Comments on: How to Maximize Your Salary http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/ Common sense advice on money saving tips, how to get out of debt, high interest savings accounts, cd rates, money market accounts, mortgage rates, money management and more. Sat, 18 May 2013 17:14:36 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: ami http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-861052 ami Sat, 16 Oct 2010 17:34:29 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-861052 Negotiation is scary and can be tricky. What helps is having information: 1) information (and confidence) about your own qualifications - esp. in comparison to the market, and in comparison to what the company already has on its staff. 2) information about the company's needs. You can get this during the interview process, from network friends within the company or at other companies who may know something about the company where you're interviewing. Use this info (and your knowledge of your own skills) to show how you'll add *extra* value to the company (more than the typical candidate). 3) info about the market and industry. Just because the economy is tight doesn't necessarily mean that the industry is tight. Industry developments might mean there's a broad demand for people in your position. Make sure you're aware of these trends because they mean you have more power in negotiations than you might otherwise think. Also - have a strong sense of what the salary range for the position is at competitor companies. Finally - be creative and flexible. Sometimes you can expand the position to make it more than it was (thereby justifying a higher salary). Sometimes even if you can't get a larger salary, you can get a signing bonus. Sometimes you can get at least a promise to review overall comp within a shorter timeframe than usual. And negotiate with a smile. Sometimes the friendly approach helps :) Negotiation is scary and can be tricky. What helps is having information:

1) information (and confidence) about your own qualifications – esp. in comparison to the market, and in comparison to what the company already has on its staff.

2) information about the company’s needs. You can get this during the interview process, from network friends within the company or at other companies who may know something about the company where you’re interviewing. Use this info (and your knowledge of your own skills) to show how you’ll add *extra* value to the company (more than the typical candidate).

3) info about the market and industry. Just because the economy is tight doesn’t necessarily mean that the industry is tight. Industry developments might mean there’s a broad demand for people in your position. Make sure you’re aware of these trends because they mean you have more power in negotiations than you might otherwise think. Also – have a strong sense of what the salary range for the position is at competitor companies.

Finally – be creative and flexible. Sometimes you can expand the position to make it more than it was (thereby justifying a higher salary). Sometimes even if you can’t get a larger salary, you can get a signing bonus. Sometimes you can get at least a promise to review overall comp within a shorter timeframe than usual. And negotiate with a smile. Sometimes the friendly approach helps :)

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]]> By: chacha1 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-859612 chacha1 Fri, 15 Oct 2010 22:34:52 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-859612 When my husband decided to go freelance, he asked a few other professionals in the field he planned to enter what their rates were. Then he looked at what they could offer versus what he could offer, and set his rates slightly *higher* than the average. Unique skill sets make a huge difference; if you're doing something that many, many other people can do equally well, you're not going to have the negotiating power you want. As Gal says at #41, you have to be MORE than just a good employee or good contractor in order to get the raise or the contract. Because there's GOOD people everywhere. When my husband decided to go freelance, he asked a few other professionals in the field he planned to enter what their rates were. Then he looked at what they could offer versus what he could offer, and set his rates slightly *higher* than the average.

Unique skill sets make a huge difference; if you’re doing something that many, many other people can do equally well, you’re not going to have the negotiating power you want.

As Gal says at #41, you have to be MORE than just a good employee or good contractor in order to get the raise or the contract. Because there’s GOOD people everywhere.

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]]> By: Gal @ Equally Happy http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-853802 Gal @ Equally Happy Thu, 14 Oct 2010 01:39:49 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-853802 @BD So what if you encounter that response? No one is going to fire you unless you make your request in a rude manner or seem completely unrealistic. Usually, they'll just say no. I just hired a tech writer, which is a very over saturated field, and I would not have been offended if she asked for a higher salary. We would have negotiated and come up with something acceptable to both of us. It's basically like approaching someone at a bar. If you try, you might fail, but at least you also have a chance of succeeding. If you scare yourself out of even trying, your chances of succeeding are zero. @BD
So what if you encounter that response? No one is going to fire you unless you make your request in a rude manner or seem completely unrealistic. Usually, they’ll just say no. I just hired a tech writer, which is a very over saturated field, and I would not have been offended if she asked for a higher salary. We would have negotiated and come up with something acceptable to both of us.

It’s basically like approaching someone at a bar. If you try, you might fail, but at least you also have a chance of succeeding. If you scare yourself out of even trying, your chances of succeeding are zero.

