Your friends and family influence you. They affect the way you view life. If your friends are frugal, it’s easier to be frugal yourself. But if they’re wrapped up in consumerism and materialism, and can be difficult to resist the urge to join them. It’s only natural to want to fit in.
Rob wrote yesterday to ask how to handle a situation where he wants to lead a simple life, but those around him aren’t supportive. How can he cope with peer pressure? Here’s his story:
Since we try to live frugally, we don’t have a television or video games or any other electronic toys in our house. We try to spend time as a family, talk to each other, read books, try to help my wife in cooking etc.
My colleagues at work tell me that I live a miserable life, and I don’t give my family “materialistic life pleasures”. Those sort of words hurt me a lot. We don’t have a TV at our house and my colleague makes fun of this thing all the time.
How should I respond to people like this? Should I even pay attention to them? I don’t want to spoil my relationships at work. I’ll bet a lot of your readers experience the same thing. What are your thoughts?
It can be tough when you’re trying to save, trying to focus on the simple things, and everyone else around you seems to value Stuff. But materialism doesn’t lead to happiness. Though having money might increase your happiness, wanting money (and things it can buy) almost certainly will not. “Indeed, not only does materialism not bring happiness,” writes Sonja Lyubormirsky in The How of Happiness, “but it’s been shown to be strong predictor of unhappiness.”
Rob needs to ask himself some questions: “Am I happy? Is my family happy?” If he can answer yes to both of these, then what does he care what other people think? If he continues to struggle, he should remind himself of a few ways to cope with peer pressure:
- Trust your instincts. If you’re sure of your choices and the reasoning behind them, say so. When you get pressure, explain that you’re happy just the way you are. Be confident. Be proud to be a non-conformist.
- Laugh it off. When your friends and family get on your case, make a joke and move on. Don’t let their opinions rattle you.
- Find other friends. This isn’t always possible (or desirable). Rob may be stuck with his co-workers eight hours a day. But if your friends are pressuring you into a lifestyle you don’t want, hang out with other friends. True friends support each other; they don’t tear each other down.
To live happily as a non-conformist in a world filled with peer pressure, you have to learn to ignore everybody. Do what you believe is right, and to hell with what other people think.
To me, Rob’s life doesn’t sound miserable. It sounds idyllic. It’s the sort of thing Kris and I aspire to: spending time together, talking and reading. I’m proud of what he’s doing.
Do you have financial trolls in your life? How do you handle them? How do you cope with peer pressure?
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This is off topic but I couldn’t help but respond to 37 (Kevin). I think the major reason for this would simply be the amount of really high quality content in each medium. TV has only been around about 100 years which means less content, which means less quality content. I think it would be hard to make a case that your average TV viewer is watching 8 hours of quality content every night. Reading by contrast has been going on in high volumes for over 10,000 years. This means that we have accumulated over time a lot more quality literature than TV content.
I don’t think anyone could successfully argue that Dante’s Inferno is on the same plane as Friends. Also, I think that reading for comprehension is a lot more engaging than watching sitcoms.
That being said, I hear where you’re coming from. Not ever reader is reading the great classics. I think some things on TV can be just as intellectually challenging as good literature (Mad Men for example) and I think that if you discuss what you’ve seen it can be just as engaging.
I think reading has high prestige because it has such a large intellectual canon and in theory people could choose to read those for their entire lives.
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OTOH we don’t know if Rob is one of those “trolls” who says in a superior tone, *I* don’t watch television!, as if it was a supreme moral virtue! If so, he is merely attracting what he is putting out. If one chooses to live against the grain and one cannot handle negative attention, one should keep a low profile, yes?
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I think JD made an important point about not judging people who do watch TV and who do enjoy it. I live in an area where it is cool to not have a tv. When folks get up on their soapbox about it my argument is that tv is better than ever because you control how you watch it now- with tivo, on demand, dv, hulu, netflix, etc. Plus the programming is the best its ever been- actng, stories, production value, etc.
I’m 29 and haven’t been peer-pressured in years- who do you people hang out with?
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I completely understand where Rob is coming from. Many of my coworkers also have different values than I do, and it does get frustrating at times. I know that I’m making the right choices for me (like weekend trips a few times a month!), and I do have friends that support those choices, but at work, it’s a completely different story.
I have been called “cheap” more times than I care to admit, and when I turn down expensive nights out that just don’t fit in my budget, I’ve been asked rudely what I spend all my money on instead. I usually come with an answer along the lines of “whatever I please,” and then I look outside of the office for people who agree that I’m NOT cheap. Bonus points if they’ll join me at the $1.50 movie theater afterward.
