we didn’t require them to handle the claim in the first place. They could have allowed the insurance company to handle it. And regarding the loss of use, they have to provide proof that there were no other cars available for them to rent and that there was somebody who actually needed to rent it. When you start asking for proof, the rental company will waive the loss of use as it is a hassle for them to gather all of the documentation. The rental agencies don’t go after the renter to get that money back. They already have your deductible. And the insurance company never denied the claim, they are just asking for some kind of documentation to verify.
P.S. - If you paid for the rental with a credit card, the credit card usually has insurance that will reimburse your insurance deductible.
Let me get this straight. Your car was rear ended by an illegal alien with no driver’s license, no insurance. He hit you. Now you’re wallowing in white guilt because a triple criminal might get deported. Want to bet he’s working on a fake SS number and his family is collecting welfare and food stamps paid for by California’s legal taxpayers? Would it have been better to not report the accident and have him sue you and collect later, plus pressing charges for your leaving the scene of an accident? The ACLU (your tax dollars at work!) would back this criminal and take your hard earned money without batting an eye. The well behaved American middle class is seen as a cash cow begging to be milked. You’re a dear man, but you need to grow up! He’s the criminal and he was as fault. You need feel NO guilt.
you did what you had to and being in the country illegally - if Jose is an illegal immigrant - was his choice as well so his problems are his own, not yours. I am an immigrant as well so I know a bit about the immigration issue and the fact that some people sneak over the border is an insult and a disgrace to the other immigrants who HAVE to wait to come to the US. My family waited 12 years - yes, twelve long years - for our papers to be legally and properly processed. If someone decides to cut in line in front of me and gets penalized for it, that is fine…when they crossed the border illegally they KNEW the risks and having to pay for it if caught is part of the game.
You feel bad for this person because he might be here illegally? I feel bad for the low income people that have trouble paying for high car insurance because of people like him! I’ve known quite a few people who have emigrated to the U.S. legally. It IS possible!
Now for the rest of your story, it’s a good reminder for everyone to check with their insurance company first before renting a car. It can vary from company to company and also from policy to policy.
As Adriana said, he might go on & do worse things if you didn’t do the right thing. You did the right thing.
I’ve called the cops upon seeing kids without their seat belts on, bouncing around the back seat of cars. Maybe the parents don’t have money to pay the fine, but if they got in an accident & the kids flew through the windshield, I’d feel horrible. Do the right thing, and you’ll have a clear conscience.
Are you kidding! Seriously you can not feel bad because Jose put himself into a bad situation. If you had hit him I could see feeling “torn” about the outcome but not only was he breaking several laws but he hit you. I grew up in Phoenix, lived there 25 years, and I’ve learned one very important fact, There are too many illegal immigrants. It’s an unfortunate and true fact of our country that we don’t have a good method to deal with immigrants nor do we have the infrastructure to support these families when the arrive and break our laws.
Now before any of you start thinking I’m some racist redneck know this, I’m very liberal when it comes to helping the less fortunate and most of my best friends are in fact Hispanic. The sad part is that most of my hispanic friends that came here legally feel the same way I do about the illegal imagration situation. They worked hard to come to this country only to watch people cross the rio and flaunt the laws that they had to take an oath to obey.
I know that there are thousands of homeless, veterans, and elderly across this country that need our help so every time you feel like helping someone direct your efforts at the more deserving among us that need our help. Don’t spend time or money assisting people that came to this country illegally and don’t pay taxes.
Also know that I was once in an accident with an illegal immigrant. The accident was my fault and I handled it privately without calling the police out of consideration for the man that I inconvenienced with my actions.
José made plenty of choices in his life to get him in that situation before he met you. I wouldn’t feel guilty for his decisions.
In the mid-80’s my father was rear ended by a no-insurance driver. He decided to trust the guy and settle privately. Well, the guy provided false information and my father had little recourse. The “minor ding” in the bumper turned out to be frame damage when it got to the shop, and my dad was out hundreds of dollars.
“What made you think that the other driver was in the country illegally was it because he was Hispanic? Because we have a lot of great us citizens that are Hispanic.”
If he was driving without a license or insurance he was not being a great citizen, regardless of ethnicity (or nationality, for that matter).
JD, I completely understand your dilemma. It’s tough to know that, if everything worked out perfectly, both you and he could go on about your lives with practically zero change… but because you have to expect something won’t go perfectly, your life will proceed unaltered and his may change drastically for the worse.
It’s just tough to be a part of a situation where you are ethically and responsibly bound to tip that second domino (his fault in the accident was the first) that could lead to great troubles for someone else.
You did the right thing. He’s in charge of mitigating the risk to him and his family, you’re in charge of mitigating the risk to you and yours. His lack of responsibility with regards to protecting himself and others while driving indicates that he’d show a similar lack of responsibility in making sure you didn’t get screwed over.
God, that is tough. I don’t envy the decision you had to make, it’s hard knowing that taking care of yourself will have much dire consequences for another party.
One thing I haven’t seen here — *if* “Jose” wasn’t here legally, in most (all?) states he wouldn’t have been able to get a driver’s license and insurance.
If we allowed drivers (here legally or not) to get a valid driver’s license and insurance, possibly J.D. wouldn’t haven’t had to decide anything. It would have gone to the respective insurance companies and that would have been it.
A driver’s license is only a device that (1) shows that you have passed the requirements for operating a vehicle and (2) as state-issued I.D. I don’t understand how people think that it also means that it says you are in the country legally.
Even if all who passed the requirements for a driver’s license were able to get a license (here in the country legally or not), “Jose” may not wanted to get a license and insurance and J.D. would have been in the same position.
Of course, “Jose” might be here legally (and no one here knows one way or the other).
You did the right thing. Don’t feel bad about it. Jose was taking a huge risk in driving w/o insurance whether he is legal or illegal. I’m surprised he stopped and stayed for the police. Where I live most people (Americans w/o insurance) wouldn’t do that. I’ve been in a hit and run twice and I know several people who have as well and the uninsured American took off. Jose is probably a decent person if he stayed for the police. Even if he was illegal and gets deported good things will happen for by being honest.
BTW I don’t think I would ever take cash for a car accident - even if it was good ole’ greenbacks and not a check. As tempting as it might be to save time you just never know how much it will cost to fix the car. Every time I’ve been in an accident the cost to fix was way more than I thought it would be. And usually our cars are so old they are less than $8k in value - it doesn’t take much to total an $8k car.
That’s a tough one. I think you made the right call. Not only would you have possibly had to drain your emergency fund, a lot of time (and stress) would have been spent trying to rectify the situation with the rental company. This is a good reminder for everyone to understand their coverage, especially so people don’t have to pay the obscene insurance rates from the rental company if it is not necessary.
I think when I was single I would have been more inclined to deal with it myself, but now that I am married and have someone else’s financial recources at stake I would have called the police for an accident report.
I feel really bad for the other driver. Hopefully things will work out ok for him.
You made the right decision. I work for a major auto insurance company, and previously worked for a major rental car company. You are very lucky things worked out for you. You have to remember you didn’t know what the outcome was going to be. Filing a police report was a way of protecting yourself. What if he tried to file a claim for damages or injuries against you? He still could. At least the report will be there to back up your statement.
You made the right call 100%. If the other driver was being responsible for himself he would have no problems. He took a risk and now it is time for him to own up to it.
Bummer that you had the bad luck to have a wreck the first time you have a rental. I’ve rented about a dozen times in the last year and have not had any problems, but I’m always nervous about the potential headache.
I’m currently considering a change to my insurance deductibles. Right now they are $250 for collision and $0 for comprehensive. I’m a bit apprehensive to change them however because it would only reduce my monthly bill by 10% but it would more than double my liability if there is an accident. I’m torn…
A sad situation, but you did the right thing. The rental car company would need a police report regardless (I worked for Enterprise in the past).