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]]> By: BD http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-853772 BD Thu, 14 Oct 2010 01:30:36 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-853772 I'm with Stacy. I think wage negotiation is not a universal rule. I've always worked in a highly over-saturated market (graphic design) where at any given time, there are thousands of designers out of work. Asking for a higher wage will just be met with a "No. I can hire someone much cheaper than you right now, who is just as experienced and talented, with no effort". Wage negotiation only works in job situations that aren't so highly saturated. I’m with Stacy. I think wage negotiation is not a universal rule. I’ve always worked in a highly over-saturated market (graphic design) where at any given time, there are thousands of designers out of work. Asking for a higher wage will just be met with a “No. I can hire someone much cheaper than you right now, who is just as experienced and talented, with no effort”.

Wage negotiation only works in job situations that aren’t so highly saturated.

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]]> By: Erica http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-853382 Erica Thu, 14 Oct 2010 00:08:19 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-853382 I was told "whoever says a number first loses", so I didn't mention compensation at all when I signed on as a freelancer for my first (and current) job. My boss just said to send an invoice saying how many hours I worked and I'd get paid. Eventually I had to ask, and she told me the lowest hourly rate for my field. I have since raised my rate (without any problem), but it would have been nice to have some advice on what to do as a freelancer, when nobody brings up rates. Incidentally, I was also applying for a salaried position at the time, and was offered the position without a number. I was told “whoever says a number first loses”, so I didn’t mention compensation at all when I signed on as a freelancer for my first (and current) job. My boss just said to send an invoice saying how many hours I worked and I’d get paid. Eventually I had to ask, and she told me the lowest hourly rate for my field. I have since raised my rate (without any problem), but it would have been nice to have some advice on what to do as a freelancer, when nobody brings up rates.

Incidentally, I was also applying for a salaried position at the time, and was offered the position without a number.

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]]> By: Heather http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-852392 Heather Wed, 13 Oct 2010 18:08:03 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-852392 These things are completely foreign (but fascinating) to me. I've never had a job with a negotiable salary ... or negotiable anything, for that matter. These things are completely foreign (but fascinating) to me. I’ve never had a job with a negotiable salary … or negotiable anything, for that matter.

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]]> By: Tim @ Faith and Finance http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-852032 Tim @ Faith and Finance Wed, 13 Oct 2010 16:47:52 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-852032 Great article Kimberly! I love how you included the 'silent treatment' when talking about negotiations. This is a great technique for almost any negotiation (work/buying a car/ home/ insurance/ etc). It doesn't always work, but it's always nice if the other party makes another concession if you are silent. @Jenn, nice follow-up. I'd be interested to see your points laid out in a blog format. Let me know if you ever want to write a guest article for us. Tim Great article Kimberly!

I love how you included the ‘silent treatment’ when talking about negotiations. This is a great technique for almost any negotiation (work/buying a car/ home/ insurance/ etc). It doesn’t always work, but it’s always nice if the other party makes another concession if you are silent.

@Jenn, nice follow-up. I’d be interested to see your points laid out in a blog format. Let me know if you ever want to write a guest article for us.

Tim

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]]> By: Gal @ Equally Happy http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-852002 Gal @ Equally Happy Wed, 13 Oct 2010 16:42:15 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-852002 I would mention that it's also up to you to make yourself worthy of a raise. I've seen employees who think they deserve a raise simply for doing a good job. Sorry, I hired you to do a good job and we agreed on a salary with the assumption that you'll do a good job. If you want a raise, do something more than a good job, find a way to provide your employer with more value. Otherwise, why should they give you more money? I would mention that it’s also up to you to make yourself worthy of a raise. I’ve seen employees who think they deserve a raise simply for doing a good job. Sorry, I hired you to do a good job and we agreed on a salary with the assumption that you’ll do a good job. If you want a raise, do something more than a good job, find a way to provide your employer with more value. Otherwise, why should they give you more money?