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To each their own, but I get real tired of people sanctimoniously vilifying TV. It’s as tiresome as someone who says the only radio they listen to is NPR. JD says that he wouldn’t really get much done on this site if he was a TV watcher. That isn’t so much a “problem” with TV as much it’s a “problem” with JD.
Same with people who are say they are affected by advertising in their spending habits.
As for the frugality of not owning a TV, I think the rabbit ears hooked up to my 10+ year old CRT TV and my Roku box which gives me the ability to watch “30 Rock” and “The Office” and Netflix movies on something larger than my laptop screen is a pretty good frugal decision. If you want to talk about Cable/Satellite subscription that’s different.
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On the “no judging” thing, I want to point out that although I personally don’t like TV, I hardly have the moral high ground. I spend my spare time reading COMIC BOOKS, for goodness sake. And without my moral compass (read: Kris), I’d be playing World of Warcraft 20 hours a day.
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I’m lucky to work in an office where we’re very honest with these things, and it seems to work very well.
One coworker is saving up for a big Round-the-World trip, another bags his lunch every day so his wife can stay home with the two kids, one just bought a house, etc.
I’m surprised to see that “Honesty” wasn’t listed as one of J.D.’s suggestions.
People are far less likely to feel judged and respond accordingly if the conversation isn’t “I don’t have a TV because I think it’s a giant, expensive time suck”, but instead “I don’t have a TV because we try to spend our weekends out at the ski hill” or “I don’t have a TV because we’re trying to trim down expenses before the baby arrives next year”.
There are few side benefits to this approach: it can open up a real dialogue with your coworkers (What do they want in life? What do they value outside of work?), remove the stigma associated with saving and frugality, and if they’re big credit spenders, plant the idea that there are trade-offs and sacrifices and that’s okay.
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When people comment on how I do things, I only have one thing to say: This is a free country, and I’m allowed to live however I want. There is a word for people who want everybody to have the same things, and I believe that word is Communism. When you turn it around and accuse people of being communists, it usually puts an abrupt stop to the comments.
I truely believe this. If somebody wants to buy a 70″ TV and pay hundreds of dollars a month for cable, that’s great for them. If somebody wants to not own a TV, that’s great for that guy. Want to read books? Great for you. Hate reading books? That’s fine too. Love your cell phone? I’m happy that you do. Hate cell phones? Don’t own one.
Anybody who wants to tell me what I should and should not do with my money can take a long walk off a short pier.
Sorry for getting up on my soapbox and ranting a little, but after reading this article I got mad at Rob’s friends for him. They sounds a bit like Jerks in this context.
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There is a BIG difference between frugal and cheap. I consider myself frugal, and enjoy the company of frugal friends, and even not-so-frugal friends. I do not like being with people who are cheap.
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Oh, thank you for posting this just before Thanksgiving. Most of my friends and co-workers are working artists, teachers, social workers, secretaries and are frugal like me, sometimes even more so! But my sister has a very highly paid job and every Thanksgiving she goes out of her way to make me feel like the sad country mouse.
Sometimes I can blow this off, remember my real goals and shrug it off, but it’s hard during that holiday ritual known as Black Friday to say I don’t wish to shop recreationally and would rather hang out at home or maybe see a movie. I feel like I’m being snooty and nun-like and spoiling the fun. But I don’t want to drop hundreds of dollars on clothes because its the day after Thanksgiving.
It was easier when I was actually poor and really could NOT go shopping. But that’s not so much the case. Once I said, okay, I need a good winter hat, so I’ll go shopping and I’ll just buy my hat. But that goal was accomplished after about 10 minutes and the rest of the day was nightmarish and sad.
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I really liked the mini rant! I had a neighbor that constantly tried to convince me to buy a flat screen TV. I thought it was strange, I think people want you to be like them, it kind of justifies their decisions in a way. Usually if you say something simple explaining why you don’t have / buy X then people will sometimes open up and come out of the woodwork to discuss it with you. And some people that are giving you a hard time about whatever it is are very insecure and they will actually start to feel inadequate that they’re not doing what you’re doing.
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Two words–ignore them. Ignore them and bask in the peace of mind that you are providing a better life for your family by doing what you are doing with your finances.
Its as simple as that
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@Matt (#44):
Thanks for the comment, I see your point. I think I’m falling victim to the same mentality outlined in this post – that of seeing others’ dismissal of my values as a personal attack. Whenever someone comments that they read books instead of watching TV, it always comes off with an air of superiority, in my opinion. They never say, “Oh, you like TV? That’s cool. I prefer to read.” But rather, more often than not, it comes across as, “TV? Pfffft! Enjoy your brainwashing, lemming. I prefer enlightenment to corporate-mind control.”
