In my last article, I talked about saving money on the big things, like cars and houses.
Multiple readers contributed good reasons why we don’t save as much money as we should on cars and houses. But one of my favorite comments was from Tracy:
See, it would never even occur to me to negotiate on a car, nor do I have any desire to. I realize this costs me extra money and it would do me good to do it. But I find dealing with people tiring and stressful (introvert), and apart from saying “I saw this vehicle priced for this much less” at this other dealer (which wasn’t an option last time we bought a car, because it was the only Suburu dealer within 5 hours of our house), I don’t really know HOW to haggle (I understand it is a skill that you can learn and get better at). And finally, haggling makes me feel trashy. I’d put off buying cars FOREVER if I had to do that.
Amen, Tracy. I don’t think we’re alone in disliking negotiation.
But as I said last time, saving money on the big things is…well, big. So even if I don’t like negotiating, I need to improve my negotiating skills so I don’t pay too much.
Knowing how to negotiate isn’t enough, though. Especially if it makes you feel trashy. Same thing if you feel sorry for the person selling the car or house. Or if you hate conflict (so one round of “Sorry, I’ll have to walk away” is enough to make your palms sweaty). Or maybe you just don’t want to talk to salespeople.
Maybe introversion isn’t the right word to describe these personality traits.
But no matter what, as with money, negotiating is more about the noggin than it is about the math.
But I’m not going to analyze your noggin. (And you definitely don’t want to analyze mine.)
Instead, we’re going to cover negotiation, introverted-style.
Tips for the introverted negotiator
1. Do your research. While this tip applies to all negotiators, I think introverted negotiators really shine here. We are quite comfortable researching online, reading articles, and comparing costs. We are fore-informed and, thus, fore-armed. We know what a good deal is; we’re just not always prepared to get it.
2. Decide how much you can (or will) spend. Again, this tip should be easy(ish) for everyone. Many times, your ability to secure financing will determine how much you can spend. Or maybe you just want to cut your bill by a certain amount. If you do have some wiggle room, sticking to the limit will be more difficult when personal interaction is thrown into the mix.
3. Know what you want (but don’t want it too much). Your research and spending limits will usually dictate what you want. However, decide ahead of time what is negotiable. If buying a home, is a certain school district a must? Is the number of miles from your workplace negotiable? Will you still keep your service with your company even if they don’t cave to your requests? As I know from experience, don’t get your heart set on a specific house, but do clarify what you really want or need.
4. Negotiate via email if possible. Although I haven’t personally done this, it would be much easier for me to follow Nicole’s plan to negotiate by email than to negotiate face to face or even by phone. If you can’t negotiate by email, the next tip may help.
5. Use scripts. If you call any utility company to negotiate a service, they have scripts in front of them to benefit their company, but keep you as a customer. Creating your own scripts again helps you clarify what you’re really looking for and also helps focus on your own needs. But here’s where I start to get uncomfortable. Scripts might mean…confrontation. By focusing on #2 and #3, you can stay strong!
6. Be pleasant, but firm. Whether you’re negotiating by email, phone, or in person, be pleasant. And smile. But don’t be too nice. You can be kind while still focusing on what you need. If you can keep your eye on the goal, saying “No, thank you,” or “I really want to keep my business with you, but I really need a better price,” isn’t as painful. On a related topic…
7. It’s not (really) about you. When the steel shows underneath my “nice girl” exterior, it’s usually because I sense unfairness or I’m fighting for someone else. When you’re about to back down, think about why are you negotiating. Are you trying to cut your cable bill so you have enough money to send your daughter to music lessons? Or afford a house so your children get a better education? Eventually, though, you may need to walk away.
8. Know when to walk away. Sometimes you have to smile (see #6), but know that what you want (#3) is more than you should spend (#2). And you walk away, literally or figuratively. This is the hardest for me. I imagine scenarios (he needs the money more than I do; his pay will be docked if I ask for another discount; I’m cheap! I’m stingy! I’m greedy!). And I guess the answer to all those questions could be “yes.” But that brings me to my last tip…
9. Look for the win-win. I am most successful at negotiating when I keep this tip in mind. You’re negotiating, because each of you has something the other one wants. You want to buy a car (or save money on your phone bill, etc.); they want to sell you a car (or keep you as a customer). The best situations are ones in which both parties get what they want.
As an example, we know a couple who wanted to sell their home on their own, so they called up their neighbors. Several neighbors expressed interest, but this couple asked the first one how much he was willing to pay. He named the exact price they needed. They didn’t negotiate further. And both parties were happy.
Maybe it’s not the best example of negotiating. After all, the buyer named a price, and the sellers took it.
But focusing on the needs of both parties is a style I’m comfortable with (and it would save me more than I’m saving now). And we should all do what works for us.
Now I’m off to practice negotiating with my husband…to see who gets to do the dishes.
