Protecting Yourself Against Sexually-Transmitted Debt
Published on - December 12th, 2011 (by J.D. Roth) This is a guest post from Claire Brown. Previously at GRS, Claire shared a reader story about how she learned about frugality from de-cluttering.
As we hit the season of Christmas parties and New Year bashes, many GRS readers are probably thinking about 2012 financial resolutions, budget gifts and how to whip up a frugal feast for 25th of December. Some of you may also be fearing that annual call from a family member in financial trouble, or dreading watching nieces and nephews unwrap gifts you know their parents can’t afford. But some people may have a dirty little financial secret that’s even closer to home.
Sexually-transmitted debt (or relationship debt) is debt you “catch” from your boyfriend, girlfriend, partner, or spouse by:
- Lending them money
- Acting as guarantor for a loan
- Taking out a contract or loan for them, perhaps for a mobile phone or a car
- Sharing a bank account or credit card on which they run up debts for their benefit
There are a variety of reasons people end up with relationship debt:
- Wanting to help. Where there’s a big disparity in income or someone isn’t good at managing money, what would be more natural than wanting to help out? If the person you love loses their job or has unexpected bills and you have the money to help, you may freely chose to help them through a difficult patch, even going in to debt to do so.
- Wanting to be loved. I have one friend who has put herself in debt to lend money to boyfriends on two separate occasions, and they both turned out to be deadbeats. Would it surprise you to know she has issues with low self-esteem? Sadly, there are people who think that the only way they can keep Mr. Right (or Ms. Right) is if they buy them lots of expensive stuff or act as their own personal ATM. I’ve also known people who seem to believe they’re not good enough to deserve someone who is both loving and financially solvent.
- Optimism. Does anyone ever co-sign on a loan expecting things to go wrong? Love is blind…and sometimes just a little stupid. If your spouse is slaving away in a job she hates but dreams of starting her own business, it might seem like a really good idea to pony up with the cash to help her realize her dream. She might even strike it rich, in which case you’re both living on easy street. The question is whether you’re applying the same hard logic to her big idea as you would to your other investment choices. Even where there’s a clear history of poor financial management, people in love can delude themselves that this time their partner has really changed.
- Intimidation. Sometimes people — generally women — are threatened, forced, or emotionally blackmailed into debt. It can involve actual physical violence, threats of violence towards others, threats of self-harm, threats to end the relationship, or emotional blackmail about the consequence of not providing the money (e.g., “If you don’t help me pay my car loan, I’ll lose my car and my job”). I worked for a housing organisation many years ago where we helped a woman who had been seriously injured at work and received a substantial payout; her violent husband had forced all the money out of her, then left with another woman. Sadly, not all people who end up with relationship debt do so freely.
- Ignorance. Some people don’t know what they’re signing. In one study, researchers found that many people who co-signed a loan thought they were responsible for half a loan, when actually each party is responsible for all of it. Or they thought they were signing a reference rather than a guarantee. Even where they did understand that they were acting as a guarantor they didn’t always understand the implications, that they could lose their house if the primary borrower defaulted on the loan.
- Gift to loan. There have been many legal cases where people have tried to reclaim gifts given during relationships. When writing this, I remembered that I had once provided financial support to my boyfriend. He worked for a non-profit that had its budget cut and to stay afloat everyone had to take a pay cut. So as a couple we agreed that we would divide rent and utilities in proportion to what we earned, rather than 50/50. There was no expectation that he would re-pay this money and we’re still happily together more than ten years later. But if we had broken up or — god forbid — I had caught him with a strumpet in a bed I was subsidizing, perhaps I would have felt differently and demanded he repay me. So some relationship debt doesn’t start out that way, but becomes part of the baggage when a relationship ends poorly.
How can you keep yourself protected from sexually-transmitted debt? Here are few suggestions:
- Openly discuss your attitudes to spending. As with that other type of STD, trust and communication are key. If you can’t agree on financial priorities then use financial “contraception” by keeping your accounts and financial lives separate until you get to know each other a little better.