99% of the time, you are covered under your own insurance — but it does pay to check! If you had liability only, I think, in this case you would be in some trouble. You wouldn’t have collision to cover you if the other person isn’t covered.
We were heavily pressured to push the insurance on renters. It can pay off, but only in limited circumstances.
Also, Jose knew the risk he was running by coming to this country, possibly illegally, and driving illegally. (Well, he may not have known the law, but if he is going to live here he needs to know the law.) As others mentioned, even if this wasn’t about Jose and it was instead John Doe, US Citizen, you would still need to call.
As with everyone else, I think you did the right thing, although I certainly appreciate your compassion for the other driver.
A very similar thing happened to me awhile back in Northern British Columbia. I’m from Toronto, but I had a rental car out of Vancouver and was staying in Prince George when I was rear-ended at a stop light by a pickup truck full of…well…rednecks.
After hitting me they immediately drove off. I pulled over and my girlfriend, her friend and I inspected the damage. They eventually came back after 5 minutes and said to “just cover the bumper with dirt and they won’t notice”. It was a huge 20cm gash about 3cm deep. =-I
After haggling and threatening to call the police, I eventually convinced him to hand over his insurance details. He tried to intimidate us and offer us cash on the spot as well, but we refused. We were students and didn’t want to risk anything with a no-fault accident of our own.
Eventually we got all the details, but the he lied to the insurance company saying somebody else was driving his car, etc.
It eventually got sorted out, but I also had to go to my credit card company to get them to pay for the time that the car was out of service.
In the end, I learned a few things. Whatever happens, especially if the accident is your fault, you don’t want to deal with that hassle if you thousands of miles away. If far away and your credit card doesn’t take care of the insurance, buy the extra with a reasonable deductible. Also, I wasn’t pleased with Enterprise, which called be 9 months after the rental agreement asking for money from the car being away for so long. They said “sorry, but we had some employee turnover and a backlog”. I’ve decided to not go with them again unless I absolutely have to.
I feel for the guy who hit you. He sounds like he was just a paycheque to paycheque immigrant who was trying to make the American dream or whatever, but you do have to watch out for yourself first. I disagree with these other jerks in that you can still feel compassion for his situation, but this is life.
You did the right thing. And it’s still ok to feel sorry for him.
Echoing others, I’m a little unsettled by the fact that you mention several times he ‘might’ be in the country illegally.
Unlike many of your commenters, I have some sympathy for Jose. The simple argument of “he’s here illegally, tough luck to him” minimizes the whole illegal alien issue. It’s bigger than that.
However, I do think you did the right thing. You couldn’t have done much else without really jeopardizing yourself.
I hate to say it, call me racist, bigoted, whatever, but I lived in So Cal for 18 years, and I never heard a case where an illegal was deported or even prosecuted for driving without a license or insurance. More often than not, the person that was in compliance felt all the pain. I remember a young Marine being killed on a motorcycle by a drunk, illegal, no license, no insurance woman who was let go on a technicality, and then wasn’t even deported. Thanks ACLU!
While you may sympathize with Jose’s misfortune, your clear responsibility is meet the requirements of the law as you did. Driving is a high-risk, high-responsibility activity and that’s why it is so regulated. By choosing an easier way out for Jose, you likely risk the safety of everyone else.
Before I begin, I’d like to point out that we have no reason to believe Jose actually is here illegally, other than stereotyping. Unless we are to assume that all Hispanic people in southern California that don’t speak perfectly fluent English, and don’t have car insurance, are here illegally.
All we really know is that he doesn’t have car insurance.
@sjean
>> I have some sympathy for Jose. The simple argument of “he’s here illegally, tough luck to him” minimizes the whole illegal alien issue. It’s bigger than that.
It’s bigger than that? I fail to see it. I imagine you are thinking that his previous situation may have been horrible, so coming to the US illegally to improve things. OK, that’s fine. He made a choice and took a risk. It’s a risk I was fortunate to never have to make because by lottery of birth I was born in the USA. However, he still made choices that were within his control. Maybe he could have taken the bus to work and avoid the risk of being involved in a traffic accident. Maybe he could have ridden with someone else, or he should have driven more carefully so as not to rear end another driver. He is 100% responsible for his own misfortune in this case. This didn’t just *happen* to him.
Of course, I also feel that people are responsible for nearly any situation they are in (there are a few exceptions). I am responsible for my own situation at almost all times. If I don’t go and get car insurance (as is legally required when registering a vehicle in my state) and I get in an accident (whether the accident is my fault or not) — then it is my fault for not having insurance. I can blame no one else for the risk I took and the choices I made.
It is unfortunate that this situation could cause personal/financial stress for Jose, but he is ultimately responsible for it.
Regards
A car is a weapon.
It is immaterial where the man came from. He was driving a weapon illegally, uninsured and with total disregard for human life.
Try to imagine what your life would be right now if he had severely hurt you, crippled you or killed your wife or whomever was with you in the car? What would your life be worth right now if you were sitting in a wheelchair, drooling?
We have laws and rules that are in place for our own protection.
You probably saved someone’s life today. Think about that. You probably saved a mother, a father, a young child, a sister or a brother or somebody’s loved one.
YOU DID THE RIGHT THING AND SHOULD BE COMMENDED FOR YOUR ACTIONS.
You are a great American.
For all those ranting about the author assuming that José MIGHT be in the country illegally, the odds of a Hispanic man in California being illegal if he’s driving without insurance or a license and hesitant to give his name are fairly high. That’s not racism, it’s an unfortunate fact. If the author had said he was probably illegal then you’d have cause to rant.
Well, as a guy whose vehicle has been hit three times, every time I’ve been hit, it’s been the other driver’s “fault”, and they’ve not had insurance once. Neither I nor my insurance company have ever gotten a cent out of the uninsured drivers (the question I ask myself is, “If this person can’t afford the $500 or so every six months for insurance, how can they afford to pay for the damage?” I’m sorry, I wish I could be a little more compassionate, but once when I was in traffic court for speeding and one of the guys ahead of me was in for driving uninsured (worst thing to do to your driving record here other than DUI), the judge put it well: “If you can’t afford your insurance, that’s fine. It means you can’t afford to drive.”
You absolutely did the right thing!!!!
Hopefully I’m not repeating here (couldn’t get through all of the comment).
What do you know about this driver? For all you know he could get into accidents monthly! What if you let him go but his next accident does more than damage a car?
What if it were your car and you agreed to cash? He pays you but later on you find out that there’s additional damage you didn’t notice at first. What now.
It may feel cold and maybe he’s a really good guy trying to catch a break but you don’t know that. You did the right thing calling it in.
JerichoHill,
You are confusing the issue when you claim that certain posters have a negative attitude toward immigrants when its clear the problem is with “illegal” immigrants. Everyone is correct that its uncertain whether or not Jose is in fact an illegal alien but given the no license, no insurance, and could not understand what a rental car was pointed more toward him being an illegal alien as opposed to a US Citizen. All the arguing is actually moot because if he is a US Citizen then he will be hit with a hefty fine (just like any other citizen) and if he is not then he deserves to be deported (according to the law).
JD, you were right by reporting the accident because at the very least the consequences could be damages paid out of pocket.
Traciatim said: “I would be F’N P’Oed. To the point that I’d be asking the police about pressing charges and asking for whatever possible to ensure he never drives again. Of course, you can’t take the ignorant fools license away . . . because he didn’t have one. He should do jail time.” Don’t know if I’d go that far, but I am curious about one thing. When I was hit several years ago, it was near the end of the year (late Nov, early Dec, don’t remember exactly). The person who hit me was uninsured. The cop who showed up told her that it was lucky for her this didn’t happen after the first of the year, because a new law would take effect then that would have required her car to be impounded. Of course, hearing this didn’t make me very happy! This was in California, so I wonder if that law has since been repealed, or if it is possibly at the officer’s discretion. I’m just wondering why Jose’s car didn’t get impounded?