One more comment I’d like to make. J.D. mentioned that he reads “with” his wife. I’m sorry, but unless you’re reading over her shoulder and turning the pages together, you’re not reading “with” her. You’re reading “near” her. You’re not interacting at all with each other. On the other hand, when I’m watching TV with my wife, it’s a shared experience. We can pause the program and discuss what just happened, or what we think will happen next. After the program is over, we chat about it while we do chores or get our lunches ready for work the next day.
I don’t mean to beat a dead horse, but it just really irks me when people think they’re superior, because they read books “near” their loved ones, and look down on me for sharing a TV experience with my wife. You’ve got it backwards, in my opinion!
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I’d just go with teasing them right back ala minderbender (although sex might not be appropriate workplace talk). Just mention all the cool things you do do have time to do and enjoy — tease them about not knowing when to trade wheat for sheep in Settlers of Cataan or about all the books you read or what have you.
Just gently point out that you don’t all enjoy the same pleasures. One person’s football obsession is another’s Star Trek; one person’s arts and crafts is another’s model railroading; tv for comic books; gardening for historical research; and on and on.
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I always ask myself, Why is this person acting this way, i.e. troll-like?
Usually it comes down to them needing reassurance from you that their way of living is the right way, because deep down they know it’s not. In being frugal, and happy about my decisions, I don’t feel the need to make others feel awful about theirs.
It reminds me of high school bullying. The bullies were the ones with the lowest self-esteem.
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I think it depends on the person commenting. If it’s a work person, I tend to laugh it off. If it’s a friend, I will generally take the time to explain why it is I personally don’t need whatever it is he or she is talking about. If it’s a family member, well, I guess it depends on which family member.
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My coworkers give me a hard time about eating so many vegetables. Obviously I’m not going to stop eating vegetables and start eating donuts instead just to fit in – and I don’t believe my coworkers expect me to do so. I recognize it as the harmless ribbing it is.
If I didn’t believe it was harmless ribbing, I still wouldn’t let it get to me. I know that my lifestyle is sustainable and will work for me over the long haul. If they all want to get iphones, I am happy for them!
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Growing up, my mom watched TV a LOT. She used to yell at my sister and me when we would try to talk to her because a TV program was on, even if it was a movie she’d seen many times. It made me feel worthless and our relationship definitely was damaged. As I got older, watching TV became the main activity we did together as a family, other than fighting.
Now I’m 24 and I live thousands of miles away from home, but every time I visit my mom she is completely focused on me and wants to maximize her time with me. We haven’t watched TV together in years (except an occasional Virginia Tech football game). However, my older sister and my mom never developed a sound relationship. My sister hasn’t had cable for years, is living frugally in a “tiny house” solely on her husband’s salary, and has had 5 children in 6 years that she spends quality time with every day (I guess the “more time for sex” thing was true for her…)
My point is TV watching, if it becomes the main focus of your home life, can damage relationships forever. Kudos to you Rob.
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You can use metal clothes hangers (preferable unpainted) to roast hot dogs and marshmallows.
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I usually find the easiest rseponse to give when people I don’t want to bother with tease me about our no TV choice is to say “Oh, I get way too sucked into TV. If we had one, I’d never get anything done.”
Being a little self-deprecating usually disarms them and ends the conversation.
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Hi Rob!
Couple things come to mind that might help you deal with your annoying coworkers:
1) Be proud of your choice… AND DISPLAY IT! Tell them of all the things you and your family got to do and see because you didn’t spend the night on couch watching telly. Did you take a walk and see something interesting- participate in a neighborhood event- make an amazing meal- read a really interesting article/essay/post online?
2) Apart from TV/movies I have noticed that people love to talk about two things: what they’ve read and what they’ve eaten. Poke around and see if one or more of your coworkers might be interested in this type of “gossip”. Maybe there’s somebody who religiously reads PC magazine (just like you). Or loves Italian food (just like you) and is more than happy to exchange recipes and restaurant recommendations.
3) Think about the personalities of each individual coworker and see if you could find a common interest. Maybe as a mob they talk/behave quite differently than they do as individuals. Try to see and draw out the individual behind the mob. The office isn’t really that different from the high-school class after all!
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Rob, this has more to do with them than it does you. You can’t control how they’re going to react to your life decisions — which, frankly, are none of their business — but you can control how you react to their reactions. I’d say to take a deep breath, remind yourself of that, and move on. Sometimes people just have to agree to disagree.
I applaud your efforts!
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I wouldn’t demonize television but I do acknowledge that many people don’t have the discipline to get up and walk away from their televisions.
I have never been one to give in to peer pressure in any aspect of my life; finance is just one more area where I do as I please.
