Suze Orman Jumps Aboard the “Pay With Cash” Bandwagon
Published on - December 11th, 2009 (by Adam Baker) This article is by staff writer Adam Baker. Baker recently listed the Top 10 Money Movies of the Decade.
For years now, Dave Ramsey has recommended ditching credit cards and paying with cash. (Specifically, Ramsey advocates the use of an envelope budgeting system.) In fact, this anti-credit card stance is one of the biggest problems critics have with his philosophy; they often point out that “responsible” credit card use would yield a higher credit score.
But it looks like Dave Ramsey has some new company in the Cash Only camp. According to a recent MSN Smart Spending article, money guru Suze Orman is the latest proponent of paying for purchases with cash:
On her Saturday night show on CNBC, she asked viewers to join her in a Back to Cash movement. “Let’s go back to the good old days,” she said. “Let’s go back to the times when you literally paid cash for everything. That’s right. Cash. Stop using your credit cards altogether.”
Here’s Suze’s brief call-out on video courtesy of CNBC:
Why the change of heart for Orman?
Orman’s new movement is apparently in response to the increase of aggressive tactics by the credit-card industry.
As the deadline for the new credit-card legislation draws closer, credit-card companies are looking for ways to make up for the projected loss in revenue. This includes steps like drastically increasing the interest rate on even cardholders who’ve always paid on time, and continuing to close accounts of select consumers with low balances or periods of inactivity.
For example, my mother has had several cards close her account after only a couple months of inactivity, despite the fact she’s been a long-time member customer. Recently, I’ve also fielded calls from two close friends who’ve had rate increases without any default. (In one of these cases, my friend called for a decrease and they actually responded with an increase!)
Apparently, the changes have hit close to Orman, as well. I didn’t catch her announcement over the weekend, but the same MSN Smart Spending article points out that she used her own show director’s wife as an example. Citibank had recently sent her a letter raising her rate to 29.9%, despite the fact she’d never missed a payment.
Why we chose to live without credit cards
It’s been almost two years since Courtney and I made the decision to ditch our credit cards for purchases. Last December, we finally paid off and canceled the last one.
In order to make the decision, we employed the Ben Franklin method: We simply created a list of the advantages and disadvantages.
Our list of advantages for cash over credit:
- Increased attachment to spending
- Tangible budgeting
- Simplified financial accounts
- Avoid unexpected fees and changes of services
- Lower risk of identity theft
- Harder to slip back into cycle of debt
Our list of disadvantages for cash over credit:
- Less convenient than swiping
- More work to track
- More risk for physical loss
- Harder to build credit history
- Forgo reward programs
- Select employers & insurance providers use credit scores
There may be a couple that we left off, but these were the ones that we considered for our choice. Honestly, at the time, the avoid unexpected fees and changes of services didn’t carry much weight for us. Now, though, the volatility of the credit-card companies has turned it into a great side benefit.
In the end, we selected the increased consciousness in our budgeting and spending, combined with a simpler financial structure. It beat out the convenience and rewards associated with credit card use by a little bit.
The point isn’t to rehash the credit card vs. cash debate. We’ve been there, done that. Each person’s situation is different, and there are responsible users on both sides. Or as J.D. would say, do what works for you.
However, I’m interested to hear if, like Orman, recent events have changed your perspective. Have the recent strategies of the credit-card companies changed your feelings toward using credit or cash for your purchases?
This article is about Choices, Credit Cards, Gurus, News
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People who use cash because they spend more using credit cards are not addressing the real problem. It’s like an alcoholic thinking they’re cured because the liquor is poured down the drain.
Stick to a budget and shop with a list. Once you can spend responsibly without using your medium of payment as a crutch, you will be truly financially savvy.
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Changed my feelings toward using credit or cash? No. I pay credit card bills in full as they come due, and so never pay any finance charges.