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There is one other key for us introverts: Don’t negotiate when you feel desperate. When buying a car, #8 (willing to walk away) is your biggest ace, because if there’s one thing any car salesman gets drilled into his head, it’s: NEVER let the customer walk away.
When you’re not desperate, it shows in your body language. You can’t fake it (we’re not good at faking stuff anyway) so you have to be sure in your mind you’re not desperate.
But #1 is also important – you need to know the limits of being reasonable. If you combine that with not being desperate, you’re in good shape to walk.
Even if it’s the only Subaru dealer in town, you can always come back a day or two later…
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my cousin worked sales at a mattress store and told me his constraints. he was allowed to negotiate down to a certain level, but the very best deal wasn’t allowed to be offered until the customer broke off negotiations and physically left the premises and then came back in. They could leave for days or a minute, but they had to leave.
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As long as you haven’t handed over any ID for their “credit check.” DH and I got held hostage by a Honda salesman for over an hour … he wouldn’t turn over my driver’s license.
So my advice to add is, if you are not to the point of putting an offer on something, do NOT hand the salesperson ANYTHING that you might not want to leave with him/her.
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That’s horrible! Could you threaten to call the police if they don’t give it back immediately?
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I am with you in this category. I really don’t like to negotiate. I never used to be good at it. However, I’ve had to learn the skill. It takes time, practice, and a little bit of guts.
These are some great tips, especially using email to negotiate and to be willing to walk out. Using email is great if you are somebody who gets tounge tied. Being willing to walk away, and I mean really willing to walk, will get you a far better deal than any haggling ever will.
Another thing that I found worked to our advantage the last time we bought a car is this: we arrived at the end of the sales day. The salesmen are eager to go home, but they are also eager to make that one last sale. You’ll get to their bottom line much quicker than during the middle of the day.
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Regarding car purchases, for those that prefer not to negotiate you should consider buying your car from the internet sales person, everything is done by email, the price is generally lower but less haggling.
More than anything I haggle on art and antique purchases. First, I almost never buy art or antiques on first view. I’ll take a photo with my phone, get the artist information or the information on the piece I am interested in and then I go on my way. If its art that is located in a seasonal area, I’ll email the gallery in their off season when they are much more motivated to discount.
I’ll watch the artist web site for when they might be clearing their inventory or moving, I may not get the piece I was eyeing. The last piece of art I bought, I bought from a New Orleans artist that I had met in 2004 when visiting the city. I was on his email/newsletter list and when he was moving from NO to Cali he discounted his art by 50% since he didn’t want to move it and I picked up a great piece. I offered something on a smaller piece, even less that he had discounted and he accepted.
If I have seen a piece in a gallery, I may contact the artist directly and deal with them.
A lot of my waiting also has to do with making sure I’m really in love with a piece since art is obviously a luxury, I also save up my pennies. Right now I have a piece in mind that I am watching, I have started my savings fund and I have already contacted the artist directly and the price is $100 less dealing with her rather than the gallery.
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Artists have to make a living, too. I hope those artists can get all their expenses at 50% off, since that’s how you value their creative efforts.
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As a onetime, sometime artist, I was thinking this, too.
For the other artists out there, here are a few hints on how to negotiate with collectors:
1. Work from a price sheet. A price sheet calculates the costs of your artwork by its size, the cost of materials, your time, and your overhead. Having this information in one place helps you assess whether you are selling at a profit or a loss, or just coming up even. (At a 50% discount, most artists would be making a loss!) Too many artists don’t know the value of their own work, or price arbitrarily.
2. Be choosy about which collectors you will negotiate with, and under what terms. It doesn’t make sense to undercut your prices on your best, most recent pieces, which you could make more use of (and money on) showing at exhibits and prize shows for years to come. Nor does it make sense to accept a lower price from a collector who’s buying your work as a one-off, or who has no business or social ties to other collectors or dealers who might be interested in promoting your work.
Instead, discount older work that doesn’t reflect your mature style, or work that is (to your eyes) sub-standard or out-of-sync with the kind of work you’re doing now. Discount for returning collectors, for buyers who want multiple pieces, and for buyers who offer to pay by cash in one lump sum. Discount for dealers and curators and people who have a sincere interest in the arts and your work in particular.
3. Prepare ahead for cheap collectors by making a range artwork that you can offer in a range of prices. Make smaller pieces, make limited edition prints; if you’re game for it and it won’t conflict with the seriousness of your work (for many artists, it would!), you can even make jewelry or housewares based on your larger artworks.
Then, if a collector offers you too low a price on one of your bigger, better pieces, you can politely refuse but still have something to offer him/her in his/her price range.
4. Write up your rules for prices, discounts, and commissions ahead of time, so that when cheap collectors try to negotiate with you, you have a guide to refer to with sensible limits and boundaries.
If you’re an exhibiting artist, one of these rules will likely be “do not break gallery contracts…unless…” Most gallery contracts include a clause that you do not sell work out of your studio for less than a certain price. If you’re found doing so, you can lose your contract with your gallery and damage your professional reputation. That said, most artists do sell discounted work out of their studios from time to time to select, discreet collectors – and most savvy galleries will tolerate this. Knowing when it’s “safe” to sell outside your contract is critical!