Some ways of responding to financial peer pressure are better than others. Even a whiff of self-righteousness in your refusal to join in can result in being targetted further. Being judgmental serves nobody well.
I usually respond positively to another person’s purchase or financial bragging because it is obvious they are looking for validation or attention when they mention it to me.
It’s no skin off my nose to say, “Wow! Your Google Android phone sure is well-designed. It looks like something out of Star Trek!” Nothing at all wrong with complimenting it and if they push me to buy one too just shrug and say, “Aw, that’s okay, I have a little cell that does everything I need.”
I usually take the opportunity to ask about the product, how much they paid, where they got it, etc. and file it away for future reference. My little cell may be fine now, but stuff doesn’t last forever and one day it will need to be replaced; and by that time I may be able to pick up a fancy phone used for a fraction of the cost.
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@ Nicole – I like the way you think
That’s an excellent strategy. (I wonder if it will work when my relatives ask about my love life too?) 
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To people who say watching TV is unproductive, here is an alternative to consider. What is productivity, how do you define it. So lets say, you get rid of a TV, spend time with your family, do talking reading etc. how long will you do it, what will you have to discuss every day, day after day. Definition of productivity is personal. If you want escapism for an hour or two and you want to watch TV that’s fine. But if you are addicted to the shows, that’s where the problem is. I save around 50% of my take home, live within my means, with no CC or auto debt. But at the same time, I watch TV, splurge on spending on things when I really want them. I watch ads but they dont affect me unless its something I am looking for and is on a great deal. The key to everything is moderation. So, as much as the person who mocks Rob is at fault, the same applies to people who just blatantly say watching TV is a waste of time…
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Oh good so its ok to admit when we watch a DVD on our 20 year old TV we have to turn a DIAL on the 29 year old receiver that controls the volume on our “suround sound” speakers from the 80′s that seem to be growing in size each year??
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DH and I “broke up with” Direct TV last year. We had the DVR, TiVO, and NFL Sunday Ticket package. We were spending $65/mo during the summer and $110/mo during football season. We now spend $9.18/mo for the basic of basic cable package. We get the major networks (ABC, NBC, FOX, CBS) plus PBS, Ion, National Geographic, and WGN America.
The extra time has been more valuable than the extra money each month. I’ve already read more books in the last few months than I did all of last year. Plus it’s much easier to “find time” to spend with our daughter and help her with homework. Plus we’ve been playing more games and spending more time outside.
It’s amazing what shows and movies are online for free. We even watch some sports on the computer.
Of course our friends and family think it’s weird. But we are very happy so we don’t care.
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My husband works with a woman who spends ridiculous amounts of money on her kids. Last Christmas, she bought her 8 year old daughter a laptop which her daughter promptly broke. This year, she wants to buy her 10 year old son a smart phone. My husband tells her she’s crazy and she always tells him “you’ll see when you have kids.”
I believe most people who tell us frugal types that we are living in the stone age or that we can’t possibly be happy with not having all the latest things for our families just feel guilty. My husband and I don’t work crazy schedules anymore. We enjoy our time together. We don’t need all the latest material things because we have each other. It’s sad to see all these people running the rat race to keep up with the Joneses, just to realize they still aren’t happy.
I applaud all those who keep a simpler life and remember that time is the greatest gift you can give your family.
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From a 20-something perspective I can totally related. I was in a ton of debt (from supporting myself through college) and now finally I’m pulling my self out and almost free. I dont have a TV (other than for viewing DVD’s and using free cable from my internet connection) and I’m perfectly fine with it, in fact I love it. I live alone and I love the silence, I find myself doing so much more that I really want to do instead of lazing around in front of the TV. Get this I also never had an I-pod until someone upgraded their’s and did not want the “old” one anymore. So now I have an “old” generation i-pod which, get this, plays music, and does nothing else. It works perfectly and was free.
I agree with other people. I guess it was how I was raised, I never grew up with cable TV or even a microwave. Keep working hard on your goals and secretly laugh and how much farther along you will be than all the others!
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I think a lot of people are glossing over the impact Rob’s frugality might be having on his kids. I accept that not having a tv or electronic games/video games etc has positive benefits, like more family time, more emphasis on physical activity, more kids reading etc etc ….. But children who don’t have these things are often ostracised at school. And bad teasing and even bullying at school has quite far-reaching consequences. I don’t think it’s inconceivable that teasing and bullying would result from the lack of tv. I’ve seen it with my own eyes. I also know a close friend who never had a tv growing up (we’re in our twenties, so it was definitely the norm during the 80s to have a tv at home) and there are so many times where I reference something from my childhood viewing and we realise she doesn’t share that experience. You might argue that her childhood experiences could still be richer than mine and you might be right, but you really need to consider this issue carefully before you do this to your kids, in my opinion. As for material goods in general – every generation of kids has something that becomes virtually standard and not just for the rich kids. Folks who choose extreme frugality (don’t know what extreme applies to Rob admittedly) or other alternative lifestyles run the real risk of having their kids shunned at school. You can take the moral high ground if you want and say your kids are learning an important principle from you, but you’d have to accept the negative impact on their childhood experience and be willing to defend your decision all the way.