What would cause me to stop using cards would be an annual fee or a per-transaction charge. As long as I can use the card for free, I will use it. When that changes, I’ll start using cash or a debit card.
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We got rid of our CCs about 12 years ago. CC companies were doing shady things then. So, now we have 2 checking accounts, offices local so I can walk in anytime I need to. We use 1 for our personal finances and the second one is for use like a CC and that debit card is what we use for purchases on line or when we travel. We deposit what we need before we use the debit card. Thus, the bulk of our money is not accessible should we lose the card and someone figure out what the pin number is. I check the account daily to ensure that there are only charges that we have made and I also have a real time view of how much is in the account. So far, a Hilton hotel in Bellevue is the only business that would not accept a debit card.
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We have moved to “cash” only (includes debit cards and checks, where appropriate)
No credit cards.
All utilities, mortgage, savings, 401k, insurance, etc. are automatically deducted from account so really carrying cash around is not an issue. Debit card at the grocery store, gas station; debit card or check for any other purchases, like clothing or gifts.
I’ve set up a weekly allowance of mad money, $75 per person for misc.
That’s it. Spending has dropped significantly.
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I read through about 2/3 of the comments here regarding cash vs credit then I read the “MSN Smart Spending” article linked to in the original post, so if someone already made this similar point that I’m about to make, forgive me. It sounds to me that Suze is attempting to do more than simply suggest we go to cash-only. It sounds to me like she would like to teach the credit companies a lesson.
Let me put it another way, since I’m just some random commenter on a blog I could make a silly suggestion like, “Anyone whose interest rates are raised should simply refuse to pay their remaining balance until said card company returns the rate to its previous level.” Now I can say that but Suze Orman can’t say that because she has a great deal more to lose than me. But honestly, when I read between the lines, it does sound to me that she wants to make the credit card companies suffer for what they are doing to their customers.
My thinking is that if enough of us simply refused to pay a CC company that jacked up our rates for no reason, well, with enough of us refusing to pay, they might just go bankrupt. THEN they’ll know whose boss!
Yeah, I know: wishful thinking…..
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@Iain (#56), I would suggest that you (and anyone else tired of getting ripped off by your bank’s egregious fees) think about switching to a credit union (CU). You can check out credit unions in your area by going to http://www.BankRate.com. On BankRate’s home page you should see their “Quick links” in the upper right-hand corner, choose “Bank ratings.” On that page choose the option for Credit Unions (as opposed to Banks/Thrifts), and just below that option you’ll see the sentence with a link like this, “If you seek banking headquarters, click here for the advanced search.” Click on the link at “click here” to choose your state, and possibly your city too. But note that choosing your city may be a bit too restrictive since that refers only to the “headquarters” which may be in a different “city” from where you live (this is especially relevant in a large metropolitan area).
Alternatively, if you know of several credit unions around you then you can enter part of the name to search those CUs and then check them out.
Although this information may seem a bit daunting for the less financially informed, it can at least give you a starting point to begin thinking about moving away from a bank (who answers to shareholders) and towards a credit union (which is owned by the members who deposit their money there; and which has NO shareholders to siphon off profits, the profits go back to the members of the CU in the form of higher interest savings or lower rates on loans). But basically, you may want to consider a CU with high asset size and maybe 3 or more stars. And if you are, or someone you know is, financially savvy then check out the financial statement too.
Support your local Credit Union!
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Come on people. CC don’t just earn money from the interest they charge on their cards. They also earn a lot of money from the fees they charge Merchants to take your cards. Do you really think your rewards are free? If we all just use cash for even just one week, it’ll hurt the CC in their pockets. Lets send the CC a message to stop their bullying practice.
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I think it’s just because she like to brag about how much money she has.
John DeFlumeri Jr
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Stop using the credit cards and tank the credit card companies. It’s usury.
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I’m currently on the “use rewards cards” responsibly bandwagon. Sure, in the long run they may get you. Like the casinos. But I do like the idea of getting “free money” or cash-back.