- Work out if shared bank accounts are a good idea. In a long-term relationship, joint accounts enable you to have visibility of each other’s spending. However joint accounts will create resentment if you have very different attitudes to money and spending. Many long-term couples find it works better to have separate bank accounts, including J.D and his wife, Kris. So don’t assume that a long term relationship means sharing everything if it doesn’t work for you.
- Work out what expenditure needs to be agreed in advance as a couple. If you’re a committed couple and you’ve chosen to spend your life/finances together, you might want to agree an upper limit for spending without needing to discuss it beforehand. For example, 73% of people in a recent survey said it was unacceptable to spend more than $100 without checking with your partner — which leaves 27% of people happily spending more than $100 without feeling it necessary to share this information. This is okay if that 27% are all dating each other. However, if one member of a couple thinks it’s fine to spend $1000 without discussion and the other thinks all expenditure over $100 should be discussed in advance, then I predict a rocky road ahead.
- Monitor joint accounts. If you’re both responsible for an account, then you should both be responsible for monitoring what goes in and out of it. This means you should both have access to statements and online or telephone banking facilities. Actually, everyone should be keeping an eye on their accounts, as it’s a good way to avoid general fraud and monitor your expenditure.
- Read anything you sign. Know what you are getting into and be clear about the implications. If the love of your life isn’t honest about what they’re asking you to sign (or they don’t understand it) then you probably shouldn’t be lending them money. Also, if you cannot afford the implications of things going wrong then don’t lend money or act as a co-signer.
- Try to be objective. This may be really hard, but try to be objective in love when it comes to lending money. If Ms. or Mr. Right can’t get credit, maybe the credit agency knows more about their past than you do.
- Be clear about gifts versus loans. If you have freely and willingly offered to pay for your partner’s education or buy them a car, then I’m not sure it’s fair to try and reclaim it when things go badly. But equally, if money is only being provided as a loan be clear about the terms and get it in writing.
- Leave. If financial demands are part of a violent or otherwise abusive relationship, then leaving is probably a very good idea. If your significant other threatens you to extort money, or you feel unable to say no to their requests, get out now or think about building up some savings they don’t know about for your own safety.
If things do go badly, you’ll need to take action when a relationship ends, such as closing joint bank accounts and credit facilities. Move your income into a separate account and, if you move out, get your name taken off utilities. If you have a mortgage or loan, contact your bank to advise them the relationship has ended and make sure loan re-draw facilities are closed down and that any future decisions require joint signatures.
If all you’re left with is fading memories and debt, you really have two choices.
You can go after the debt hard. Get your ex to agree in writing what they owe you and draft a realistic plan for paying the money back. Ask them if they can borrow money from another source to repay you. If it’s a joint loan or mobile phone contract, see if you can get the terms changed so that you are not longer liable. There’s also the option of pursing the matter in the small claims court, but that’s going to have a big impact on your relationship with your Ex and you will need proof any money was a loan not a gift.
The other alternative is to write it off completely. I’ve seen friends who have put their financial and emotional lives on hold because they’re owed money they will probably never see again. Rather than setting their own financial goals, amending their savings plan for single life and moving on, they put everything on hold because when they get the money back that will sort out all their problems. So sometimes it is worth chalking it up to experience.
Photo by Corey Ann.
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I think your point about it being always important to clarify what money is a loan what is a gift is an important one. Too many people make this mistake.
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Absolutely agreed! I know lots of people who stay in financially abusive relationships too long and it affects them for years to come. Get out soon!
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I sometimes watch”Judge Judy” and there are usually some cases on each show that are a long these lines. Someone wants repaid for what they consider a loan and the ex lover considers a gift. It could be money or some material thing.
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Such an important, oft-overlooked in the name of love issue. My husband came with some extremely bad credit and habits. I was fortunate that my financial cleansing came before we got married, and involved cleaning up his mess too. I made it very clear I wouldnt say I do unless it wasnt going to involve a significant drop in my credit score. Call me cruel, but it worked. Now when his credit has to be pulled for something, we chuckle. Previously most online tools wouldnt even run it. Lately its been over 800.