Just my take on this issue. Not particularly high-brow, but I’d recommend reading “About a Boy” by Nick Hornsby. The child in that book really suffers at the hands of his mother’s decision to lead a certain kind of lifestyle. It’s done very humorously and is a fun read. The Hugh Grant movie version is also pretty good and does represent some of the bullying too.
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A few have already said this, but your coworker is saying more about his or her insecurities than your choices.
My choices about diet and lifestyle make it difficult to relate to many of my coworkers, and as much as I try to keep my choices and reasons under wraps, I inevitably catch flak when, say, I politely decline a doughnut on doughnut day.
When you are secure with your choices, you don’t feel the need to give someone else a hard time for theirs. I do exactly what J.D. recommended: trust myself and laugh it off.
Also, as a kid, we had a TV, but no cable, unlike all of my friends. And I mean ALL of my friends. No, I didn’t know what happened on the latest episode of Ren and Stimpy, and as a kid, it bothered me a little when my friends were talking about it at school and I was left out. As an adult, I thank my father for encouraging me to read and play outside instead. Those are memories that are still with me today, and I’m grateful to him for not letting me spend my weekends in front of the TV.
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While I think everyone realizes that it doesn’t matter what anyone else thinks, the things people say are still very hurtful. Life is like High School only now we pay our own bills.
The best Rob can do is to avoid those people who give him a hard time as much as possible. Finding new friends who share your same thought process and lifestyle is one thing, finding new work mates may be more difficult. Sometimes there just isn’t anyway to avoid them. The best you can do then is to come up with the snappy comebacks such as the “more time for sex”. My guess is that any sort of comeback with a sexual connatation to it is going to shut these guys up. “I prefer to touch my wife’s buttons and not my iphone’s.” “My wife’s “Showtime after dark” is far better than what I can pay the cable company for.” “Why watch 18 Kids and counting when I can practice with my wife.”
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@KC (#50)
“It would be easy for me to see their $80k Audi or their country club memberships (plural!) and want those. But I don’t. In fact these friends are pretty easy. No one talks about money unless its about a sale or some good deal in town. We don’t compare stuff. We might admire someones jewelry and talk about that for a while (not the costs, just the styles), but for the most part we talk about family, friends and tennis. Maybe the haves are easier on each other than the have-nots?”
Well, there’s a pretty serious taboo on talking about money amongst people who’ve actually grown up wealthy. Unless it’s, like you said, bragging about a particularly good find on Craigslist or something, you’re not going to find them rubbing your nose in it or needling other people about their financial choices. Not in polite company, anyhow.
Several of our friends follow these rules, along with several other rules for how to behave in polite company (not criticizing people, being careful to consider other people’s needs when planning an event, etc), and other than occasionally kicking myself for saying something crude (I was not raised in polite company
, I really enjoy it.
It sounds like we as a society could stand to think a little more about being considerate, and a little less about competing with each other to consume the most “stuff”.
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My parents are very into giving lots of material gifts at Christmas. They say they genuinely enjoy the shopping and wrapping processes, but they always seem stressed out to me. I personally detest holiday shopping and can’t/won’t compete with them in how much I spend. They always ask me for a list of things I want, but I’ve come to hate making it because I don’t reciprocate in equal quantity/expense. I’ve tried asking for “experience gifts” like a day trip somewhere we would all enjoy, but they prefer to give objects that can be wrapped and placed under the tree. This year I’m giving them one object gift each and coupons for services I can provide, such as dogsitting. Not sure how it will go over, but I’m tired of getting sucked into the buy-the-perfect-present frenzy.
As for TV, I live in an area where poor reception meant that without cable, you only got PBS. Perfect for me. However, I moved out of state last year and had an apartment with free cable. I only miss the news shows. Now that I’m back in my hometown, I’m debating whether enjoying Keith Olbermann and Rachel Maddow is reason enough to get cable. Is there any way to watch nightly news shoes online?
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There are a couple people in my life that make fun of us for not having cable. These are the same people that get off work, veg in front of the TV for hours, go to bed (often with the TV still on) and repeat again the next day. They can’t imagine a life without TV because *it is their entire life*. It is truly a very sad situation.