You obviously don’t live in Texas, where our rates are ridiculous to uninsured motorists, hispanic, illegal whatever. We already pay to have insurance because of the people who decide to illegally drive. Why should we have to pay again when we get in the accident that’s not our fault?
The real dilemma is not being addressed. The question is not “should I have called the cops?” The question really should be “how can I fix the gross injustice that is our immigration policy?”
If this were a true Christian nation, our immigration policy would be different. We would not merely shrug our shoulders as 90% of the world lived in misery. A high fence to keep the “have nots” out of our country is not the answer.
Calling Jose a “lawbreaker” is easy. But if it were your family living in squalor back in the old country, I guarantee you’d be on the first northbound bus too.
Ouch! All this has turned into the great immigration debate, and a lot of people are showing their ugly side.
First off, I understand where you are coming from, and I have an old saying for you: don’t borrow trouble. You don’t know the guy is illegal, you don’t know it’s going to ruin his life, and you don’t know the consequences, good or bad, that this experience will cause for him. So, you are agonizing over facts that, for you, simply do not exist.
I live in Arizona and there are a lot of immigrants, legal and otherwise. I was rear-ended a few years ago by a perfectly legal white chick, who gave me false information and ran out on me. I never did get my bumper repaired, since the damage was minor (it was my Ford Focus — why spend money on a car I hate?), but I will never give anyone the benefit of the doubt again. But think about this; the guy was a nice guy, he hung around and waited for the cops to come, even if he was pretty reluctant. If he truly was an illegal immigrant, he would have just ran, leaving everything behind.
It sucks to be him, and to learn the hard way that laws in the U.S. aren’t “bendable” like they are in other countries (we can’t assume he’s from Mexico just because his name is Jose). And I mean that — it really sucks to be him. I got my car towed in Japan once (couldn’t read the no parking sign), and nearly had a heart attack when I found out it cost $600 to get it out of impound, PLUS $150 for the ticket. It was a borrowed car, so I had to do it, but it ruined my vacation and took all my spending money. We all have moments like this.
You’re a nice guy, J.D., which is why you worried, but unfortunately, Jose made his own bad fortune this time. But here’s a better scenario to think about: a lot of Latin Americans have a culture of family and community that we lack. If he lost his shirt in the deal, probably his family and friends will cough up some cash to help him out.
For all the xenophobes coming out on this post — please! Being Hispanic is not a crime.
~Missy MARTINEZ, Tucson, AZ
One additional comment - how come he had enough cash to offer to pay for your damages, but not enough to be able to afford insurance? Ignoring all the other things like it being a rental car, you were on travel and dealing with someone you didn’t know. If he doesn’t have the cash on him, are you going to be able to hang around and go to the bank with him to get the cash, or do you really think he’ll just send you a check in a dew days? I don’t think so.
Quoting Missy:
“But think about this; the guy was a nice guy, he hung around and waited for the cops to come, even if he was pretty reluctant. If he truly was an illegal immigrant, he would have just ran, leaving everything behind.”
Missy raises a good point, sometimes the people you expect to skip out, show better character than some US Citizens.
Using anecdotal evidence, when was the last time you saw a parent publicly teach their children morals? Ive seen bratty kids bitch out their parents in malls for not buying them the latest skank top/XBOX.
However, he did drive illegally, probably is illegal. (Im hispanic I would assume as such as well). His life is not over, the courts see this all the time, all they are going to do is probably fine him, and he will skip out.
No reason to weigh all of your opinions on this forum, when you can be doing something better… Like I dunno:
Support Legislation to go after the business es that hire illegals? Gee, what a thought.
But, not to drift too much from the topic of this site…
Moral of the story: Protecting your self = Good, Not knowing what youre covered for = Bad. Check your coverages people
-Israel, Orange County, CA
Well written.
I’m glad you didn’t just look out for you in your post and I like the honesty you expressed. When I read it the first thing I thought was “did your insurance cover this?”!
I feel the same concern for Jose but you did do the right thing.
-Jim. Pennsylvania.
I think you ultimately did the right thing. I mean, while it is certainly true that his life could be ruined, it is his fault for not abiding by the law. I do not have any pity for that sort of person. You would also have likely had to lie to the insurance company to get any coverage as well.
Last but certainly not least, I have heard stories of people who felt fine after an accident to have problems start to develop later. You never know when that could be you…
It is because of posts like this that I read this blog. Being rich doesn’t mean just being monetarily rich, but leading a rich life and being a decent human being/citizen/denizen of the planet. Because you are the kind of person who struggles with these types of questions, your insights are especially valuable.
You made the right call. Why should you suffered for someone else’s mistakes?
Clearly you made the right decision to call the police. I have a good friend who was hit by an uninsured driver, and although for you personally it was a minor problem if the accident had been more serious or you had been a single mother with no emergency fund this could have been a life destroying event. By doing the right thing and calling the police you’ve saved that other person from those complications.
Oh for pity’s sake, you did the right thing! If this what a white guy driving without a license or insurance, would you feel bad about calling him in? The way the system is set up, driving without insurance is super irresponsible and should be reported. Unfortunately for Jose, if you get caught for breaking one law while you’re breaking several others, there’s going to be some negative repercussions.
Honestly, I doubt he’ll get deported. Hopefully he’ll find a way to drive legally so this won’t happen again.
Sorry, but your biggest mistake was being in Berkeley, which is a “sanctuary city” and the most Anti-American place in the U.S. Notice the cops didn’t care that he had no license/insurance, and propably no registration. My policy here in CA requires me to pay uninsured motor vehicle liability and property loss because of people like “Jose”.
My brand new car, this was years ago, was hit 3 times (yeah he was really drunk) by an unlicensed, uninsured and illegal immigrant who was driving his cousin’s car and had a fake i.d.
It took me months to get the insurance coverage and reimbursement worked out. The driver was released and did not appear at court. The police then arrested a person matching the fake i.d. but the fingerprints didn’t match so the case never went forward. The state attonrey’s office told me that the driver probably fled the country.
Anywho, the cousin’s insurance did finally pay all my expenses but it took months and months to work out.
Based on my experience, I will always call the police when I’m involved in an accident.
While in college I interned at State Farm agent’s office in Miami. I can tell you that the worst thing you can do is to not file the police report. On more than one occasion an insured would call us because he or she had just been served with a summons related to a lawsuit arising from exactly the type of facts you lay out.
The at fault driver would beg the not a fault driver to handle the matter privately and keep the police out of it. After much debate the not at fault driver would agree. Several weeks if not months later the at-fault driver would claim that the not-at-fault driver left the scene of the accident without exchanging information and left him injured.
What do you do then? It’s your word versus his and you’re starting off by admitting that you didn’t call the police. The at-fault driver had often waited until the not-at-fault driver left the scene and then called the police himself to get the report filed with a set of facts that suited him.
Always call the police. Take a couple pictures of the incident as quickly as possible and try to get the names and contact information from as many witnesses as possible. Ask for people’s business cards and make notes on the back.
Doing what you think is “morally right” may end up costing you dearly in the long run. Additionally, I question whether allowing an unlicensed, uninsured, illegal immigrant who has already been negligent in the operation of a motor vehicle escape justice is morally right. How would you feel if the next accident killed someone? The laws are here for a purpose. While we may not agree with the law, it’s not up to us to pick and choose which laws we’re going to follow.