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Under intimidation I know plenty of men who have been faced with “…threats of self harm, threats to end the relationship, and emotional blackmail.” Just because the relationship didn’t turn physically abusive (or more likely the guy didn’t report having things thrown at him or being pummelled awake because of some supposed action) don’t think for a minute that there aren’t plenty of guys out there who have been raked over the coals emotionally and finacially.
Otherwise I agree if you’re getting serious to really walk in with your eyes open because my wife brought thousands of dollars of debt with her when we got married, despite working two jobs for a year.
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Yeah, wow. This article was useful but had kind of a woman-hating tone.
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I thought it had the opposite tone. When you have lived through this, you start to see it very personally.
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Agreed. I’ve been through this in more ways than this article mentions. To wit: My ex-wife, then had to counsel my mom through some issues.
I am not the most financially-savvy, but I have certainly learned from my past. As well as from observing others. Fortunately my wife is about a genius.
These are truly some good points in this article. Sort of ‘financial self-defense’ in a way. Thank you for the article that we can share w/ others for whom we might not know how or be able to talk to directly.
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Another really superior, thought provoking article. Depth too. Educational. Thank you. This is helpful and opened my mind.STD debt-the dirty little secret in relationships. Clever.
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Epic title for this post!
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Hehe…this was a clever if icky title.
I wouldn’t get serious at this stage in my life with someone who had major debt that wasn’t a mortgage (or appropriate student loan, or inappropriate if for medical or law school). I’m just too old (35) and wise(?) to be with someone who thinks revolving credit card debt is normal. PF is a hobby of mine so it would be bad on many levels if I preached all the time.
I suffer not from STDebt but a pretty substantial income disparity currently. I don’t intend to share finances at this stage (share expenses eventually yes, shared income no). It has already been a bit tricky with vacations/gifts/entertainment choices hopefully it will all be able to be worked out in the long term if things progress.
More important is a shared value of staying out of debt, saving for long term goals and retirement, and the ability to delay gratification.
On the topic of financial discussions in relationships, when is it appropriate to discuss how much you make with a boyfriend/girlfriend?
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Interesting and informative article. My only quarrel is with the irritating and juvenile title, which basically shouts “Look at me! Aren’t I clever!” and somewhat undermines the text that follows.
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I thought it was pretty good. It sure made me look! And I think it’s just the right tone for the intended target audience (young, single, looking to mate).
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Not just for the young El Nerdo. I personally know of one case and have heard of many more where older single women have had their life savings wiped out by some charmer. Many lonely women just get used.
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I guess I would have expected older people to have figured out a few things in life, but you’re right, people of all ages can be vulnerable to con artists and gold diggers.
Still, I like the title, it’s funny.
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Nice article that hits home. I was young and in love, took me 12 years to pull my overspending hubby out of debt, then he went back to school. Now he doubled his income with some manageable debt. But alas, a Mechanical engineering degree does not a better money manager make. I allowed him to manage his own money, handing him bills to pay. He had the believe “on my salary we can do anything\everything.” enrolling our son a Parochial high school was the first step when he allowed me to fence him off to his own credit union account and debt card and some money form his paycheck auto deposited and i managed the bulk of the income and paid the bills. But then, this past June, my seemingly stable job went away and finally he is paying more than lip service to the emergency fund, debt re-payment and retirement funds. I’d probably do it all over again, but it is still painful. Sometimes it feel like a parent saying “no you can’t do that right now. We need to finish paying off the debt.”
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Seriously wife, get a job! You just spend all day watching the baby, I’m not paying your mortgage any more!
This post seems cynical, even to me. I tend to think that family deserves a bit of your time and effort just because they’re family, even if it costs you a bit of money. I guess maybe I’m not really the target audience.
