Daily Links: Grocery Shopping, Stuff, and the Value of a College Education
Wednesday, 13th August 2008 (by J.D. Roth) Now that I’m back to writing full-time after a couple weeks off, I’m overwhelmed by the things I have to share. I don’t know where to begin. And while I was busy with other priorities, you folks kept sending me great story ideas.
I’m not going to be able to highlight all of them, of course, but I’ll try to feature some of the best. Meanwhile, I’ll mention a few others in upcoming link roundups. Here, for example, are some recent articles from around the web that made me think:
“A four-year college degree, seen for generations as a ticket to a better life, is no longer enough to guarantee a steadily rising paycheck,” writes Greg Ip for The Wall Street Journal. I hate stories like this. They’re sensationalist, and that’s all. The data Ip cites in his article puts the lie to his thesis. He notes:
The average American with a college diploma still earns about 75% more than a worker with a high-school diploma and is less likely to be unemployed. Yet while that so-called college premium is up from 40% in 1979, it is little changed from 2001.
That’s it? That’s the panic? Salaries for college graduates aren’t continuing to increase over those without a degree? Forgive me for not being sympathetic. I think the real story should be that, on average, those with a college education still make nearly twice as much as those without a college diploma. But what do I know? I’m not a financial expert.
Bob at Christian Personal Finance recently asked a number of bloggers (including yours truly), “If you needed to make $200 in two weeks, how would you do it?” He was hoping for more varied responses. Most of us said the same thing: sell stuff. A few people suggested finding more work, but most of us agreed that selling stuff is the quickest way to generate cash.
Meanwhile, a recent National Public Radio story asked, “Are you sure you own your stuff?” The piece profiles members of The Maker Movement, which is “about reusing and repairing objects, rather than discarding them to buy more. On a deeper level, it’s also a philosophical idea about what ownership really is.” Interesting.
Finally, Andrea Dickson at Wise Bread compiled a guide to grocery shopping for the cheap and lazy. I like Dickson’s article because it’s not the same old advice that you usually here. (Not that there’s anything wrong with the same old advice.) Her approach is all about flexibility.
This article is about Spare Change
While I agree that what Ip wrote was in the vein of sensationalism, I would argue (in his defense) that PERHAPS this will become an issue because of inflation over the course of time. In terms of the difference between 2001 and 2008…well, isn’t the whole point to be looking at the long-term?
Short version: Ip’s sentence was ridiculous, but inflation might be problematic – but only in the long run.
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Trying to be positive, seeing how college degrees are worth as much as before, maybe we should evaluate how much to spend on college.
If you can reduce your expenses by going to a two year college first with its much lower tuition, it could help reduce the gap. Community college in both my old state and new state are very low compared to the universities nearby and haven’t changed dramatic over the last couple of years.
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To raise $200 in two weeks? I’m guessing that the entire point of the exercise is that I don’t get to quit my day job, which at the end of two weeks is going to pay me $2k after tax. I suppose the point of the exercise is that I need (my normal money) plus $200, for some emergency reason.
It’s an interesting exercise. “Sell stuff” is by far the best option because stuff can always be replaced later (if you even determine that you still need it after going without). There are some work options that basically would demand me leaving my job, but could raise the money very quickly… wait tables at a steakhouse, sell cars at your local dealership, you know, high-turnover jobs with quick hires, cash in the pocket daily if you perform, and no hard feelings if you walk away after your emergency is over. I don’t think any of that beats “sell my Wii and pocket $250-300 or so and just buy another in a few months when things are stable again” as a practical option. The “sell stuff” angle might take you all of fifteen total minutes out of your ordinary schedule, counting the Craigslist post or eBay listing and arranging to ship or transact the item after you’re paid.
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JD,
As you mentioned I did get a bunch of similar responses from the pf bloggers, but the comments section of it has actually yielded some interesting results! Go figure!
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If you transfer from community college, you better make sure you network like crazy at the new school and ingrain yourself in the minds of your fellow students and profs. Otherwise, it may very well be worthwhile to do all four years at the same school.