JD, you made the unfortunate right decision. As someone who works in a collision repair shop, I’ve seen many, many people try to protect someone else, and end up the loser because they were nice people. Had it not been a rental vehicle, sure, give him a chance… But with it being a rental, you don’t have that option because the rental agency would take it out of your skin if you hadn’t gotten info and gone through insurance. Also, it’s distinctly possible that if the bumper is demolished, there’s quite a bit more damage behind it, so insurance would be necessary anyways to cover the hidden damages and because the cost would start escalating quickly….. Oh, and to those who think the guy is an illegal alien? Hush. Just because he’s Hispanic and doesn’t have insurance, doesn’t make your flippant assumption correct. It just makes you an ass.
Are you kidding me? of course you had to do it. I would bet there is a clause in your rental agreement that requires you to report such accidents. Otherwise, you would be in breach of your contract (have not read other comments so no idea if this has been pointed out already).
Let me re-iterate:
To me what is interesting are the relative consequences of each choice I might have made. I agree that ultimately I made the right decision, as did José in taking his lumps. (For those wondering about what happened after: when we drove away, the police were still talking with him, but it sounded like he was headed down to the station at least for a little while. They weren’t going to let him go anywhere with the car, that’s for sure.)
Berkeley is one of the most interesting and historic places in all of the United States. How is the “Free Speech Movement” Anti-American, Brian?
All I have to say is, Go Bears!
Oh and J.D., you did the right thing here.
J.D,
I’m sure that you understand and understood that you had to make the call. But, I can sympathize with your desire to cut him some slack. I’ve been there. There’s a tremendous difference between dealing with ‘an issue’ and dealing with ‘a person’. Illegal immigration is a difficult topic to discuss. Heck, I’m a white dude, and I’ve lived here all my life. I have no idea what it is to grow up, impoverished, surrounded my squalor, and feeling no hope. I can’t say that I wouldn’t ‘climb a fence’ or ‘hop a boat’. In fact, as a man, I’d feel an OBLIGATION to do better for my family, regardless of the law. That being said, we are a county of laws, and those laws must be enforced. For every move that is made to curb illegal immigration, there will be a counter move made that increases it. As long as financial discrepancies exist between neighboring countries, illegal immigration will be an issue. If you are like me, and from the tone of you post, you are, then you were torn over doing the ‘legally right thing’ and your desire not to hurt ‘Jose’ or his family. And, by dodging your questions and trying to settle in cash, plus driving without a license or insurance, he gave you every reason to call the police and to believe that he might be here illegally (or that he wants to avoid the police for some other reason.) But, he’s still just a dude, like any other dude, regardless of his legal status. And, when you have to look another human being in the eye - and make that call - that can be a tough thing to do.
NCN
JD,
I’m glad you linked to Jay’s post. I think you’ve got a good head on those shoulders.
Regardless of consequences to Jose, you had to report it, and you did. Thanks for being an example of personal finance responsibility, and also thanks for letting us know what you think you did wrong (not fully understanding your insurance). Your frankness and willingness to share will hopefully lead to your readers checking on their coverage and being aware of the many nuanced financial responsibilities of renting a car.
You made the right decision. I was hit from behind by someone who wasn’t in this country legally. Who had a license from Chile but luckily had insurance. I’m glad I called the police because I ended up having to use my own insurance to fix the damages as other party’s insurance company was not willing to pay for anything. Ultimately my insurance company had to take the other insurance company to court to settle for damages.
If the damage is above $500 or if there is more than one car involved, call the police. If the other driver has no insurance, that’s their fault for driving without it and being a high risk to society.
My brother got in a accident with a rental. In order for his credit card company to cover it he had to notify them within ten days. He thought his insurance would cover it, but when they refused it was to late for the CC to pick it up. Just food for thought you ma want to contact your CC company even if you don’t think you’ll need their help.
I feel bad for Jose, but we have to take care of our families first.
JD, I admire your compassion for another human being. While you did the right thing and it really is the only choice, it is decent to have some feeling about it. Doing the “right thing” is often the hardest thing to do.
Even though Jose did a lot of things wrong, I’m encouraged that you’re one of the rare people out there who can think of what it might be like to walk in less fortunate shoes.
Wait… YOU feel guilty about somebody else doing something illegal? Something that could have ended up causing you to lose money in the end? Are you in any way responsible for the decisions this guy has made in his life.
What happens to your car insurance rates for this accident?
And really, if people were deported that easily… illegal immigration wouldn’t be such a huge issue.
If he is here illegally, he needs to face the consequences. I doubt he’ll be deported.
If Jose is here legally, this should be a good learning experience.
I’m absolutely with NCN. Compassion and empathy are what makes humans nice to be around.
JD, This was a great post. It’s too bad many (though not all) of the posts are so ignorant. The holier-than-thou attitudes really take it down a notch.
For what it’s worth, #22 sums up my thoughts on this quite well.
I doubt Jose was here illegally. He wouldn’t have stuck around waiting for the cops to show up to deport him!
Aaron & Mike, thank you for the “inside info” from the insurance side of the fence
Really, why is everyone going on about illegal immigrants? We don’t know if the guy was illegal or not. We know the thought crossed JD’s mind when JD examined the possible consequences of his actions. That says that JD doesn’t act without thinking, not that the guy was an illegal alien.
Re: the guy not understanding why a rental car meant needing to report the accident, JD said this was the first time he’d rented a car. My folks never rented a car, and worried about what sort of a lemon I might be driving when I rented one for a business trip. Ignorance of rental cars may say something social/economic class, yes, but not necessarily “not from this country”. My mom was definitely from this country - from the hills of Tennessee, to be precise, where water was pumped by hand and flush toilets meant you were damn rich.
JD, I’m glad you are alright. Take it easy for a few days - you had a bit of a shock, and you may have some extra aches and pains. Hot baths or showers and a backrub might be a good idea.
I know this wasn’t the point of this blog post, but it has become the issue in the comments, that “José got what he deserved,” and that JD shouldn’t be feeling sorry for him.
I think it’s easy for people to make this kind of statement when, for them, it’s just a faceless stranger they’ve never met and will never meet.
But if it were someone else who had met him, talked to him, and saw his worry firsthand, then maybe you would be singing a tune more similar to JD.
At least José didn’t try to run away, but stayed and faced the consequences, whatever they may be. Besides, like JD said, he might not be an illegal immigrant. It could be his insurance has lapsed and he couldn’t afford to renew it, but can’t afford to stop going to work either.
Times are hard and we’re all feeling the pinch. Those of us who can still afford insurance should be grateful for small blessings. Maybe his income is barely enough to feed his family and pay the rent. It’s not for us to judge.
As for calling the police, though, it was a tough call, but I think it was the right thing to do.
Always, always, ALWAYS call the police when you’re in an accident. It creates a paper trail that you can use to verify claims and tackle related problems.
Even if you could have dealt with it privately, who’s to say the other person will honestly come through?
In my state, one of the reasons insurance rates are so high is because there are a lot of uninsured drivers. Getting uninsured drivers off the road (or insured!) will help.
Honestly JD, the fact that you are worried about something like this is one of the reasons I like your blog.
Well, be a Berkeleyite (is there such a word?) I would like to apologize for your time in Berkeley being tarnished. You did the right thing, of course; our daughter got slammed here a while back and much to the dismay of the other driver, a teenager, and his Dad, we felt we had to contact our insurance company. We usually don’t depend on the local police for this stuff,–they’re too busy watching protesters–but in your position, you had to!
Come visit again!!
Whatever Jose’s situation, the fact that he stuck around to talk to police puts him in a more decent category than some people. My boyfriend was in a hit and flee accident a while back. The guy didn’t even offer to pay out of pocket. He said he needed to get to work, got back in his car and drove off before the police arrived. Of course my bf reported it to the police and insurance company, but when the guy was tracked down, he wouldn’t answer his phone. Someone finally picked up the phone and said they sold the truck and didn’t know about any accident. The police said they didn’t care and weren’t going to follow up on it any further, even though there were witnesses. My bf ended up just donating his totalled car to charity.(It still ran, but suffered frame damage that cost more than the value of the car.)