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I have to agree with Tyler’s post at some level. This is alright for single people and those looking to find a mate, but I don’t think it really applies to marriage– when you marry, you marry warts and all (hopefully not those kinds of warts, but married people get heart attacks and strokes and cancer and what not).
My wife’s fortunes and mine are tied together– we’re a family, dammit, and we sink or swim collaboratively. We’re not shareholders in a business enterprise. We’re blood relatives– not like marrying your cousin, but in the sense that this is the family where you belong and people don’t ditch you when you become an inconvenience.
If you can’t figure out a way to agree with your spouse about money, how are you going to figure out raising children together, or taking care of each other when your brains turn to putty? If you can’t trust someone with your life and if you’re not prepared for a life-altering commitment then you shouldn’t marry. Marriage is about forming a family, and if you don’t want to be in a family you don’t need to marry– you can just shack up, like roommates with benefits. Universal health insurance is almost here so I see little reason left for marriages of convenience.
Anyway… blah blah blah… I’ve been working all night and I can’t compose a long rant, but yeah. I don’t want to go through life collecting exes.
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Tylers and your reasoning is based on that both spouses are on same footing. There is nothing wrong that the one person is supporting the other if it is made as a family decision.
I come from a country were the social system is based on that both work. The general rule is that you will not get alimony more then a couple of months if you get divorced and have been a housewife. The alimony is only during a transition period. Your assets are split into half if you dont have a prenup.
I know some really smart female lawyers that were not so smart in their financial decisions. They were married to a lawyers. They worked in the public service and took the main responsibility of the kids and therefore also less pensions etc. Their husbands worked in the private sector. Made their lawfirms private assets by a prenup. Bought houses, art and other investments in the name of the company. Everything was fine until the day that they decided that they didn’t want to married anymore. The husbands owned only the company that was their private through a prenup. Suddenly there wasn’t anything to split between the spouses. Or actually in one of the cases there where the inheritance of the wife.
My lesson. Don’t ever sign a prenup or if you sign don’t buy everything through a company that is privare property through a prenup because then you can end up with nothing after 20 years of marriage.
Even though most of the people dont enter a marriage with the tought that they will be divorcing I think it is essential to really consider the possible longterm pitfalls of financial decisions.
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“If you can’t figure out a way to agree with your spouse about money, how are you going to figure out raising children together…”
Isn’t that exactly the point of this article? To make sure you are with someone with whom you can have open discussions about money, and come to agreement about it?
What in this article indicates that you shouldn’t devote any of your time and money to your loved ones?
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Happy to provide clarification. What I was trying to write about was one way in which things can go bad – but this certainly doesn’t apply to all relationships any more than going bankrupt would be seen as a natural part of everyone’s financial life (i.e. it is something that can happen, but hopefully it won’t happen to you).
When you marry – or form a long term relationship with someone – it should be with someone you love, value and trust. My boyfriend and I work hard, share finances and support each other (emotionally and financially, as our salaries can vary).
But if you are in a relationship with someone you don’t or can’t trust, probably not a good idea to add money to the mix (or marry or have children with them or buy a house together).
And El Nerdo – hope you got a good night’s (day’s?) sleep.
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and getting a permission slip, aka marital license, from the government, does not make an individual more trustworthy.
if you can’t trust them without the piece of paper, what makes you think the paper makes them more trustworthy?
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I read it as more lessons-learned than cycnical.
Our family is just working out how to have a frank discussion on spending decisions with our parents (my in-laws). Happily married for 60 years, but FIL has a habit of making unilateral decisions a about car buying and announcing it (to us as well as his wife) before the papers are signed but with no intention of changing his mind.
The one idea I’d already come up with was a set “if I want to spend more than $x, I will discuss it with my spouse and wait at least y weeks until completing the transaction”.
I can claim that “that’s what we do in our family”, since my spouse & I discuss just about every expenditure before making it (even ‘I’m going to the hardware store and I am getting xyz and expect it to be no more than $n’). Mostly because we both have access to 2 joint accounts and 3 business accounts (3 different entities, and joint accounts are at 2 different banks in 2 different states thanks to our recent move).