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Cash is King. Besides possibly being branded a Drug-dealer, lots of social pluses.
I used to keep 3-4000 dollars rolled up with me.
Better service, better deals. Piece of mind.
It makes spending way more fun, but I found it curbs spending in acting as a deterrent to breaking into the “roll”.
When we go out as a group everyone puts into the pot and one person is the “Wallet” or accountant. We assign protection detail to them. They take responsibility for all financial transactions. Drinks/Transportation/cover etc.
Big show, lots of fun. Everyone get their turn to be the high roller.
Service industry responds well.
Keeps everyone on budget.
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Tracy
We do the checking account only used for internet purchases method as well. We have a debit card with MC/Visa logo linked to that so we can shop online easily, but again it isn’t linked to anything else and has a relatively low amount of money in it. So easy, so convenient, and pretty darn safe.
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I’ve got a student loan disbursement that I’m planning to put towards my credit card balance … I was planning on saving it for a potential overseas internship this summer, but I’m not dealing with all the credit card companies’ bullshizz anymore. I think I’d rather stay with the low interest rate student loan…..
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Some things work better for some people than others, and I’d say that for the majority it’s easier to overspend using a card (credit or debit) than using cash. On the other hand, paying with bills and coins all the time – let alone tracking one’s spending with cash – gets annoying for many including myself.
I find that staying away from credit cards but also staying away from cash works best for me. I view my debit card as the middle-ground, sweet-spot option. I get cash-back on my purchases, simply swipe to pay, and have a much less bulky wallet. I also record each transaction as soon after it happens as possible; I get a receipt and make sure I update my check register before I lose or trash that receipt. This way I always have a running balance of what’s in my account – usually more up-to-date than the bank’s record. I also budget how to allocate the funds of each paycheck of mine often several weeks in advance, pay bills and other fixed expenses as soon as I get paid, and use what’s leftover for variable expenses (e.g. food, entertainment) carefully. For me, this approach best avoids the potential pitfalls of credit while reaping most of the benefits (the foremost being convenience).
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Right, pay with cash and carry it around.
Come work in Newark, NJ and try that system. You can’t even pay for gasoline with cash near where I work.
I prefer checks or debit card.
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It’s about time! We’ve always thought that, as entertaining as Suze is, she came across pretty weak on the issue of cash vs. credit cards. There may be rewards for using credit cards, but all the power is in CASH. Thanks for this post!
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Citibank will raise rate to 18% at end of year after having card for 15 years. I will stop using card since other bank cards did not raise. The changes that were outlined in the Credit Card Accountability and Responsibility Act, will make it much more difficult on credit card companies to earn the egregious fees that they were before. The new law is why even people without late payments are being jacked. Basically, the industry cannot earn super profits from those that are late or carry a balance or overdraft so they have to earn more on the “deadbeats” those that pay on time and in full every month.
With regard to cash, it makes a ton of sense. I have done this in year’s past where you go to the bank on Sunday, take out a certain amount of money, and then use that to buy everything. I found that I spent much less and focused far more on the price of everything that was bought. Only problem is that it doesn’t work well if you are traveling or buying stuff online. But in general, it becomes an extremely important budgeting tool that forces you into a budget without having to worry about a spreadsheet.
My sense is that credit cards have seen their hey day and they will retreat in terms of popularity vs. cash. That’s why Chase and B of A are creating gimmicks for you to use your debit card. In a true cash world, banks make next to nothing.
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This is just silly. Is Dave and Suze riding to work on horseback? Do they recommend reading by candlelight?
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@JenK, comment 95, freaking about theft while carrying cash…
I worry more about the damage that someone could do to my life with the other contents of my purse. Even if I was mugged and had to hand over several hundred dollars, the damage and further danger is limited. With my ID and keys, a thief could wreak absolute havoc on my life, and I carry them everywhere I go.