I hope Jose get some leniency for sticking around to face the music rather than running off like the red truck driving good ole boy that effectively stole a car from my bf. Unless we want to teach the lesson that you really should just flee an accident because you’ll probably get away with it. Talk about deporting people because they’re breaking the law is all good and well, but what about the guy who hit and ran? Isn’t that supposed to be against the law? I can’t fault a person for trying to make a wage for his family and be willing to face the consequences of it. I sure can be flaming torqued off with a jerk off who just didn’t give a flip, and police who couldn’t be bothered to ‘enforce the law’.
Cathy,
Are they not liable for the damage? What would stop someone else from doing that?
# Ron@TheWisdomJournal - One of the best car accident stories I have heard lately was actually from a trial/personal injury lawyer who worked with car insurance companies for many years. The guy responsible for the accident told the lawyer that it would be hard to determine who’s fault it was (had hit another car that then hit the lawyers car). Lawyer said yea uh not so hard to determine that, and when they guy suggested he should talk to a lawyer, gave him his business card
Driving is one of the most dangerous things we do in our day to day lives. People who choose to drive without insurance are taking a risk they deserve to get punished for, as bad as I feel for him.
I don’t understand why, when you register a car. Get new plates. or get new city sticker. Why you don’t have to show proof of insurance on the car. at that point.
this would solve so many problems.
Luke F:
The other person would have been liable for the damage. However, my bf would have had to prosecute under small claims court, and there would be no way to guarantee that a hit and run guy would even show up, as evidence seems to suggest.
My mom was involved in a hit and run when I was very little. My parents did track the guy down and sued him in small claims court. The guy did not show up. Nothing more ever came of it. The guy probably never even got a ticket.
What would stop someone else from doing that? Good question. My advice: take the highest amount of coverage on an uninsured motorist policy that you can afford. If an uninsured motorist bails on you, it’s not easy to do anything about it.
JD, I think it’s illegal for you NOT to report it. In California, you must report vehicle damage exceeding $500, and almost anything that happens to run into you will cause said damage. Just a ding can cost that much, if paint is involved.
So, you did the right thing from a legal standpoint. NEVER even contemplate taking money from someone who crashes into you.
JD
Should you have taken the cash and let Jose go about his life without the possibly devastating consequences of dealing with the police? Your gut told you that the harm to him would be way greater than the harm to you. Your gut told you he was a guy struggling to get by and supporting his family. How good is your gut? How good is your gut in an unfamiliar place and situation?
First, you probably did the right thing. It wasn’t your car. The generous gesture wasn’t really yours to give. I’m not sure how the car rental company would have reacted to Jose’s wad of cash, though some other commenters have provided pretty good insight into that issue. I do know people who would have done just what you were tempted to do, let the guy go. And they are very good and caring people. The world is better for them.
When you make these kinds of gestures you have to accept that your generosity may be mistaken. Jose was probably what he seemed, a struggling immigrant Or he may have been a person who knows how to take advantage of people’s better natures. His life may not be as devastated as you think. I suspect the Berkely police can’t check out the immigration status of everyone they ticket for a fender bender, even when the driver doesn’t have a license or insurance.
But, back to my point. When you give money, which is what you would have been doing, to someone who appears to be in need but who you don’t really know, you have to accept that your money may or may not accomplish the good that you hope for. That’s OK. You just have to recognize that risk and be willing to make it.
I have a suggestion. If the incident still bothers you, perhaps you can find a charity that helps migrant workers and make a donation to them. It won’t help Jose specifically, but maybe someone else in his situation.
Very intersting post. Money is never just about money, is it?
Christine
JD, your thought process shows the type of person that you are. I can vibe with you on why you hesitated to call the police as I would have done the same. The fact that you cared reflects your character. I also do think Jay made a great point. For the rest of you who are too quick to pull the trigger, walk on their shoes before you judge.
No sympathy for Jose here. He chose to do illegal things (not have insurance, possibly enter the US illegally) and now he faces the consequences.
Actions have consequences. Illegal behavior often has bad consequences. Worrying about mitigating the bad legal consequences of illegal behavior is not a positive character trait. It’s a character flaw.
Please understand, I have many character flaws myself. So I am not condemning you for what I perceive as a character flaw in you.
And don’t anyone even start about me lacking compassion. I’m the guy who not only buys homeless bums a meal now and then, I will actually sit down to eat with them and listen to their stories and try to support them. I’m the guy who in the next 2 weeks is planning to cook a meal with his wife, then along with his wife and 9 year old son, is going to take that meal down under a bridge in a local town and eat it with the homeless. It’s ain’t about glory. Don’t even comment about it. It’s the least I can do for a suffering fellow human being. It’s not because I am some special kind of guy. The only reason I even mention it is because I take great offense at statements indicating that because I do not believe in mitigating legal consequences for illegal behavior that I am not a decent, compassionate being.
“Bleeding heart” compassion is a scourge on society.
True compassion is what makes the world a bit more beautiful.
“…all that would happen to me is that my emergency fund would be drained.”
How many hours of work does your emergency fund represent? How long did it take to accumulate it? What would happen to your financial plans if something else happened in the near future, before you could replace it?
And, most importantly, how many comic books could it buy?
I’m just asking.
So crazy time in the comments…
Glad to hear that nobody was hurt. I think in the long run it’s best to report the accident. Even if it’s your own car. Sometimes the long-term physical repercussions don’t set in until later on and while Jose doesn’t have insurance to pay you, it might be easier to get something from your own insurance company if you have proof that you were rear-ended, etc.
“For those wondering about what happened after: when we drove away, the police were still talking with him, but it sounded like he was headed down to the station at least for a little while.”
My guess would be that they sent him home with a summons - driving w/o insurance is certainly not a detainable offense. I’m not sure about the license, but I doubt it. The immigration issue (if there is one) would be handled by a completely different level of government, and as I understand it local police are not even allowed to inquire about immigration status, and certainly they have no legal basis whatsoever to get involved. That is purely the domain of federal government.
Whether he will actually show up to court or not is up to him. He could skip out and then it would be up to the city to locate him among the 100,000 Jose Hernandez’es in California.
BTW, my mom was in a similar accident (with an uninsured, unlicensed motorist, probably of undocumented immigrant status), but the difference is that it was HER FAULT. Nevertheless, the police slapped big fine on the no-fault party for being uninsured and unlicensed. They were not very happy with my mom, for causing an accident, and then getting fined.
I don’t have time to read through this whole thread, so forgive me if anyone has already hit on this topic.
It doesn’t matter if Jose was illegal. The Police in SF (and AFAIK Berkley) will not take action against illegal aliens involved in “routine” crimes like this. The philosophy is that if the Police detain (and potentially deport) illegals, they will be reluctant to call the Police when they are victims of a crime.
So just get that worry off your mind. Only the Feds deal with illegals in California, and the Police don’t send cases to the Feds (except in exceptional circumstances). Sure Jose will face the consequences, but your involvement with the police will not cause him to be deported (if he IS an illegal).
F’r crying out loud.
If Jose were here illegally and his car suffered only cosmetic damage, he would have taken off like a rocket. Trust me: I know.
In California as in Arizona, it’s illegal to drive without insurance, and so the guy would have been facing two “crimes”: trying to support his family by working for slave wages in the United States and driving without insurance that he (and most of us) couldn’t afford. So a) it’s unlikely that he was a mojado (let’s use the jingoist term, since we seem to have plenty of jingoism going on here), otherwise he wouldn’t have hung around long enough to give you a name that translates roughly to “John Smith”; and b) it’s likely that he did not see the end of his world rolling toward him in the form of a fine for being uninsured.