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@ Claire- Ah, yes, thank you, I slept like a baby last night after a dinner of Belgian beer and fried Gouda (don’t ask…!).
Anyway, yeah, the trust thing– my whole point I guess is that if you don’t trust them you shouldn’t marry them in the first place. Cart before horse etc. Which doesn’t mean those things don’t happen.
+ imelda: I guess my criticism has more to do with the normalization of the “marriage-lite” institution, and the common notion of marriage as a temporary alliance of individuals who are hot for each other (“in love”) rather than the solid establishment of a family bond. This has nothing to do with religion or anything of that sort, by the way.
@Lina: to me, the lesson from that story is “don’t marry a lawyer” ha ha ha. But yes, some people are jerks, stuff happens, etc.
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The problem is, even good people, given 100% trust and no oversight, may do bad things because of personal weaknesses or plain limitations of knowledge (addiction, mental illness, trust in others who turn out not to be trustworthy.) Blindly giving one person financial power over an entire family isn’t giving them time or attention – it’s abdicating a responsibility to them as well as yourself.
My dad’s an alcoholic. Depending on him financially and giving him total trust was ruinous to our family, and to him – he needed supervision and hard limits on his behavior, not trust. (His second wife provides both, and they are doing great.) If you read people’s debt stories, a lot of spouses hide debt, spending, and addiction from their spouses out of a combination of weakness and love. Giving them carte blanche does NOT help these people, it just lets them big a digger hole for themselves, and for you.
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see approx five dozen archive posts re: “do what works for YOU”
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I’ve seen three examples in my personal life of the dad taking out mortgages and/or personal loans without the mom knowing about it; then in the divorce the unsuspecting partner was responsible for paying back half of the money they didn’t ever see, spend or even know about. In one case it meant going bankrupt (my parents).
Another example was my friends mom, years after the divorce the IRS came after her for taxes her ex owed. I was shocked they could do that even though they had been divorced for a long time. They took everything she had in her name and anything she jointly owned with her current husband. The only thing left was anything that was in her new husband’s name and not hers.
You are truly lucky to be in a situation with no risk, but it can be really dangerous to assume that because you’re married you are totally safe financially. For many people that would be a faulty assumption.
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Count me as one who liked the title – gave me a chuckle.
Yes, it’s eye-catching; yes it attracts attention. That’s kind of the point of any article title – to get noticed and draw the reader in.
Each their own!
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This article reminds me why I am single now since I’ve been on both sides of the issue. 12 1/2 years ago I married a man who’s mission was to put us (me) in debt. He also didn’t want to keep a job on top of that; I was the breadwinner despite being 12 years younger, etc. After the divorce, it took several years for me to get back on my feet financially.
Now things are not good for me financially due to medical issues, the economy, etc. I can see why someone would not want to take a chance with being with someone without a steady job, especially if it questionable if that person could work to retirement let alone full-time again and so on.
I wish GRS existed long before I met my ex husband. If I was receptive to the info at the time (I was only 20 when I married him), it would have saved me a lot of grief.
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What a negative comment! There’s more to love and life than just money.
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Money is one of the ways we measure value – if someone won’t work and demands a higher level of lifestyle than they can afford, they’re using you and showing what they value about you.
Conversely, even if they aren’t being malicious but just incompetent, if one person is always shoring up the other and cleaning up after them and covering for them – enabling them, basically – the enabler is not recognizing their OWN worth. Money is only one part of it, but it’s one crucial part.
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I hope you’re not talking about the original poster of this thread in this way. I hope you don’t end up in a situation where you CANT work and end up alone as I assume Carla is. Money isn’t everything.
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I was talking about Carla’s comment – she came out of that marriage feeling used and undervalued, and part of that was money. Unfortunately, if you marry someone like that, you can walk away with a lot of new knowledge, experience, and wisdom to balance out the years of living with someone who treats you as a meal ticket – but also debts that can take years to pay off.