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]]> By: Jenn http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-851282 Jenn Wed, 13 Oct 2010 13:42:25 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-851282 I teach this topic to business school students, and I just wanted to add a few points that I talk about in class. (it ended up longer than a blog post and not as amusing, but hopefully helpful to someone somewhere). A survey of HR managers found that about 80% would be willing to negotiate job offers, but that only about 33% of applicants are comfortable negotiating. That’s a lot of lost opportunity. I think if you prepare well and take a positive attitude, you should be comfortable at least asking if the offer is negotiable. Some company/manager norms are not to negotiate, but might as well prepare in case they are in the 80% that will. Your ability to negotiate an offer largely depends on your leverage. The only time you have any leverage is after they have given you an offer, but before you have accepted it. This may seem obvious, but some managers will try to get into salary discussions before a job offer is made. Quint Careers website has a lot of good scripts on how to deflect these conversations in a polite manner. Once you have accepted the job, there’s no incentive for them to negotiate. After you have been at a company for months and have demonstrated your value, you may have leverage again (assuming they want you to be happy and stay). Leverage can be positive (what value you bring to the company/manager) or normative (what the market norms/standards are for your position). For positive leverage, try to get a sense of how much they want YOU versus wanting any warm body that fits the job description. Have you developed a relationship with the hiring manager? Have they expressed specific interest in any of your unique talents and qualifications? If you are at a company that struggles with recruiting talent of your type, you may be more desirable than if you are at a place where they get 100 applications per opening. Try to think about your useful skills or experience that may not have been valued in the offer – do you speak a second language or have technical skills that aren’t part of the job description, but that would still be very useful in the job? You should be able to think of good interview questions to understand what skills you have that would be valuable to your boss and the company. If it is a large company, have you had a level of education/experience/responsibility that could justify you starting at a higher grade at the company than the job posted for? Some companies will post grade levels with their job postings, so that you can see what a C-5 level of experience and responsibilities would be and whether you can justify fitting that grade. If they don’t post them, once you have an offer you may try to get in touch with some company peers at and above your grade. You might ask for contacts directly or use LinkedIn, if you are active on that site. Negotiating your grade is something that may be easier once you are inside the organization and know the system better. Some are very rigid, but some are flexible to allow for promotions in grade without a title change. In terms of normative leverage, there are a lot of possible ‘standards’ you could use and you want to use ones that are justifiable, but also to your advantage. Glassdoor is helpful for company specific salaries, so you can know if you are being too unrealistic in your goals. The internet has plenty of salary sites you can search for industry/occupation. If you are just graduating, look at whether your Career Services office has a salary database for new graduates. Some databases break it down by major, region, industry, etc. If they do, you should break it down in a way that is honest, but also advantageous. For example, if your job offer is in the Southeast, but salaries are lower there, you can use the average salary for your major and industry without breaking it into region. If your offer is in the Northeast and salaries are higher there, then you want to break it down by region because the ‘standard’ will be higher. You should not use average Northeast salaries for a Southeast job – that’s not justifiable. Alternative offers are your best normative leverage because it shows how the market values you specifically. It is a good idea to get them, but it is NOT a good idea to negotiate with multiple companies at the same time. You should be negotiating with one company in good faith, where if they are able to meet your requests, you will accept the offer. If a better offer from Company B comes in while negotiating with Company A, you can use that to try to get a higher salary from Company A if that’s your preferred job. If Company B is so attractive there’s no way Company A can compete, you should end negotiations with Company A and move to discussions with Company B. For salary, I think the best overall framing is that “I want to be fairly compensated” as opposed to “I want as much money as I can get”. However, if there are reasons you want more money that may be met in ways other than salary, you might look into creative solutions. For example, if you want a higher salary because of your crushing student loan debt, check whether there’s an opportunity to trade-off salary for loan forgiveness, or to get a signing bonus that you can use to pay down some of that debt. Or if housing is your main issue, look at whether they have relocation assistance benefits and if those are negotiable. Often times, a one-off issue is easier for the company to agree to because they don’t have to deal with issues of salary equity and higher ongoing expenses. If you don’t plan to be there for life, these may be just as valuable to you anyway. As others have mentioned, there may be additional issues that are negotiable as well. Many of these are easier to justify to a manager as “good for the company” and not just good for you. For example, if you want funds for a home office set-up or telecommuting opportunities, you may be able to justify it as more productive time working vs. commuting. Generally, I would advise you to pick 2-3 high priority issues to negotiate. No one wants to hammer out 25 issues with you and you will be seen as ‘high maintenance’. As mentioned before, you should negotiate in good faith. At all times, you should be enthusiastic about the opportunity, positive in tone/attitude, cooperative with the other side, and exceedingly ethical and professional. Do not lie about having other offers if you don’t – though if you are pursuing them, you can say that if they ask. Many companies will want a copy of a competing offer if they are matching it, so do not lie about that either. Know the point at which you will “walk away” from the negotiation, and when you walk away, make sure you do so in a positive and professional way. If you are willing to take the initial offer and fail to get more than that, you may want to say you want to think it over for a day and call back the next day to accept – enthusiastically. I think negotiations are a great opportunity to show that you can be an assertive and professional problem-solver. They may not always yield everything you hope for, but it is rare that you will shoot yourself in the foot if you act professionally and cooperatively (there are exceptions, but I think that reflects poorly on the other person more than you). You can always start by saying you are really excited about the opportunity, but after reading through the offer, want to know if there is any room for negotiation on XYZ. Be prepared to negotiate at that point, but if they say there is no room, be prepared for how you want to handle that as well. Jenn I teach this topic to business school students, and I just wanted to add a few points that I talk about in class. (it ended up longer than a blog post and not as amusing, but hopefully helpful to someone somewhere). A survey of HR managers found that about 80% would be willing to negotiate job offers, but that only about 33% of applicants are comfortable negotiating. That’s a lot of lost opportunity. I think if you prepare well and take a positive attitude, you should be comfortable at least asking if the offer is negotiable. Some company/manager norms are not to negotiate, but might as well prepare in case they are in the 80% that will.