So, now look at this hombre a hombre, man to man, HUMAN BEING TO HUMAN BEING. He hit you. You didn’t hit him. Whatever details he hasn’t taken care of in his personal business are his problem, not yours.
That Jose hung around long enough for the cops to show up says he was willing to take responsibility for his error or errors, whatever they might be. You don’t have to feel guilty for not engineering a way to let him off the hook. Just be glad you (and he) weren’t hurt.
Your heart was in the right place when feeling bad for the guy. But you did the LEGAL and LAWFUL thing. My family and I migrated from Mexico legally about 10 years ago. While I will always sympathize with illegal aliens (specially of latin descent), I respect and live by the rules of this great country.
Don’t loose any sleep over this.
@16, Nathan:
Oh, geez. JD didn’t say he was in the country illegally; he merely speculated that it was a possibility, and probably based on the man’s accent and level of English proficiency more than on his apparent ethnicity. What’s more, he observed that possibility as part of an expression of sympathy toward the man. Not every mention of race or immigration status is part of an attack. Chill.
You did the right thing JD! Totally!
for those wondering the consequences of Jose’s action if he were an illegal immigrant: http://www.carinsurance.com/kb/content14179.aspx
You definitely made the right call. First it shouldn’t even be your concern if he is an illegal or not. He should only be here legally. Questioning if you destroyed his life is also not a concern you should have to think about. If he followed the law in the first place HE wouldn’t have placed himself in the situation he was currently in. Remember he made choices that caused you to be in a place where you were exposed. You did not expose him. If I break the law and you turn me in is it your fault of mine? Now you may say well that depends but does it really depend? Say it was an accident? I say I’m an illegal, then you choose not to call the cops but as it turns out I am a convicted fellon wanted for murder. You maybe saying to your self well all illegals arent bad but i never said i was an illegal, not my bias but your assumed bias. Maybe the person is playing on your compasion for this type of person that he is saying he is when infact he is lying. Im not saying don’t trust other people but you should not be putting your self at risk because you don’t want someone else to have a bad day. If he had show the same consideration he would have had the appropriate insurance and you would have both been safe. It was his choice that put you at risk. He chose to not care about you when he drove without insurance, not the other way around.
Racist.
I rented a car last month through my company for a company trip. Before I even left the parking lot I backed into a cement pole… DOH! I was so upset, but thankfully my company has insurance with Enterprise. I was lucky but unlucky at the same time!
What I don’t understand is that if you don’t have drivers license and insurance and you are possibly illegal, shouldn’t you be be more careful while driving?
illegals don’t get deported by city cops, i can tell ya that much.
funny how people here are talking about increasing your insurance deductible… must be a factor of where you live. i’ve had thousands in paint work done thanks to vandalism. i keep my comp deductible at $100 for a reason. since there is no fault involved, my rates do not go up, and it’s only a few more bucks in premiums vs a $400 or more extra payout from our pockets annually. (yeah, i’ve done the comparison.) but if you can do it safely, by all means go for it.
We all pay out several thousands of dollars over our lifetimes for “uninsured driver coverage”. That is money I would much rather have for my own family.
JD,
Clearly you did the right thing reporting the accident, which as others have noted, would have been required by CA law given the amount of damage.
I would now prepare yourself for dealing with the runaround you’re likely to face. I’d watch that CC statement like a hawk–you’re liable to get caught between the rental company, your car insurance company, and your credit card company in a finger pointing nightmare.
@Richard Miller (no. 143)
One can feel compassion without believing that the consequences should, on balance, be different.
Or perhaps that’s something only someone who is a scourge on society can do?
It’s nice of you to consider the other driver’s situation and speaks well of your compassion & empathy, but you did the right thing. It is illegal in the State of California to drive a car without insurance. He made the choice to drive illegally. He made whichever choices led to him rearending you. People have to take the consequences of their actions. People getting off easy or never getting caught at all has led to a lot of reckless driving, road rage and self-centeredness on our roads. It’s dangerous for everyone who uses our roads: drivers, cyclists, pedestrians, wheelchair users, etc.
You had a legal obligation to report the wreck, JD, whether you owned the car or not. We have a system for dealing with collisions here in the US, and you followed it. Jose chose not to, but that’s not your fault.
I’m glad you & your wife weren’t hurt.
JD–
You did exactly the right thing reporting this collision. Whether the guy was illegal, or had/didn’t have insurance or a license, that should have had no impact on your decision whatsoever.
We as a society need to relearn the notion that actions have consequences, and had you not reported this, José might have missed an opportunity to be reminded of that.
I think you did the right thing.
I could understand covering his neck, had it been your fault, but he knew he was driving without a license and without insurance, and still chose to drive recklessly (not paying attention and rear-ending someone counts as reckless, in my opinion. It’s a minor version of reckless, but a version of reckless all the same).
I know that when I had my permit, I did go out driving on my own. It was earlier this year, and I’m 21. I accepted the fact that there were risks, and I drove cautiously, making sure to follow all the rules of the road (because I’m assuming if I had gotten into an accident, there’s a distinct possibility that it would’ve been all my fault, for driving without a license).
I took this risk because driving around with my dad is a hassle. It’s a hassle to say, “Dad, I need to go to WalMart. Now. Let’s go!” and have him whine and complain about how he doesn’t want to go anywhere or do anything because he had a hard day at OMG!WORK! I can now understand that, but I couldn’t back then (having spent most of the day around the house surfing the net). Even if I could understand it, it still is much easier to just be selfish and take the damn car when he’s not home to bitch and complain about how he has to be a passenger to supervise me.
I did get into one accident on my permit, and it was okay. I merely hit the neighbor’s mailbox. The neighbor wasn’t home, so I went out, bought her a new one, and waited for her to get home so I could deliver it to her. I offered to install it for her, and she was rather taken aback that I even went out and got her a new one. My father was shocked that I got her a new one as well. I don’t understand why I wouldn’t get her a new mailbox, when it was my fault that the old one was on the post all crooked. I plan on getting her post back straight in the ground later on, towards summer, and installing the mailbox for her (I’m also contemplating offering to cut down some of the branches of a tree, since said branches have gotten a bit too long. They now threaten to hit the back of my car when I use our turn-around).
I have a strong code of ethics. If you break something of someone else’s, you must replace it, since you have no idea how much it means to that person. The object might not have meant much, but replacing it will give that person a new respect for you, and it’s the quickest way to rebuild trust with someone. It also tells people that you’re reliable and can be counted upon.
It’s sad to say, now that I have my license, I don’t drive as carefully as I did before I got it. I don’t check the speedometer to make sure I’m following the speed limit as much as I used to (mostly, I tend to go 40MPH in a 35MPH zone. Not a big deal to most people, but I figure the speed limit is there for a reason, and is meant to be followed).
I find myself getting stressed over other people who break the rules of the road (such as cutting off my right of way on purpose. I know they did it on purpose, because I’m stopped for a stop sign, and the other person ignores their stop sign and waves at me, assuming that I’m “kind” enough to be stopped so they can go. That really pisses me off). I imagine part of the reason I’m so pissed is because not everyone feels the need to follow the rules of the road to a T. I figure the rule is there for a reason, and if no one is going to follow it, then we should get rid of the damn rule (equally so if no one’s going to enforce it. Usually, no one does in the places I’m driving, but since I’m driving in the suburbs, it makes sense. I understand the through-ways and interstates are a bigger priority for cops, since the more dangerous accidents happen there).