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I’m fairly frugal myself and don’t go out much. I do have a TV and on average watch an hour of TV a day. I use it more for watching DVDs that I’ve picked up from the library.
Anyway, I wanted to make a point about work colleagues. Maybe my situation is unusual but we don’t talk about our personal lives very much. Everyone kind of keeps their private lives private. Whether someone owns a TV or not I don’t know. How they spend their money I don’t know. Those people that I consider a friend – and those are ones I would hangout with outside work – I trust and are obviously people who know more about me.
You don’t have to tell every person you work with your personal business or lifestyle. It doesn’t affect them. If you do want to chat about what you do outside work then be prepared for some negative comments!
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Dear JD:
Social validation is really important in many people’s lives. I liked your suggestions on how to deal with the above described situation.
One the resonated with me the most was changing your friends. People want to fit in, without others our life has not meaning. Let me rephrase it. We should be who we want to be and find other friends who support who we are.
The thing is, nobody is that unique that they will not find anybody to relate to. There are other people in the world who have similar interests and thoughts.
Think about it. People who are interesting in frugal and simple living, come to this website to share their ideas and support each other. That is what it is all about.
You will never satisfy everybody, just be sure be on your own path, live your own mission in life and create an environment supportive of what you want to be.
Best,
Tomas
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How to deal with being teased? At work, I’m teased regularly about stuff. One coworker even teases me about the fact that I save money at all. I just tease them all right back, or laugh it off. It would be different if it were mean-spirited (or if I chose to take it that way). That could certainly become toxic. But generally, being a good sport about the fact that your choices may be unusual, and joining in on the good-natured ribbing can be a really great way to deflect negative feelings about it.
As for TV specifically, whatever your choice is, that’s what it is. But it does seem that a lot of people who don’t watch TV or don’t have a TV act very superior about it. There’s nothing inherently bad about TV. Shows are becoming ever more sophisticated and by watching them, you actually absorb a lot of useful information and can learn a lot. See the book ‘Everything Bad Is Good For You’ for some excellent examples and explanations. And as someone else noted, reading is an inherently solitary activity, while watching TV as a family can be a great experience because you can pause, wait until commercial, or talk after the program is over and end up getting in to some really interesting discussions. My parents and I used to weekly watch movies or TV together as a family, and it’s a tradition I hope to pass on when I have children.
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All good thoughts, but I would add one thing. One of the recent GRS articles I read said to “do what works for you.” In my own quest for financial independence, I can easily do without name brand clothing and vacations. I would not want to do without tv or internet. It’s how I’m wired. Other people are the opposite. I take no offense to this.
I think that sometimes in peoples’ enthusiasm for a way of life that works for them, they can be preachy about what they are doing (without meaning to, of course) and the natural backlash of others is to push against it. Rob needs to assess if he is doing this to his coworkers.
An example: I assure you, I do not care where my co-workers shop, but when they razz me for shopping at Wal Mart, my natural instinct is to push back because I can’t stand for others to tell me what is right for me and my family. (Interesting that the people who comment on this make twice what I make and have no kids… easy for them to pay higher prices elsewhere… but I digress…)
If you don’t want to watch TV, fine. If you don’t want to shop at a big box store, fine. More power to you. But if you truly don’t want others to judge or comment on your chosen lifestyle, I would ask that you have the courtesy and self awareness not to do the same to your co-workers. I can’t imagine that a co-worker would comment on another’s household unless they felt that their own households were somehow being judged.
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I had a teacher in high school who didn’t have TV. People (by which I mean the students) made fun of her for that. They seemed to think it meant she lived in a cave, away from the real world.
She didn’t know what was going on in the world since she didn’t have TV. She didn’t know anythin about popular culture or shows so was out of touch. Etc, etc (that’s what people said, of course).
She read papers, had the radio and talked with other people so she was really aware of what was going on in the world, of course.
I think if having lots of Stuff is a symbol of power and stuff (which is why lots of people want stuff, to brag) it makes sense that the absence of Stuff would be looked down upon.
I don’t have TV either (I have a TV, for watching DVDs and playing games, though. But it doesn’t get any channels) although I watch TV online. I think it’s sad that so many people can’t imagine life without TV. There are so many other things to do.
About peer pressure… When I was in my first year of university, I was broke (keep in mind it’s in France where university is free) and my job basically paid for my food and little more (luckily didn’t have to pay a rent since I lived at my parent’s place).
I became friends with a girl whose family was extremely rich and gave her a huge allowance, bigger than most people’s salary.