@JJ, comment 164, tracking cash purchases…
I don’t track the small stuff. On errand day, I pull out several hundred dollars, and I spend it on whatever is necessary. Usually, there’s a hundred or so left, which I use to pay for eating out, etc. I don’t see any need to track cash spending compulsively if the total amount is budgeted. I pay other expenses via personal check and bills via on-line transfer.
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One advantage credit cards have over cash for some transactions- you can dispute the charge. In the past 10 years I’ve had to dispute 2-3 charges and doing it via the credit card company is easier especially when the merchant is unresponsive. Definitely can’t do that with cash.
Realistically, you need at least 1 to 2 credit cards for reserving hotels, airline tickets and other online merchants like buying tickets online….
Just pay off the bill in full each month and you are good to go.
If any credit card issuer starts charging annual fees I will tell them to waive it or I cancel the card. They can’t waive it, I’m outta there.
-Mike
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I’m another who spends more when I have cash in hand. Reading the comments, I think I learned that I have a bunch of personal rules for when it’s appropriate to use plastic (even the debit card, which is mostly what I do use) – I would never use a card for anything less than $5, or for junk/fast food, etc. I think that’s where all my “extra” cash goes, when I carry it.
And I wonder, what do the cash-only folks do if they run out of gas or bus money, and need to get to work? If you have kids at home and you run out of grocery money? I don’t know if I could start from scratch now with a cash budget.
I did cash-only for about 5 years, but I was single and carfree for most of it – if I ran out of money, I walked & ate out of the dumpster, but I wasn’t responsible for a car, a house, or a kid (i had pets – a few times the cats got fed & i didn’t, before the paycheck ran out.) Do people really use the hard cash limit, or are there exceptions for kid stuff, gas/bus costs, emergency repairs, medical costs…?
Also – I think it’s criminal how companies have pushed the responsibility for travel costs onto the employees & their personal credit. Not that long ago, companies had company credit cards for travelers, or an admin or travel office that made all the major reservations & payments. It’s wrong to make someone carry a $1000 credit card charge for however long the reimbursement cycle is.
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You cannot travel without a CC: cannot book a hotel, rental car, or airline ticket. Maybe the rest of you never need to travel, but my elderly parents live on the opposite coast, so I do. Rental car companies and hotels do not accept debit cards (tried that already).
You can find CC companies that treat you right if you shop around.
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@BB – That’s a bold statement. Especially considering I’ve been traveling for the last 8 months overseas without a credit card. This has included specifically buying nearly every type of hotel, 2 rental cars, and many airline tickets on debit (and with cash at times).
Whether or not to use cash/credit is still up for debate. But your statement is 100% false.
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Yes. I were a victim of the credit card trap. When I had opened my first checking account, there’s was a Visa card with it. I had not used it until I had moved to my first rented appartment, I needed to buy things, I thought that if I buy all with cash, maybe I couldn’t travel home next weekend, so I use my credit card, and then my problem begins. I requested a loan for consolidated debt, but used my credit card again, so I requested a new loan, and my debt increased. Now I still my credit cards, but they aren’t in my wallet. They are keep in a very unreachable place.
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Rosa
To answer what we do when we run out of cash, we stop spending. We don’t tell ourselves that we can keep spending after we use up our budgeted amount of money. It would defeat the purpose of having a budget.
As for worrying about gas/bus/commuting costs…well, we purchase our commuter pass at the beginning of the month so we would never run out of “commuting” money. It is good for the month, and it is treated like any other bill – paid for BEFORE we spend our money on wants. We use our car very rarely (we made the choice to live close to train/bus lines) and so we budget a fairly low amt for gasoline. I have never run out of gasoline money. If I thought I would be running low – I would stop unnecessary driving.
And as for food – I budget a cash amt. of money to be used every week for food. That includes groceries AND eating out. But I can buy a ton more groceries using coupons smartly. This past weekend I bought $200 worth of groceries for just under $60. That includes a ton of staples, as well as fresh fruit and vegetables. It would be almost impossible for my children or I to go hungry for a long time. Eating out is a luxury…and one that we indulge in maybe once a week, and only if there is money left in our food budget.