I know I envision myself just slamming into my car, but while I’m thinking that, I also tell myself, “Yes, that would feel great, but the hassle of not having a car and having to exchange insurance information afterward is not worth the 5 seconds of glee over ruining their car.” Mostly, I breathe in and breathe out and try to calm myself down. I know I ought to also give the other person the benefit of the doubt, but I’m not calm enough while driving to do that yet. If I’m in a good mood, I can totally do that, but otherwise, I have to remind myself to be calm and that ruining my car and their is not worth it.
Also: Taking away someone’s license doesn’t stop their ability to drive. Neither does taking away their car. There’s always going to be someone who either doesn’t know that person’s situation, or doesn’t care and is willing to lend that person a car. Not to mention, if someone wasn’t following the rules of the road when they had a license, why would not having a license matter to them?
I was amazed at my 5 hour course* how the instructors seemed to think that having a revoked license was synonymous with the inability to drive. As I stated earlier, if a driver doesn’t care enough to follow the rules of the road while they have a license, why would they care if said license is revoked?!
*NY State mandated course all new drivers have to go through. Drivers who get too many tickets or their license revoked also have to attend
I can also understand why the Hispanic man was driving. I’m not sure what San Francisco is like, but I imagine that it’s pretty much built for cars these days, as a lot of the East and West coasts of America are.
There’s a big catch 22, where you need a car to drive to work, and you need a job in order to pay for car insurance and a permit/license. If you don’t have the car, you can’t work. If you don’t have the license, you can’t get insurance. If you don’t have insurance, it’s pretty damn hard to buy a new/used car from a dealer, so you can get to work.
So, I understand where he’s coming from, driving without a license and insurance. Though, I don’t feel bad for him for not understanding the consequences. These days, there’s a lot of stuff that’s printed both in English and Spanish, so he ought to be able to understand the consequences. If he wasn’t able to, I’m sure the police can explain it to him.
He also ought to know the rules of the road, since driver’s manuals are now printed in English and Spanish. At least, they are for New York State, so I don’t see why they wouldn’t be for California, where it’s far more likely to get immigrants who only speak Spanish.
Matt (59): It’s a consolation to me. Thanks =)
I know where I live, the transportation is horrible for the suburbs. You absolutely have to have a car, unless you want to walk 5 miles to work.
The walking isn’t a big deal, except we have high humidity, and so once you get to work, you’ll be sweaty and gross (not to mention, look unprofessional). In Winter, we do sometimes get down into the teens, and no one around here sells any clothing that allows people to safely walk outside during that kind of temperature. I do know of a few times when the temperature has gone down to 7ºF, and tons of schools close. I can imagine that an employer might not be so understanding that someone has to walk and ergo can’t go to work in that kind of weather (especially in the ‘burbs, where you’re supposed to be able to afford it).
As it is, I work part time, just started my job a few weeks ago, and am unsure when I get my first paycheck. If this guy is in the same boat as me, I can understand why he doesn’t have his license/insurance (I’m not even going to touch how he got the car. I’m happier not playing that guessing game).
Having heard that San Francisco has excellent public transportation, I can’t see why he wouldn’t choose to use it. Surely someone, somewhere, would lend him the money for any tickets he’d need.
I had a similar situation in Hawai’i. I was turning left in an intersection when traffic suddenly stopped, and so did I. Unfortunately the woman behind me did not. We pulled off the road, and looked at her car and mine. She was an islander and very laid back, but she really didn’t want to get her insurance involved unless it was absolutely necessary though. I, renting the car, thought I really need to talk to the police. Eventually I came to the conclusion that the rental people probably wouldn’t be able to tell there was any damage at all. There was only one spot where the paint had peeled away on the bumper, and it was about the size of a ball point pen tip. We exchanged information in case the rental people complained, and buffed out the scuff marks and turned the car in. Nothing was ever said to the rental people, and everything seemed fine. I understand that this wasn’t an option for JD, but I thought I’d share. PS if you work for a rental car agency in Maui…this is not my real name.
I knew a woman when I lived in NY who was crossing the street with her son and his friend on their way to the museum of natural history. A man in a truck barreled through the crosswalk hitting the woman and traumatizing her son and his friend (they are both terrified of cars and crossing the street now). The man was an uninsured, unlicensed, illegal immigrant. He was immediately put in jail and eventually deported.
The woman now suffers debilitating back injuries that may never heal. She has to wear a brace that runs the length of her torso and may never know what it’s like to be pain free ever again. She cannot work and most likely will never be able to.
Do you think that deporting the man was wrong? I don’t think it was enough. He will probably make his way back into the US illegally again and continue his reckless behavior.
I have absolutely no pity for anyone in his situation. As legal, taxpaying citizens we are the ones who pay for these accidents. Premiums go up because of the number of uninsured, unlicensed drivers on the road. Medical coverage becomes more expensive due to claims by people injured in accidents like this.
If you choose to do something you know is wrong, you must be willing to accept the consequences of your actions no matter who you are or where you come from.
Heidi said: “I know that when I had my permit, I did go out driving on my own. It was earlier this year, and I’m 21. I accepted the fact that there were risks, and I drove cautiously, making sure to follow all the rules of the road (because I’m assuming if I had gotten into an accident, there’s a distinct possibility that it would’ve been all my fault, for driving without a license).”
and also:
“I have a strong code of ethics.”
Sorry Heidi, but I think your ethics aren’t as strong as you seem to think, not if they allow you to perform illegal acts just because following the law would have been inconvienent. You might want to think on that a bit. You do get credit for doing the right thing by your neighbor though, good for you!
First, I’d like to say that JD did the right thing in bringing the police into the matter. You always have to protect yourself first, because no one else is going to look out for your best interests.
I never trust someone who wants to settle an accident privately or will give me the information later. Always call the police and get them to be intermediaries.
As for the xenophobes in this discussion, I would like to tell you that just because someone is hispanic does not mean they are illegal immigrants! It infuriates me when people automatically assume my fiance, who is hispanic with a name to match, is an illegal immigrant and speak to him in Spanish (he never learned it) or put on airs before even meeting him. They are so surprised to find out that he’s a police officer!
Please don’t make off handed assumptions about Jose. He very well might be a US citizen who is down on his luck - and I’m sure you wouldn’t be making such a fuss if his name was Joe and was a white guy in the same circumstances.
Oh and by the way, I got hit by a girl in my apartment complex’s parking lot last year and she refused to wait for the police to arrive or give me her information until “later” because she had class. Luckily for me I took down her plates, car description, a good physical description and caught her name. I filed a police report and they helped me to resolve it with her and her insurance company - but I’d have been in trouble if I’d just trusted her to “get with me later”. She caused $3,500 worth of damage on my vehicle when she backed into me.
@kara(168)
Where I live, a significant portion of the population are illegal immigrants of hispanic descent.
Also, where I live, those illegals represent a HUGE portion of the crime problem, mostly related to drunk driving, and many of them are repeat offenders.
Certainly José could just be a citizen down on his luck - I have no idea.
But please recognize that there is a legitimate reason for the reactions your fiancee receives.
It is indeed unfortunate that the person that hit you made so many mistakes, however understandable they might be, but you should not even worry for a moment the consequences of that persons mistakes. Its simply not your issue and don’t take any ownership of it! Like Dr Phil says “you choose the actions, you choose the consequences”. Being an immigrant, illegal or otherwise, has nothing to do with it. I would say the same thing about a non-immigrant that decided to drive recklessly without a license or insurance and plowed into you. Would you feel similarly bad if it was a snotty rich kid who lost their license on a DUI?