Also notice I said *won’t* work, not doesn’t or can’t work. Money isn’t the only thing people can contribute to relationships. That doesn’t mean you can’t get into a relationship where the other person is only interested in using you, and one really objective way to measure that is the flow of money.
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@Rosa – Thank you. The financial issues was just the tip of the iceberg with my ex-husband. He was also dangerous, violent and mentally ill (paranoia symptoms with some post traumatic stress in the mix). The debt that I was in after the divorce was just a partying gift so-to-speak.
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So you think Carla should have stayed with her ex-husband? That hardly seems fair. Just becuase you are married you have to let someone take advantage of your financially?
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No, I was referring to her original comment, 2nd paragraph about not having a partner because of her financial situation.
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Really liked this post. I have a friend who hit a rough financial patch after her divorce, primarily due to poor financial management on her part and unrealistic ideas on how much it took to maintain a middle-class lifestyle. She had a relationship with a guy who first bought her things she wanted but couldn’t afford (e.g., a new laptop), then assumed bills, then assumed her life. He was verbally and emotionally abusive, tried to isolate and “own” her, and rejected her two children. When she finally began to want out of the relationship, she realized she was financially dependent upon him and found it difficult to break off because it meant going back to struggling to make ends meet. Fortunately for her kids and for her, she finally did, but it took longer than it otherwise would have.
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What about student loans? It seems cruel not to tie the know with a long-term significant other because they have $40k in student debt, something they wanted to do to further their career and education and be able to start a career in a field they are more passionate about.
Then again marriage has a huge price tag attached in that scenario. Not sure how to think about that one.
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We have a “no lending money” policy and a “one time gift” rule.
(Difference between policy and rule is that the rule can be broken in an emergency but policies cannot…)
We also don’t cosign or anything like that. Another policy that we explain to people we don’t break. It’s served us well. People have gotten upset temporarily about this, but no broken relationships like what happens when cosigning goes wrong.
The “rule” and “policies” helps us too by taking the emotion out of the equasion as much as possible.
Two cents
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Although I haven’t gotten to the place in a relationship where mingling finances is considered (yet!), this article seems to be a great primer for starting those kinds of discussions and making sure all your bases are covered.
Two thumbs up for financial contraception!
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A friend has a deadbeat boyfriend living with her. He spent a year unemployed ‘cos he didn’t know what he wanted to do next, and then finally she threatened to kick him out — THEN he got a retail job, which at least paid his food bills. We’re worried if she does get reid of him he’s going to try to claim half the house…
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Thank you. Each relationship has financial pitfalls, even the happiest couples have to work this out. Thank you for pointing out how economic abuse (and yes, it is mostly women but also men) is a factor. Abuse goes beyond just bad judgment or naivity, it is coercive and corrosive. Lonliness, low self-esteem, etc factor in and then often after signing the loan, lending their savings, when they should leave they either can not or don’t because they want to “wait to get paid back.”
Some debts are both hard to collect and hard to walk away from if you, say, did co-sign a mortage for an investment property, etc.
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Ah yes, I did this once. I am so chagrined to admit that I signed for my boyfriend’s car loan when his credit wasn’t good enough (many years ago). Guess who ended up with the payment and car after we broke up? Yeah. . . . Did I need two cars? No. . . . Expensive lesson.
My advice to others now: If someone can’t get a loan, think long and hard about why that’s true and how non-payment would affect your relationship before you co-sign or lend money. My rule with friends is to give money if the cause is worthy and if I have the money to give, but I don’t loan money, and I don’t co-sign.
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I still remember clearly when I was 14 and my brother was 18, him and his first girlfriend got credits cards and made each other authorized users.
Fast forward 3 years later when they’re breaking up and no one wants to pay off those credit cards.
It followed my brother for quite some time and I’m pretty sure it followed her too.
And how many People’s Court cases are of ex lovers trying to get the other to pay them back for cell phone bills, car loan, etc. etc.