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Hmmmm…. I was making $45k in 2000, and decided to quit and go back to school full time to get a 4 yr degree. I have earned it a year and a half ago, and for this I am rewarded with NO job…I don’t feel well paid at all…and the increasing work gap isn’t helping
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I think that a college education is still a good investment to make in your future. However, I think that four years is a long time to just focus on learning.
I think it is time for both high school and college curriculum to include helping students to graduate with a diploma (high school) or degree (college) and a stock/bond portfolio, some type if real estate investment, a small business that generates at least $1,000 a month, a strong credit card rating, and as little educational debt as possible.
The principle of compounding interest does not stop just because your in high school or college and that interest can sure compound quickly over those 8 years.
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I think the real story should be that, on average, those with a college education still make nearly twice as much as those withOUT a college diploma.
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Yikes! Thanks, PinkKate. Apparently I’m not a typing expert, either. Kris is mocking me for my lousy editing skills.
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I wonder if this kind of reporting — to the effect that a college degree doesn’t serve you much better than a high-school diploma in terms of earning power — is a cause for the disappearance of men in college and university classrooms. As increasing numbers of women show up in our halls, fewer and fewer men join them.
Where are the guys? Do they figure they’ll be better off at age 21 with four years of work experience, even if it’s scutwork, than starting at the entry level after sitting in classes for four years? Or are they wary of racking up debt in the form of student loans?
Not sure I agree that attending a community college for the first two years puts you at some sort of social or networking disadvantage. Most people don’t start their major course of studies until their junior year, and so that’s plenty of time to schmooze with professors and classmates. Where I have taught, students come over from the community colleges in cohorts — they all know each other and many have formed strong friendships that last for many years beyond university graduation. The savings you gain by doing your lower-division work in a community college, especially if you live at home, can be huge. And it’s the university you graduate from that goes on your resume: you don’t list the community college; you list the school where you finished your bachelor’s degree.
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I must be the only one who went to college for myself with money being ancillary. I find that quite sad.
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The biggest mistake I made was going to a 4-year university directly out of high school. I received my post-college jobs not because of my degree, but because of my work experience and my ability to work up to a management position at the same company for 3 years (also, while going to college, who has the luxury of not working and just going to school?)
My parents, as well as many of my friend’s parents still believe that you will work a dead-end job if you never go to a 4-year university. While I think college is important to many professions, I think about those who have been very successful after attending a technical or specific certificate/degree program that also taught networking skills and assisted with job placement. So many HS graduates are forced into a 4-year by family or societal pressures. It is very hard for a 18 or 19 year old to figure out what they want to do with their life while experiencing new-found freedom.
Where I am at now. After becoming a General Studies major (sorry, I wanted to party and work when I was 20, 21), I worked as an event planner and HR manager. Hating the field I was in, I am now going for my Masters in Speech Therapy. Yes, I am shelling out more for an education. But it is something that is so specific, and needed, that my rate of return is virtually “guaranteed”. Now for my graphic designer boyfriend, 2 years was all he would have needed, and been able to start earlier. After being pushed into a 4-year, he was 2 years behind most of his peers and struggled to prove that a 4-year degree with no work experience was just as good as a 2-year degree with 2 years of work experience. It wasn’t, and it’s still not, but luckily, that was a long time ago, and hopefully those struggles are over, and the difference is not as apparent anymore.
I think that there should be more choices after high school, and that these alternative choices, such as non 4-year schools and work experiences should not be frowned upon. I still think that a lot of parents and students feel that working or going to a community college is for students who aren’t good enough, but realistically, it could be a very financially sound decision.
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without a college degree, and subsequent graduate studies, i couldn’t pursue what interests me most. i know that’s fairly uncommon but science is demanding.
my husband is at community college right now. he’s had a very good experience while working on his associate’s degree, and the cost has been very reasonable. his anticipated starting salary in the new field is equivalent to what he made when he left the old field- after nearly 10 years of experience. part of that is the specifics of the fields, part of that is the value of specialty education.
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These type of articles fail to emphasize the type of degree the students in college are pursuing. They are way too generalized, putting together every type of degree such as an engineering and business degree with majors like turf management and psychology.