Your ability to negotiate an offer largely depends on your leverage. The only time you have any leverage is after they have given you an offer, but before you have accepted it. This may seem obvious, but some managers will try to get into salary discussions before a job offer is made. Quint Careers website has a lot of good scripts on how to deflect these conversations in a polite manner. Once you have accepted the job, there’s no incentive for them to negotiate. After you have been at a company for months and have demonstrated your value, you may have leverage again (assuming they want you to be happy and stay).
Leverage can be positive (what value you bring to the company/manager) or normative (what the market norms/standards are for your position). For positive leverage, try to get a sense of how much they want YOU versus wanting any warm body that fits the job description. Have you developed a relationship with the hiring manager? Have they expressed specific interest in any of your unique talents and qualifications? If you are at a company that struggles with recruiting talent of your type, you may be more desirable than if you are at a place where they get 100 applications per opening.
Try to think about your useful skills or experience that may not have been valued in the offer – do you speak a second language or have technical skills that aren’t part of the job description, but that would still be very useful in the job? You should be able to think of good interview questions to understand what skills you have that would be valuable to your boss and the company.
If it is a large company, have you had a level of education/experience/responsibility that could justify you starting at a higher grade at the company than the job posted for? Some companies will post grade levels with their job postings, so that you can see what a C-5 level of experience and responsibilities would be and whether you can justify fitting that grade. If they don’t post them, once you have an offer you may try to get in touch with some company peers at and above your grade. You might ask for contacts directly or use LinkedIn, if you are active on that site. Negotiating your grade is something that may be easier once you are inside the organization and know the system better. Some are very rigid, but some are flexible to allow for promotions in grade without a title change.
In terms of normative leverage, there are a lot of possible ‘standards’ you could use and you want to use ones that are justifiable, but also to your advantage. Glassdoor is helpful for company specific salaries, so you can know if you are being too unrealistic in your goals. The internet has plenty of salary sites you can search for industry/occupation. If you are just graduating, look at whether your Career Services office has a salary database for new graduates. Some databases break it down by major, region, industry, etc. If they do, you should break it down in a way that is honest, but also advantageous. For example, if your job offer is in the Southeast, but salaries are lower there, you can use the average salary for your major and industry without breaking it into region. If your offer is in the Northeast and salaries are higher there, then you want to break it down by region because the ‘standard’ will be higher. You should not use average Northeast salaries for a Southeast job – that’s not justifiable.
Alternative offers are your best normative leverage because it shows how the market values you specifically. It is a good idea to get them, but it is NOT a good idea to negotiate with multiple companies at the same time. You should be negotiating with one company in good faith, where if they are able to meet your requests, you will accept the offer. If a better offer from Company B comes in while negotiating with Company A, you can use that to try to get a higher salary from Company A if that’s your preferred job. If Company B is so attractive there’s no way Company A can compete, you should end negotiations with Company A and move to discussions with Company B.
For salary, I think the best overall framing is that “I want to be fairly compensated” as opposed to “I want as much money as I can get”. However, if there are reasons you want more money that may be met in ways other than salary, you might look into creative solutions. For example, if you want a higher salary because of your crushing student loan debt, check whether there’s an opportunity to trade-off salary for loan forgiveness, or to get a signing bonus that you can use to pay down some of that debt. Or if housing is your main issue, look at whether they have relocation assistance benefits and if those are negotiable. Often times, a one-off issue is easier for the company to agree to because they don’t have to deal with issues of salary equity and higher ongoing expenses. If you don’t plan to be there for life, these may be just as valuable to you anyway.
As others have mentioned, there may be additional issues that are negotiable as well. Many of these are easier to justify to a manager as “good for the company” and not just good for you. For example, if you want funds for a home office set-up or telecommuting opportunities, you may be able to justify it as more productive time working vs. commuting.
Generally, I would advise you to pick 2-3 high priority issues to negotiate. No one wants to hammer out 25 issues with you and you will be seen as ‘high maintenance’. As mentioned before, you should negotiate in good faith. At all times, you should be enthusiastic about the opportunity, positive in tone/attitude, cooperative with the other side, and exceedingly ethical and professional. Do not lie about having other offers if you don’t – though if you are pursuing them, you can say that if they ask. Many companies will want a copy of a competing offer if they are matching it, so do not lie about that either. Know the point at which you will “walk away” from the negotiation, and when you walk away, make sure you do so in a positive and professional way. If you are willing to take the initial offer and fail to get more than that, you may want to say you want to think it over for a day and call back the next day to accept – enthusiastically.
I think negotiations are a great opportunity to show that you can be an assertive and professional problem-solver. They may not always yield everything you hope for, but it is rare that you will shoot yourself in the foot if you act professionally and cooperatively (there are exceptions, but I think that reflects poorly on the other person more than you). You can always start by saying you are really excited about the opportunity, but after reading through the offer, want to know if there is any room for negotiation on XYZ. Be prepared to negotiate at that point, but if they say there is no room, be prepared for how you want to handle that as well.