Now, the biggest reason to do this is so I can save the money I want to every month so that I can do the things I want to do long term (and short term). Does it take more planning? Yes, at the beginning it probably does. But I hear a lot of people saying that they have all these rules when using a debit or credit card. Why not just use those rules with your cash and decide that when the cash is gone, you are done spending?
If you have a REAL emergency, if you use a cash budget, you should also have a “cash” reserve in savings that you can use instead of putting anything on credit. That is the point of a cash budget for me, it helps me have freedom by having more money. More of my own money, not debt that has to be paid back (whether I have the ability of not).
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Not sure where the misconception that one can’t travel with a debit card comes from. I just went on a cruise (which involved a rental car and hotel) on my debit card. All my online purchases are made with the card as well.
It’s just like a credit card without the debt, people! And Visa and MC provide the same fraud protection as with CCs.
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It may seem painfully obvious, but don’t tell your debit card PIN number to other people (even family!) or worse, write it on the card itself…
Yes, it does happen… and Visa won’t reimburse fraud on a debit card if they consider your PIN to have been compromised by your own error. They called it “family/friendly fraud”…so sad, too bad. You’re out the money.
I’ve seen people pay some big stupid tax on this issue!
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I’m not playing the devil’s advocate here.
But with a little bit of discipline, CC can, and -is- a very powerful tool. Here’s my situation:
* I’ve got a mortgage
* It’s also an everyday account that offsets the loan interests
Thus, the more (and the longer) I keep my cash inside that account, the more I offset my interest. See where I’m going ?
The idea is to keep as much cash in that offset account as long as possible. And CC helps that — sure, at the end of the day I still have to pay the CC out but at least the cash has offset it (remember that most interest in most banks are calculated daily).
some points:
* pay everything, including your bills using CC. if there’s a due date, pay it very close to the due date to get the maximum time of your cash in the mortgage account.
* maintain only 1 cc – cause that’s all you’ll ever need.
* pay the CC on time so you don’t get interest charged
* get an annual-fee-free CC
With CC, you also have the small benefit of not having to pay for the tax incured on the (savings) interest.
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Lev, if you’re making enough interest on your checking account to offset your mortgage interest, I want to know where you bank!
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This is an Australian bank btw.
Oh – to elaborate slightly: it’s not 100% offset, at the end of the day — the bank’ll still charge interest.
But hey: it’s better than no offset at all~
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One thing few people seem to have caught – one main reason she is now advocating ditching the credit cards is to rob the credit card companies of the 1-3% transaction fee they collect every time you use one! Those companies still make a lot of money off of you even if you NEVER carry a balance.
Her argument is that we can still hit them where it hurts by using cash – and an added bonus might be that retailers can lower costs if more people pay in cash (since they are the ones paying that transaction fee.
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As a responsible credit card user who pays off her balance every month, I support this movement. Why? Because it’s time consumers started voting with their dollars again. If you don’t like the business practice of corporations, then stop doing business with them.
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Cash is king and all arguments against it fall apart. Credit score?, who cares if you pay cash? I haven’t looked at my credit score in more than 5 years and don’t care. I pay for everything cash (or debit) including cars. As for the security issue, a thief can only take what you have on you at the time, with a credit card they can take so much more and it could take you months or years to recover. I never worry about bill collectors or have the after Xmas or vacation credit hang over. Dave Ramsey has been consistent with his message, save for it and pay cash, if you can’t you don’t need it. I have always thought Suze Orman gave bad advise now it looks like she thinks so too.
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@TeresaA (# 92) “No matter what the advantages or disadvantages of cash versus credit cards, or vice versa, these companies do not deserve our business.”