Sometimes she’d want to go shopping. I remember one day going to the FNAC (French store that sells books, electronics and DVDs among other things), and being horrified as she spent a thousand euros (about double my monthly income) or stuff she didn’t even plan to buy originally.
Then we went to her place to drop all her bags, and out again to shop for clothes and then go to a comic store.
It was a horrible experience for me. I felt like crap. I didn’t even want any of the stuff she bought (well, maybe a few) but I felt like not being able to buy them made me inferior.
Every time we shopped together, I felt bad if I didn’t buy something, too.
She also wanted to eat at restaurants often. The first few times she invited me and it was nice to have great meals for free. Then she suggested I pay for the next time (she didn’t say it in any mean or weird or forcing way) and it only seemed fair but there was no way I could afford even fast food.
She wanted to go to the theatre often and although I couldn’t afford it I couldn’t say “no” every single time.
I’m glad I never had a credit card because I would have gone in debt otherwise.
Stil nowadays, she makes me cringe when I think about how the money could be spent “better”. She hasn’t watched 90% of her movies, you know.
And she doesn’t really care. From time to time she just invites all her friends and show them a pile of stuff and says “I don’t want this anymore, if there is anything you want you just take it”.
I felt terrible at the time, but I would often take what nobody else had taken, just to sell it on ebay and make a bit of money.
That was a very different kind of peer pressure. While she never looked down on me, she didn’t realise that I couldn’t afford even a small portion of what she could. She knew how much I made but considered it to be “pocket money”, without realising that I needed to pay for my food, my clothes, my internet and other bills, etc. Since she didn’t have to pay for any of these things, all of her money was spent on entertainment (I include restaurants in that) and she thought it was the same for everyone.
I think the answer for that second type of peer pressure is to be honest with yourself and with your friend. And swallow your pride. If I had told her I couldn’t afford something, she would have been fine with it. The few times I worked up the courage to tell her, she just paid for me, and forgot about it right away.
I didn’t want to use her and I didn’t want her to think less of me so I didn’t dare be honest with her when I should have. We would have done things that were cheaper.
I should also have realised that it’s okay to let other pay for you. She didn’t want to go to the theatre by herself. When I said “no”, it deprived her or the movie she wanted to see. She would happily spend the price of two tickets for that entertainment rather than staying home bored.
By being too proud I also prevented HER from having fun when the amounts were just change for her if even that.
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Life is just too short to justify your well thought out decisions to others. As long as you are living the life you intended, who cares what the neighbors, co-workers or family members think?
I like the earlier suggestion to change the subject. Or simply say “Life is about balance and our lives are VERY well balanced.” Walk away content in the knowledge that you left them thinking.
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I’ve had good luck with a light comment combined with a what-I-do-instead. So, I might do:
“Oh, gosh, I live in a tiny house, and don’t know where I’d put a TV. I watch the few things I really want to watch on Hulu, online, or wait for it to be available on Netflix.”
or
“Everyone told me it’d be impossible to live without a microwave, but you know, I just haven’t missed it. I really don’t have a good place to put one – the previous tenant had it on top of the fridge, but I just didn’t feel safe climbing off the step stool (I’m 5′) holding hot food. I might have missed popcorn, but a good friend found me a great stovetop popcorn maker at a garage sale: works just as fast as the microwave, and it tastes so much better while being a lot healthier.”
or
“Yeah, it’s a tiny house (400 square feet), and I do want some more shelf space. But I love that I can clean the whole place in an hour or two, and that it feels so cozy and convenient when I’m home.”
I usually give just enough explanation of whatever their logical objection probably is to short-circuit it. (Like the microwave one.) Part of it, I think is also being authentic and up-front about the stuff that does matter to me.
I’m a librarian, so it shouldn’t be a surprise to my co-workers (high school staff) that I’m probably spending a lot more time reading or on the computer than watching TV. And when they know my hobbies include baking, or spinning yarn, or other more traditional crafts, the fact I prefer stove and oven to microwave isn’t a huge surprise either. I’m not talking oversharing private stuff, of course – just the little bits that come up in chatting.
On TV growing up – I was only allowed to watch PBS, or a very few other things with parental permission. I didn’t get that much teasing from classmates, but weirdly enough, it totally freaked out one of my high school English teachers, who insisted I watch an episode of the Wonder Years, so I’d better understand Romeo and Juliet. (No, I still don’t get her logic.)
I went home, got my parents to call in and explain to her exactly what I was doing on Tuesday nights instead. (Music lesson followed by time at the barn – I was a serious horseback rider at the time – followed by a meeting, and getting home around 9 to have a bath and go to bed.) I loved doing all those things, but wasn’t home to watch Tuesday’s episode on Tuesday (We did have a VCR, but I’d rather use my limited TV time on Dr. Who or Mystery, and besides, didn’t have time till the weekends). She gave up on it, with very bad grace.