Jenn

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]]> By: Stacy http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-849442 Stacy Wed, 13 Oct 2010 03:19:09 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-849442 I'm in the "this is nice but not universal" department. I work in human services and we are under a company-wide wage freeze this year. They have also cut some of our other reimbursements. During years when we have gotten raises they are standardized (somewhere in the 1-3% range) and so far as I can tell there's no room for negotiation there. There is also a standard starting salary/wage. Oh, and I have a BA so this isn't a rock bottom job I'm working. I’m in the “this is nice but not universal” department. I work in human services and we are under a company-wide wage freeze this year. They have also cut some of our other reimbursements. During years when we have gotten raises they are standardized (somewhere in the 1-3% range) and so far as I can tell there’s no room for negotiation there. There is also a standard starting salary/wage. Oh, and I have a BA so this isn’t a rock bottom job I’m working.

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]]> By: Ash http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-849122 Ash Wed, 13 Oct 2010 01:58:40 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-849122 While I like this article, I'd really LOVE to see an example of a play-by-play negotiation. It's knowing how to phrase it that gets me. I know I should ask, I just choke sometimes. How do you get past that awkward, "that's a fair salary for this area, but I feel I'm worth more than the 'average' in the market and here's why"? How do you do that tactfully? While I like this article, I’d really LOVE to see an example of a play-by-play negotiation. It’s knowing how to phrase it that gets me. I know I should ask, I just choke sometimes. How do you get past that awkward, “that’s a fair salary for this area, but I feel I’m worth more than the ‘average’ in the market and here’s why”? How do you do that tactfully?

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]]> By: Tara http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-849102 Tara Wed, 13 Oct 2010 01:53:58 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-849102 What about when you're offered a raise? I was recently offered a generous raise (10%) at my performance review, and I smiled and said thank you. Should I have asked for more?? What about when you’re offered a raise? I was recently offered a generous raise (10%) at my performance review, and I smiled and said thank you. Should I have asked for more??

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]]> By: David/moneycrashers http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-848572 David/moneycrashers Tue, 12 Oct 2010 23:59:25 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-848572 But I think you also have to go into these types of discussions informed. Meaning, you can't just throw out a number and have nothing to back it up. You have to do research for comparable salary numbers for that position, and also be able to expalin WHY you are worth the extra money... But I think you also have to go into these types of discussions informed.

Meaning, you can’t just throw out a number and have nothing to back it up.

You have to do research for comparable salary numbers for that position, and also be able to expalin WHY you are worth the extra money…

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]]> By: Joe M http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-848372 Joe M Tue, 12 Oct 2010 22:19:33 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-848372 What happens when your employer is actively cutting your salary? Time to change jobs? What happens when your employer is actively cutting your salary? Time to change jobs?

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]]> By: Jennifer http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-848332 Jennifer Tue, 12 Oct 2010 21:53:09 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-848332 I wish I had known this when I started my first job after college. It was a government position with published pay scales but I didn't realize that I didn't have to start at the bottom. Thankfully I did work up the courage to ask for a raise a few years into my position. Even with union-negotiated contracts & set raises there's usually a way to get more money. It also helped that I worked with the budgets so I knew there was money there. I wish I had known this when I started my first job after college. It was a government position with published pay scales but I didn’t realize that I didn’t have to start at the bottom. Thankfully I did work up the courage to ask for a raise a few years into my position. Even with union-negotiated contracts & set raises there’s usually a way to get more money. It also helped that I worked with the budgets so I knew there was money there.

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]]> By: chacha1 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-848172 chacha1 Tue, 12 Oct 2010 21:15:21 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-848172 +1 to Stephen and The Other Brian re: benefits. If an employee is in a reasonable job and is due an increase which the company can't/won't offer, come back with a request on the benefits side. Flex time, four-day weeks (getting easier to arrange as more jobs become telecommute-friendly), extra days off, even a workspace upgrade (e.g. if you would be working in a cubicle, negotiate for a high-quality desk chair. It makes a difference over time). And as Jackie says, if you already have an offer, they aren't likely to be disgusted by you asking for a better one. All they can do is say No. The only time I've ever heard of an offer being withdrawn was when a background check turned up some red flags. +1 to Stephen and The Other Brian re: benefits. If an employee is in a reasonable job and is due an increase which the company can’t/won’t offer, come back with a request on the benefits side.