Do you go to a bank? Do you keep money on savings account, CDs? Does your bank issues credit cards? How come you are giving business to the bank that issues credit cards? Do you realize that the money you put in your deposit is in fact a loan you give to your bank so it can lend this money to others including with issuing credit cards? So how come you say “these companies don’t deserve our business” yet continue to deal with banks?
I am always amazed how people say “these companies don’t deserve our business” without understanding that the companies they are talking about are the banks they continue to deal with.
Or did you mean Visa and Master Card? But these companies don’t make money on lending AT ALL. They don’t set interest rates or fees (except for interchange fees that merchant pays for both debit and credit cards – Visa and MC set the amount, but the money are split between issuing bank and merchant’s bank), in fact, they couldn’t care less if you pay in full or default or even if you use debit card. Visa and Master card make money on franchise fees banks pay them for using their brand and on volume of transactions from the merchant — around $0.05 on each transaction regardless if it is made with credit or debit card.
In terms of raised interest rates, I don’t understand people who seem to look at them as some kind of punishment, like low interest rates is their right. Newsflash: lending is banks’ business; interest rates is the price they charge for their product. A business has a right to raise its prices for whatever reason, especially when the cost of the business is higher. In case of credit cards – the cost of business is higher both because of new regulations and because of mounting defaults. You don’t want to pay the price – fine, this is fair. You can walk and not use the cards or you can pay in full – whichever way is better.
Personally, yes I got higher rate letters to. So? I don’t intend to pay these rates, never have, never will. So I am continuing using my cards. If they remove grace period, I’ll reconsider.
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@Kitty & TeresaA: Of course if you “bank” with a Credit Union then a debit card is just fine. It’s the Banks who charge exorbitant fees and generally try to make as much money off their depositors as possible since they are for-profit corporations. Credit Unions are not-for-profit organizations whose purpose is to maximize the return on deposits of the members of the CU. In fact, most (all?) CU domains end with “.org” not “.com” like a normal bank.
Full disclosure: I am a member of a credit union (see my post #156 for info at http://www.BankRate.com for beginning your research on credit unions.)
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@Cal#30-I use an iPhone app called “Spend” that is a very simple virtual envelope system. It’s there all the time, just as if I had actual envelopes in my purse, but much less messy (I used to do the physical envelope system and it’s not very practical and I needed a bigger purse.)
@Kevin#61-Losing your job shouldn’t be a problem if you were only spending on credit money that’s already in your bank account and in your budget. If you would’ve used debit for the expenses, the money would’ve been debited from your bank account anyway, so what’s the difference?
So far, I haven’t experienced the credit-limit cutting. I did experience a slight rate increase on one of my cards that I thought had a fixed rate. For years, it was at 7.99%, but earlier this year, they switched it to 11.24%. When I asked about this, they said the rate is “fixed” at whatever rate they give me, but not tied to a variable index. Weird. I don’t really understand their rules. I’m currently doing a debt snowball on that card and according to my spreadsheet, at the rate I’m paying it off, it wouldn’t really make much difference even if I did a balance transfer to a 0% card.
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My credit card was paid off every month. The interest rate really didn’t matter to me. The CC company closed my account and stated that they were closing the program that had been offered and that they were merging with another CC company. In truth, they were flushing accounts that did not make them money. Sadly, to stay in a Hotel, purchase Airfare over the internet, etc. you are required to provide a credit card number. As much as I would like to be paying in cash only, our financial system requires you to have a credit card, and the Credit Card companies are adopting a use it or lose it attitude. Sigh……..
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I’ve had it with Citibank. I have a FICO score over 800 and have had the account for over 20 years and pay in full every month. I just got a letter saying they’re going to start charging me an annual fee of $60.00 unless I put $2,400 a year on their card. I’m done. Canceling.
I have a Bank of America card I use for online purchases. I haven’t heard anything from them about an annual fee, but if they start charging too I’ll drop that one as well. I’m sure I can get a card through my credit union with no annual fee if need be so I can still shop online.
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