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This post doesn’t resonate at all with me. I mean, relationships are a risk you take. You invest your time, effort and yes, money too.
I don’t see how a “loan” to your significant other would work. If the guy/gal is in trouble, then help them out – if you don’t, why stay in the relationship?
And what does it say about the relationship when you enter it putting all these “just in case” stuff (like protecting your money from your own spouse) in place. You’ve assumed the relationship will fail before it even starts… so guess how you behave if that’s your assumption and how that relationship will end if you behave that way.
It’s a self-fulfilling prophecy.
If you don’t trust the guy/gal enough to share your your finances, then don’t be with him/her.
P.S. I am the sole bread winner in my household but my wife manages the money at home.
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I kinda agree with you and el nerdo; this article seems more for those in dating, who’s going to propose first–sort of relationships. It is “a” factor to consider, not “the” factor.
I know plenty of “common law” couples who have every commitment node properly in place who never got a license. These people have been together and committed for more years in a row, than their critics have been officially pre-nupped and married to multiple partners added together.
The STD advice, just like sexual STD advice, sounds more for those who are still debating jumping in the better-and-worse pool, regardless of pieces of paper. This advice is only marginally appropriate (in the case of developed abuses) for those who are already committed.
Otherwise, just as you are implying that someone with a sexual STD is not worthy of marriage, family, love, because of a mistake…you are implying that someone without financial security is also not worthy…
Which on this thread comes dangerously close to introducing the kettle to the pot.
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It is always dangerous for one partner to manage all the financial matters if the other has no knowledge about accounts, details, etc. Even if you have total trust and know 100% that your spouse will not make any mistakes or take advantage of the situation there could still be an accident. At a minimum both partners should be aware of basic details like accounts, debts, etc.
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Totally agree. I should’ve made it clear that my wife manages the money but I do review them.
Just as Stephen Covey said in The Speed of Trust, “Trust, but verify.”
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I don’t see why you think someone who just started dating should have mingled finances.
“Oh hey, that was a great third date, do you want to be my girlfriend?” “Yes! I’m available tomorrow to join our bank accounts. Or we could wait until next week.”
What?
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You also need to be aware of your state’s property rules if you’re thinking of marrying someone on different financial footing as you are. Are items/accounts/debts community property or separate property? Are debts incurred during the marriage the responsibility of both people? Even if one didn’t know about it?
My husband was horrified when his mother had to pay her ex-husband A LOT of money from her 401k even though he never worked or contributed during their 5yr marriage. But, money earned during the marriage was ‘community’ property. Crazy. Each state is different, so educate yourself!
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very lucky that my parents did a pre-nup (late life second marriage for each after they outlived their first spouses).
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STDebt. That made me chuckle.
For me though, the trouble is with my relationships with friends. End up eating out just about every time I visit them (since we’re usually meeting in the middle somewhere, and I live in the middle of nowhere). That, and they’ll go to bars and parties a lot, and I almost always end up spending money when I’m with them, even if it’s not very much; all of those little transactions add up eventually.
I have invented some ways to enjoy their company without spending money though, and without having to travel long distances to see each other (which almost always ends up costing money.) One thing I’ve started doing is watching movies together over Skype with VLC (just set up VLC to stream over the internet, and share the link with your friend.) One higher quality content there can be some lag time (can’t wait until we have GB/s internet) of a couple of seconds or so, but you’ll essentially be watching the movie or show in sync (or you can just load the movie separately and try to hit play at the same time… but that isn’t nearly as nerdy.)
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I’ve personally been victim of “sexually transmitted debt” what a great term to describe what happened. The best thing about the whole situation is that it forced me to grow up about money real fast. I re-established myself with a strong connection with my money and more important a strong respect for money. The system I have in place now make sense for me and for those I decide to “get in bed with” financially.
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Loan or a Gift… this is huge. I have seen families torn apart because of this, and I have had major conflict among my own siblings because of this very thing.
Personally, I think 9 out of 10 times the better choice is don’t lend money to family with the expectation of ever getting it back.
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