Flex time, four-day weeks (getting easier to arrange as more jobs become telecommute-friendly), extra days off, even a workspace upgrade (e.g. if you would be working in a cubicle, negotiate for a high-quality desk chair. It makes a difference over time).

And as Jackie says, if you already have an offer, they aren’t likely to be disgusted by you asking for a better one. All they can do is say No. The only time I’ve ever heard of an offer being withdrawn was when a background check turned up some red flags.

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]]> By: Michael http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-848122 Michael Tue, 12 Oct 2010 21:07:03 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-848122 Salary isn't the only thing to negotiate. I joined a startup this year. I was given a full look at the books and knew that the salary I wanted was right at the border of what they could offer. What I did request was to get 5 months pay in advance to pad my emergency fund so that if the startup went under, I wouldn't have quit my other job for nothing. They were happy to do it. It got them a developer, and it gave me a little more peace of mind. Salary isn’t the only thing to negotiate. I joined a startup this year. I was given a full look at the books and knew that the salary I wanted was right at the border of what they could offer.

What I did request was to get 5 months pay in advance to pad my emergency fund so that if the startup went under, I wouldn’t have quit my other job for nothing.

They were happy to do it. It got them a developer, and it gave me a little more peace of mind.

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]]> By: Jackie http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847842 Jackie Tue, 12 Oct 2010 19:53:17 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847842 Your dad sounds like a smart guy! It's great advice to always negotiate your salary. After all, the worst they can do is say no, but it's not like a no would translate into "Oh my god, nevermind, we don't want to hire you afterall!" And chances are you're likely to get at least *some* improvement. If a place really can't budge on the salary portion, you can always ask for other concessions instead. Your dad sounds like a smart guy! It’s great advice to always negotiate your salary. After all, the worst they can do is say no, but it’s not like a no would translate into “Oh my god, nevermind, we don’t want to hire you afterall!” And chances are you’re likely to get at least *some* improvement. If a place really can’t budge on the salary portion, you can always ask for other concessions instead.

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]]> By: The Other Brian http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847702 The Other Brian Tue, 12 Oct 2010 18:39:45 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847702 One more thing I thought of that #27: Stephen made me think of: If you can't get a salary increase, ask for more vacation time, especially if they allow you to cash out vacation. Often, your salary is set by the department/division/location's budget but vacation time is often "on the books" only at the corporate level. One more thing I thought of that #27: Stephen made me think of: If you can’t get a salary increase, ask for more vacation time, especially if they allow you to cash out vacation. Often, your salary is set by the department/division/location’s budget but vacation time is often “on the books” only at the corporate level.

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]]> By: Schotzy100 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847622 Schotzy100 Tue, 12 Oct 2010 17:58:39 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847622 I don't think the author intended to suggest that employers will offer a fixed salary increase year after year. What I believe she was doing was showing the time value of money. A powerful picture for those who do not easily have a mind for money. Think along the lines of your 401K account...monthly installments of $100 over the course of the year is likely to return greater results than an installment of $1200 made a year from now. For anyone needing a refresher in negotiations or to learn about the skill in general, I highly suggest reading "Getting to Yes" by Fisher & Ury. A great book. I can't even start to calculate how much money they have saved/generated for me. A classic worth picking up. I don’t think the author intended to suggest that employers will offer a fixed salary increase year after year. What I believe she was doing was showing the time value of money. A powerful picture for those who do not easily have a mind for money. Think along the lines of your 401K account…monthly installments of $100 over the course of the year is likely to return greater results than an installment of $1200 made a year from now.

For anyone needing a refresher in negotiations or to learn about the skill in general, I highly suggest reading “Getting to Yes” by Fisher & Ury. A great book. I can’t even start to calculate how much money they have saved/generated for me. A classic worth picking up.

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]]> By: Danny http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847592 Danny Tue, 12 Oct 2010 17:47:44 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847592 Any actual tips on how to negotiate your salary? Seems like this post just says "Always negotiate your salary" with no real useful information. Perhaps you could write a follow up article with advice on how to actually maximize your salary? Tips on negotiating, researching what you should be making, etc. Any actual tips on how to negotiate your salary? Seems like this post just says “Always negotiate your salary” with no real useful information. Perhaps you could write a follow up article with advice on how to actually maximize your salary? Tips on negotiating, researching what you should be making, etc.