Colleges will gladly let you pursue a meaningless, garbage degree in hopes of you coming back for Graduate school when you finally realize you just wasted 4-5 years on a degree that is totally useless in the real world. I’ve witnessed too many graduates who went after some easy-to-earn degree and now work as a waitress or work in a pizza shop…
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How many people would let an eighteen year old decide their career? I don’t think anyone here would. When I was in high school we did not receive any career advice and at eighteen had to decide what to do with the rest of my life. Luckily I went in the service, before college and after getting out picked a career which I enjoy. The G. I. Bill helped a lot also. The military is not for everyone, but going straight college out of high school seems like a bad idea. Kids should take some time to get to know them selves first and find out what they enjoy.
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Regarding the grocery shopping:
I think the conventional wisdom is right that the most cost-effective way to buy groceries is to do a trip once every week or two.
That said, the method that the linked article was suggesting isn’t necessarily bad. The expensive habits include restaurants, takeout, and not using or throwing out food you already purchased.
But if stopping at the store once a day and buying relatively inexpensive food works cost-effectively for someone, then great. I doubt its as inexpensive as shopping once a week, but it isn’t necessarily anything close to the expense of a restaurant.
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Of DH’s immediately family of 5 siblings and their spouses, only 3 of us have 4-year college degrees (2 have gotten or are working on 2-year degrees as adults), and we’ve also been able to earn the most money and have the broadest range of choices of where to work and for whom. I agree that some degrees are more likely to lead to high pay than others, but success in most jobs depends on many qualities beyond your major.
I very much enjoyed the article about shopping and eating. I vaguely remember being single and shopping and preparing meals only for myself on the fly. A lot of her ideas would be a good way to change-up our weekly family cooking and planning, especially her use of daily fresh ingredients found at farmer’s markets in season. Mmmmmm.
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I think what this article is trying to say is you have to find a balance, there are alot more degrees available out there today, and what you do see is people getting out of college with a HUGE DEBT that has to be repaid in ten years, so you need a high paying job in order to live. So if you look at it this way, there are many cases where if you included the debt maybe it would not pay, maybe a community college or trade college are a good deal. I can’t beleive what it costs to go to college at some of the elite universities, is it really worth 40,000 a year, not including living expenses, if you borrow all of that money where does it put you? What are your education payments going to be? No one looks at this before they go to school. They just assume that they will get this great high paying job when there done, and the truth is they need to. I went to a secondary school and only about 80% of the graduates went to work in the field, what a waste of money if you don’t use the education that you received or are unable to get a job in the field! With todays economy you have to wonder where college graduates are going to get jobs. You would have to be very flexible.
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I just read a pretty interesting article about the pointlessness of a college degree – the author makes a very interesting point that instead of degrees, individuals should be awarded standard certifications based on test performance(a la the CPA exam). What does everyone think?
http://wsj.com/article/SB121858688764535107.html?mod=opinion_main_commentaries
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Sometimes certification exams only prove how well you can do at taking exams. My husband has his own computer consultancy business, and he’s met plenty of techs who talk up all the certifications they’ve earned … but they aren’t worth a darn in the field. They may know how to regurgitate information to pass a test, but that hasn’t taught them the creative problem-solving / solution-finding skills they need to service computers and networks.
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I’m going to take a different slant on the topic: Maybe the earnings havn’t increased because the quality of the applicants with college degrees have not increased, but have actually decreased. I am seeing more and more new employees enter our organization with four year degrees, who have received a very poor education. It seems that today, the goal upon enter college is to acquire a piece of parchment, instead of acquiring knowledge. So, as an employer, are you going to pay more for knowledge, or a piece of paper on the wall?
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I am extremely dubious of his claim that most college degrees could be replaced with certification exams. Maybe it does work for CPAs, but in the two places I am closest to certification exams (in my own industry of computer programming, and in my wife’s industry of childhood education), certification exams are worthless at best and a detriment to real learning at worst.
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I thought that (or a similar) article was interesting in that they use the example of someone with 20+ years of experience to say “My college degree isn’t worth anything!”. Why no, you have an extra 20 years of experience. Your major was computer science. Things are a tad different now than they were in the late 80s. There comes a point where you should be building up on those basic level college-educated skills – promotions, graduate certifications/degrees, etc. Sounds like someone does a piss-poor job networking or keeping up in their field.
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