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Peer presure is peer pressure, no matter what the thing is. I work with the youth at my church, and I tell them that the thing about peer pressure is that people want us to validate their own choices by following along and doing the same. If they’re dragging themselves down, they want you to drag yourself down with them.
Doesn’t matter if it’s underage drinking or grown-up financial matters. It’s a matter of knowing yourself well enough to be able to stand firm in what you believe to be right.
My husband once had a coworker who chewed him out for not buying me jewelry for Christmas. The coworker kept insisting that all wives expect jewelry from their husbands, and the implication was that my husband is a crappy one for not following suit. Thing is, I have beautiful jewelry, and I get overwhelmed by too many choices. I honestly don’t want anymore. My husband knows that, and he knows me well enough to know the things that I do want. It really bugged the coworker that my husband didn’t fall in line with his way of thinking. Again, it was a situation of someone needing someone else to validate his choices in life.
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I’d just like to point out that the assertion “reading is a solitary activity” is false.
One of the things my family used to do when I was growing up was read books together. Someone, generally my dad (who has an excellent reading voice), would read a book out loud for 20-30 minutes in the evenings. It started when we were pretty young, and continued until we were all well into our teens. We read a lot of books this way, and all enjoyed it. It’s something that I hope to do with my child(ren) eventually as well.
I’ll note that this wasn’t because we didn’t have a TV: we did, and we watched that (together or separately) as well. However, I have far richer memories of reading books together than I do of watching TV together.
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Great post! I’ve told all my close friends that I’m trying to pay off all my debt in the next three years so I have a tight budget these days. I’ve even told select coworkers. They all understand, and are supportive. If they weren’t, I suppose they wouldn’t be my friends.
In most offices there is a variety of “groups” – you know, some brown bag their lunches, some eat out every day, some have kids in private school, etc. Find your “group”.
Even if you’re in a very small office I guarantee there is at least one other person who is frugal like you. They probably just keep their mouth shut for fear of getting singled out like you are. Just start observing other’s habits and approach them to eat together, etc. You might be surprised how many there are!
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To me, it doesnt matter the subject of ridicule (TV in this case). Whatever it is, I continue to remain confident in my personal l;ife decisions and do what makes me happy.
For example, I run abuot 20 miles per week and eat healtheir than 95% of the US population. For years my co-workers and friends have made fun of my dining choices or sack lunches at work.
I’m doing what makes me happy. I’ve got this piece of my life EXACTLY where I want it.
I could care less that it creates opportuities for those around me to make fun. And without being rude or inappropriate, I let them know it by my confidence and resolve for my choices.
It drives them crazy as they eat their Big Mac…
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The TV guy might just not know what else to talk about. Standing around the water cooler discussing the latest big show can be a real bonding experience and some guys can’t talk about anything except sports. He might be feeling insecure about that and is resorting to teasing as a defense mechanism.
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Brandi, yes! I watch Maddow online, particularly listening while I do dishes.
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Well, first of all, I think that perhaps he should not broadcast the fact that he does not have electronic ‘toys’. What does he think people will say? He might even be coming across as preachy. Not everyone agrees with that. When I was a kid I had limited TV access, which I think is good, and I did not have video games either, but I think it’s kinda mean to not give your kids any of that. I like balance, and TV does not have to be a bad thing if it’s used reasonably. I mostly just watch my favorite NHL team’s games. That’s been a hobby of mine for years. I can’t imagine giving that up. And cable is sure cheaper than season tickets.
Luckily, my family is quite reasonable with money, and so are my friends, so I don’t really have to deal with that peer pressure to spend spend spend. When my ex bf and I lived together, he was more of a spender than I was, and I did feel pressured for us to spend more as a couple (and we did). I got myself into financial trouble pretty early, and it was mostly my own doing, but he definitely helped. Thankfully, I woke up and soon I will be debt-free and be able to start saving relatively early (I’m 24).
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Um, how do Rob’s co-workers know that he doesn’t have a TV or other electronic gadgets in his home? Probably because he told them. And therein lies the problem. I go out of my way to keep my personal life private. I make sure I get my co-workers talking about THEIR hobbies and THEIR lives. As a result, my co-workers know very little about me, but still think I’m a great conversationalist because I ask a lot of questions.
For stuff that’s not easily hidden (like the car you drive), just ignore them. They’re your co-workers, not your friends. You don’t owe anyone an explanation. When you’re secure in your choices, you won’t feel the need to justify them. Just live your own life and let them live theirs.
For the record, I like TV and I like reading.
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