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]]> By: Stephen http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847532 Stephen Tue, 12 Oct 2010 17:14:13 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847532 Don't forget that salary, while quite important, isn't the only part of "overall compensation" you can negotiate. - If the company is publicly traded, try for some/more stock options. - If there is a waiting period for health benefits, try to have that waived (I have) - Like @Tyler (#23), try for a signing bonus and/or relocation funds Salary typically comes from the hiring department's budget and is hard to part with, but the other benefits may not and be easier for the company to provide as an incentive. Don’t forget that salary, while quite important, isn’t the only part of “overall compensation” you can negotiate.

- If the company is publicly traded, try for some/more stock options.
- If there is a waiting period for health benefits, try to have that waived (I have)
- Like @Tyler (#23), try for a signing bonus and/or relocation funds

Salary typically comes from the hiring department’s budget and is hard to part with, but the other benefits may not and be easier for the company to provide as an incentive.

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]]> By: Kent @ The Financial Philosopher http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847492 Kent @ The Financial Philosopher Tue, 12 Oct 2010 17:04:49 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847492 Sound advice. I like this as an alternative: "If thou wilt make a man happy, add not unto his riches but take away from his desires." ~ Epicurus Sound advice. I like this as an alternative:

“If thou wilt make a man happy, add not unto his riches but take away from his desires.” ~ Epicurus

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]]> By: The Other Brian http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847422 The Other Brian Tue, 12 Oct 2010 16:39:11 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847422 I think it incorrect to assume that your annual raise will be same % (in this case, 5%) regardless of your starting point. Most companies band their employee compensation and try to keep similar employees in a similar range. It they pay you near the top when you start, you are probably more likely to get a lower % at your first review. Negotiations are critical when starting a new job, no doubt, but I think it is inaccurate to extrapolate the increase over a lifetime of earnings. The best method for increasing salary and advancing your career still involves *careful* job-hopping. I think it incorrect to assume that your annual raise will be same % (in this case, 5%) regardless of your starting point.

Most companies band their employee compensation and try to keep similar employees in a similar range. It they pay you near the top when you start, you are probably more likely to get a lower % at your first review. Negotiations are critical when starting a new job, no doubt, but I think it is inaccurate to extrapolate the increase over a lifetime of earnings.

The best method for increasing salary and advancing your career still involves *careful* job-hopping.

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]]> By: Tyler http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847282 Tyler Tue, 12 Oct 2010 16:22:22 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847282 @Patrick: Exploring opportunities at new companies is EXACTLY what you have to do. The best case scenario is to find a role with a new company that WILL pay what your current duties are worth. You can then go back to your boss and say "I gave you guys the opportunity to give me a pay increase a few months ago, but you declined. I now have a job at $XXX, which you either can match or I am leaving." The ball is then in their court to decide how valuable you are. My own negotiation story: had three job offers before college graduation. The most interesting job was also the least paying in the most expensive city. I took my highest job offer (in a lower cost of living area) and went to my desired job saying "You are offering less than another offer despite the higher cost of living - can you match the other salary?" (The difference was $1.5k.) The company HR came back saying "We will give you the difference as a signing bonus." I accepted and started in May. The following December, the company raised my base pay to match the local competitor pay, the same number I originally asked for (I was receiving the lowest possible salary in my job category.) So by negotiating, I got a "free" $1.5k I would not have seen otherwise. @Patrick: Exploring opportunities at new companies is EXACTLY what you have to do. The best case scenario is to find a role with a new company that WILL pay what your current duties are worth. You can then go back to your boss and say “I gave you guys the opportunity to give me a pay increase a few months ago, but you declined. I now have a job at $XXX, which you either can match or I am leaving.” The ball is then in their court to decide how valuable you are.

My own negotiation story: had three job offers before college graduation. The most interesting job was also the least paying in the most expensive city. I took my highest job offer (in a lower cost of living area) and went to my desired job saying “You are offering less than another offer despite the higher cost of living – can you match the other salary?” (The difference was $1.5k.) The company HR came back saying “We will give you the difference as a signing bonus.” I accepted and started in May. The following December, the company raised my base pay to match the local competitor pay, the same number I originally asked for (I was receiving the lowest possible salary in my job category.) So by negotiating, I got a “free” $1.5k I would not have seen otherwise.

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]]> By: Brent http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847242 Brent Tue, 12 Oct 2010 16:08:38 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847242 I've always offered my number first. I have no idea if I'm doing it right. I think my salary is great, but I don't think I've ever high-balled my salary expectations though. I'm going to start negotiating for a raise in a couple months, but its hard to know what I could ask for. I'll probably talk with some coworkers I trust to tell me what they would offer me. I’ve always offered my number first. I have no idea if I’m doing it right. I think my salary is great, but I don’t think I’ve ever high-balled my salary expectations though. I’m going to start negotiating for a raise in a couple months, but its hard to know what I could ask for. I’ll probably talk with some coworkers I trust to tell me what they would offer me.