O.K. This is why you had to call the police. You don’t know how bad the damage was. When a repair estimate is written it is assumed that 10% more damage will be found. If you were hit in the rear, the rear bumper cover must come off to assess the damage on the first estimate. I believe in California the hourly labor rate at body shops is near $70 an hour. Taking off a cover is at least a hour. To put a new cover on a car and paint it is probably 5 to 7 hundred dollars. . Now imagine if it needs a reinforcement, rear body panel repair, the rails need pulled, the floor is kinked . . . You wouldn’t be able to see this without the car being disassembled. I’ve seen cars that look not bad, and off comes the cover and Surprise! it’s crushed. Covers are plastic and made to flex, the structure underneath is not.
This is what I do for a living. Body work is expensive. Pay cash? I wish that was an option but whenever that happens the person who gets hit always wishes they didn’t go that route in the end. For instance the car in the photo probably has $1500 to $2000 worth of damage using chicago’s labor rates as an example. Try going after the guy for an extra $200 dollars of damage, or parts prices went up (which they almost always do), etc… I’ve seen people say “No, I’m only paying what is on the first estimate.” So you’d pay the difference obviously. The shop WILL NOT give you back the car until they are paid.
In some states there is no fault insurance. In that situation you wouldn’t of had to call the police, at least I don’t think so. Each person’s company fixes their own car. The other option was let the guy go and say you were hit while parked somewhere. You are paying your deductible either way.
If you have full coverage on your car you are covered when you rent a car. Buying extra rental insurance usually is a scam. Remember the people who are renting you a car ARE sales people.
It’s too bad for both off you that it happened. But it’s called an accident for a reason. If you weren’t driving a rental at least you would of been able to take responsibility for letting the guy off. But you were driving someone else’s property. Como se dice, mal suerte.
Next time you are in SF and Berkeley, take the BART train. Save the hassle & cost of a rental…if you can get where you need to go.
Most of this article’s tone revolves around the idea that you might have ruined his life because he was potentially an illegal alien.
It is disturbing to me that you simply assumed based on such scare evidence that he was in the U.S. illegally, and that so many people seem to think that it’s not an over-reaction on your part.
I live in Japan where racism against non-Japanese is rampant and most people are assumed to be here illegally merely because we aren’t Japanese and sometimes can’t speak Japanese properly. It’s racism regardless of how you look at it.
I hope you don’t plan on writing something like this again. It ruined a normally great blog for me.
@Pearl (173) -
It isn’t racism. It might be xenophobia, but it isn’t “racism regardless of how you look at it.” Please check your definitions, and don’t misuse that polarizing term.
@Pearl (173)
Your thought process on his immigrant status blows my mind. Is it really so far flung to think that a Hispanic person found in California who has no license or insurance may be an illegal alien?? Really, that seems like stretch? You consider those three bits of information “scarce evidence”? If he’s not an illegal alien than he’s clearly an idiot for pushing his luck breaking laws. JD did the smart and right thing.
You absolutely did the right thing. Consider my story.
In the summer of 2005 a girl re-ended me on my way to work. She pleaded with me not to call the police because she did not have insurance. As the damage to my vehicle was negligible, I agreed. In retrospect that was a bad decision.
Within a few weeks I started having neck problems and by the fall, after seeking out all sorts of treatments not covered by my insurance (chiropractor, accupuncture and neuromuscular massage), and after missing 3 weeks of unpaid work due to my increasing pain, I finally had to succumb to the inevitable and underwent spinal fusion surgery.
The surgery, luckily, was covered by my insurance but still cost $50,000, 10% of which was my responsibility.
So yes, a moment of pity led to a huge financial pitfall for me that I’m just now recovering from.
Don’t feel bad about what you did.
Well, I won’t add any inflaming anti-hispanic rhetoric. But, I will say that if the consequences from hitting your car were so dire for him, then he should have hit the brakes a second sooner. You should not feel in any way accountable for his error, or the fact that it is magnified by his situation. If anything, the fact that he didn’t have insurance or a license should have incented him to be extra-careful.
Also, keep an eye on what that hit on your insurance does to your insurance rates.
You’ll find this interesting…
Big car insurance companies are now using an “Accident reporting” service, shared among insurers, that’s run by Choicepoint. It’s run *exactly* like a credit report (In fact, Choicepoint is a minor player among credit reporting agencies), except that you’re not entitled to a free one every year. They will send you one free, however, if you get an insurance quote whose determination was affected by their records. If you sign up with a new insurance company, the insurer will look at this system to see if other insurance companies have paid claims on you, before they give you a quote.
The back of said report actually has the standard FCRA notice on the back, which leads me to believe that you can use the same method of “disputing” accident records, if they’re not correct. I haven’t tried it, though. (Yes, there are mistakes on it.) If I have any trouble scouting out quotes next time my insurance comes due, I may give it a spin, and see how I do.
Jose will think twice about his driving habits the next time he gets behind the wheel.
You did the right thing.
I waited tables while finishing up school in California. A co-worker of mine, Debbie, was rear-ended by an illegal alien who had no license or insurance. The police reports showed that the illegal alien was at fault. He and his two passengers were arrested for being in the country illegally.
But these three illegal aliens found them a shady lawyer who sued Debbie over the accident. Debbie’s insurance company settled out of court for $20000 because it would have cost them more to go through the court system in time and money.
Her insurance company told her this happens all the time!
Maybe while we’re trying to keep the illegal aliens (not the legal ones) out of our country, we should kick the lawyers out too. Instead of sending soldiers to Iraq, we should have sent lawyers!
You did what was necessary to protect yourself. Maybe Jose is an honest guy and would have paid for the damages, but without a license or and insurance policy you had no way to pursue him.
I was rear-ended last year. Initially the damage looked minor - my bumper was scratched up, and the trailer hitch was bent. We exchanged insurance info and didn’t file a police report (my husband is a cop and I had the guy’s DL and tag numbers, so in a pinch I knew we could find him). Later in the day I was unable to close the back cargo door after unloading some stuff. The whole cargo door had to be replaced.
You just never know. My car looked almost fine, but the damages (covered by the other guy’s insurance) were somewhere between 1 and 2 grand.
I am sorry that you were in a car accident with an uninsured and un-licensed driver, but your description of the situation hardly masks your prejudice of foreign born non-whites. Just the fact that you had the nerve to mention that you questioned his residency status, because his is non-white, and English was apparently not his native language. Would you have jumped to that same conclusion if the driver was Sean who spoke with a thick Irish accent? You were in a university town, were many of the students are internationals of varying ages. Why didn’t it strike you (or at least write in your article) that Jose was a student? I do not excuse his actions, because he was totally wrong. He offered to pay you in cash, because he knew what he was doing was wrong. There are many home-grown citizens who drive without the required license and insurance. However, I am very disappointed that you would so quickly seriously consider that Jose was an unregistered resident. By the way, approximately 70% of all illegal residents in the U.S. come from Canada, Europe and Australia. They get away with it more easily, because it’s very easy for them to get visas (none are required for most), and many people don’t think to question their residency status. Based upon your article I can see why, because people are so focused on the stereotype of an illegal resident, and keep a blind eye to over-stayers who are from other English speaking or European countries. You may be right about Jose, but it’s awful that you didn’t write about other possibilities for his presence in Berkeley.
That’s it? That’s the article? You got hit by some guy who was more than likely illegal and you felt bad reporting the accident?
This is a financial advice site, how about a discussion of the types of insurance available and how to save money on rental fees?
Did you get paid for this?
Everyone thinks they are totally covered when their insurer tells them they are however, LOSS OF USE (meaning the time the car rental company does not have access to rent the car while it is being repaired) Diminished Value (the car is now worth less) is usually not covered. Meaning you have great insurance and yet you will be paying 300 to 500 in a accident like this should the rental company insist on these fees. Check with your insurer for these coverages on your policy.
Aside from watching your deductibles, if you are not at-fault for the accident you will be covered.
Source:
http://insurancequotesfor.me/how-does-an-accident-affect-my-car-insurance/