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]]> By: Steve http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847182 Steve Tue, 12 Oct 2010 15:40:09 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847182 In my 7 completed years in the workforce since college with the same company, I've gotten raises 7 times, but they are all much, much, smaller as a percentage of my salary than the increase I got by just asking for more when accepting the offer. I like to say that was my "biggest raise." I was also negotiating from a real position of strength-- I had another offer, and it was actually higher. Be wary of really bluffing. In my 7 completed years in the workforce since college with the same company, I’ve gotten raises 7 times, but they are all much, much, smaller as a percentage of my salary than the increase I got by just asking for more when accepting the offer. I like to say that was my “biggest raise.”

I was also negotiating from a real position of strength– I had another offer, and it was actually higher. Be wary of really bluffing.

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]]> By: SupportingParents http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847102 SupportingParents Tue, 12 Oct 2010 15:16:19 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847102 I have a government job with a set pay scale so no negotiating here. However, when applying for other jobs in similar organizations I have been asked countless times to put "salary requirements" in my cover letter. This has always been a sore subject for me because 1) I have no idea how much work I'm expected to do for that salary until the interview 2) I may shut myself out of a job that I might be willing to accept less on if I put a higher figure in the letter 3) It just seems tacky to me, shouldn't they be the ones with the first offer? If anyone has ideas or suggestions to handle this I'd appreciate it. Keep in mind, when the job posting says "send a cover letter along with salary requirements" it tends to be something you can't just ignore and leave out. I have a government job with a set pay scale so no negotiating here. However, when applying for other jobs in similar organizations I have been asked countless times to put “salary requirements” in my cover letter. This has always been a sore subject for me because 1) I have no idea how much work I’m expected to do for that salary until the interview 2) I may shut myself out of a job that I might be willing to accept less on if I put a higher figure in the letter 3) It just seems tacky to me, shouldn’t they be the ones with the first offer?
If anyone has ideas or suggestions to handle this I’d appreciate it. Keep in mind, when the job posting says “send a cover letter along with salary requirements” it tends to be something you can’t just ignore and leave out.

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]]> By: Courtney http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847082 Courtney Tue, 12 Oct 2010 15:07:49 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847082 I didn't negotiate my current salary, because the offer was already $25K more than I was currently making (went from a fellowship to a regular position). I sometimes wonder if I should have, but it was within a few thousand dollars of what I was expecting, and I felt like saying "We both know I'm already getting a 54% raise with X, but I was really hoping for X+$4000" was kind of weak footing. I didn’t negotiate my current salary, because the offer was already $25K more than I was currently making (went from a fellowship to a regular position). I sometimes wonder if I should have, but it was within a few thousand dollars of what I was expecting, and I felt like saying “We both know I’m already getting a 54% raise with X, but I was really hoping for X+$4000″ was kind of weak footing.

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]]> By: Kaitlyn http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/2010/10/12/how-to-maximize-your-salary/comment-page-1/#comment-847062 Kaitlyn Tue, 12 Oct 2010 15:04:41 +0000 http://www.getrichslowly.org/blog/?p=44772#comment-847062 I love Ask for It, and I have heard Linda Babcock speak. Women still make 88 cents for every dollar a man works in the same job. And we wonder why. Bosses expect men to negotiate, but when women do, they perceive them as "cold, relentless bitches." Women should not be afraid to ask for something they want/need/deserve even when it is difficult to do so. In the book, Laschever and Babcock suggest practicing asking for all sorts of things in your regular life. Ask your husband to do the laundry, ask the salesclerk for a discount, ask your cable company for a lower price. The more you ask on less consequential issues, the more comfortable you will feel to ask for something when it really counts. Also, you will know how to handle rejection (because it's sure to happen) and the fear of it won't hold you back during salary negotiation. I love Ask for It, and I have heard Linda Babcock speak. Women still make 88 cents for every dollar a man works in the same job. And we wonder why. Bosses expect men to negotiate, but when women do, they perceive them as “cold, relentless bitches.” Women should not be afraid to ask for something they want/need/deserve even when it is difficult to do so. In the book, Laschever and Babcock suggest practicing asking for all sorts of things in your regular life. Ask your husband to do the laundry, ask the salesclerk for a discount, ask your cable company for a lower price. The more you ask on less consequential issues, the more comfortable you will feel to ask for something when it really counts. Also, you will know how to handle rejection (because it’s sure to happen) and the fear of it won’t hold you back during salary negotiation.

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