5. When and if you do decide to negotiate your prices, put the deal in writing. Write up a proposal for the collector detailing the artwork, the discounted price, the terms of payment (e.g. 50% now, 50% by such-and-such a date), and setting a deadline for when the collector can “take it or leave it.” As a working artist, I have made the mistake of handing over work to a collector on partial payment, never to receive the remainder. Don’t make the same mistake!
6. Be aware that your reputation as an artist is linked to the firmness of your prices. The fine arts world is a snobs’ world…we all know this. If you accept too many discounts, or discount your work for the “wrong people,” you risk damaging your reputation with the “right people” – the true, hardcore collectors, curators, dealers, and critics whose discerning eyes, wide influence, and deep pockets can make or break you. It’s not nice to say so, but this is the reality of the fine arts market.
These tips have worked for me in the past. I hope they work for others, too!
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I’m not even an artist, but this seems like incredibly intelligent advice for pricing your work.
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Different Anne here. I also really appreciated your advice — not as an artist, but as someone who would like to collect more art than I’ve already been lucky enough to acquire.
I don’t have real estate, but I do have some art. I’d also love to see a GRS article on art collection — a real investment or not? Are there different price thresholds that reflect differently on whether it’s an investment?
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If the artist can’t sell it at the price they listed, then they don’t make any money. If they can’t afford to sell it at the price that they’re offered, then they shouldn’t sell it. Things are only worth what people will pay for them.
The other thing to consider is that the artist may have marked the price up for the psychological impact. My mother used to sell a lot of her craft work and found that she sold more units when she marked up the price significantly. Her best-selling items were made from scraps and took her about 15 minutes, but sold them for $20.
That said, MamaMia’s tips sound great for the artists.
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Exactly what I was going to say. Things (especially things as subjective as art) are only worth what someone is willing to pay for it…supply and demand and whatnot.
While artists have to make a living, they don’t have to make a living selling their own art. They can work on comission as well. They may not always have the satisfaction of being able to do their own thing on their own terms, but C’est la vie…join the rest of us on this planet.
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With regard to numbers 8 and 9, just remember – the other party can always say no or walk away as well. So I never feel bad about at least trying to negotiate!
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#4 is really the key for a true introvert (and it can also be quite effective for non-introverts). It not only keeps you out of the showroom, thereby avoiding your greatest weakness, but also allows you to play the market without running all over town.
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We’re pretty introverted, and I think Mr. PoP has turned that into a strength in terms of negotiating. He has no problem sitting there for a long time waiting for the other person to talk. And in negotiations, the first person to talk is the most likely to lose the process.
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This is very true. As a sales person, half of my job involves shutting up and letting the customer fill an awkward silence – usually with a concession on their current offering price.
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Somehow as an introvert I find that I’m more likely to be willing to negotiate the big purchases. I can’t bring myself to do it with smaller purchases, even when they’re from shops that would haggle, because a $25 savings just isn’t always worth the stress. When I know thousands of dollars are on the line? That tends to be enough motivation to push myself out of the comfort zone.
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I’m very much an introvert, and just can’t haggle in person. I do use some of these tips, especially #4. I may get tongue-tied when speaking, but not so much when writing.
The number one thing for me, is to be completely honest. That doesn’t mean I have to say “Yes, I really want that and I’m more than willing to pay that price if I have to.” Rather, I try to set myself up so that I can say what needs to be said, honestly. Ok, that’s not making much sense (hrm, maybe I’m not as good with the whole writing thing as I thought).
Example. Let’s say I have DirecTV. I want a better price for the package I have. I’d rather not change providers. If I call up and say I want a lower price and have no intention of leaving…probably not going to get that good of a deal. But if I scope out the competition, and at least CONSIDER the possibility of switching to Dish Network, then I can call up saying I’ve been checking out Dish Network’s offerings and was considering switching. Maybe even throw in a “I’d really like to stay with you guys, can you help me out here?”
On #3, I like casting a wide net, and letting the other person know about it. Sure, that house you have fits our criteria…but so do at least a half dozen others. I did the same thing when scoping out a new contract for my wife (who was a travel nurse previously); instead of saying we had to be in one particular city at a certain time of the year, we said any state she had a license to work in (due to a compact license and two other state licenses, that’s over half the states). Point being…if someone has what you want and they’re the only ones who have it…your negotiating power is severely diminished. But if they’re just one of many who have something you’re mildly interested in…completely different story.
Oh, and walking away…definitely. I bought a house, well we negotiated a bit and finally settled on a price. There was a title issue. The time on the contract expired. The next week it was cleared up and the agent practically demanded that I hold up my end of the bargain. I calmly reminded her that I was not under contract, a point which she made clear just the prior week, and gave a new counter-offer (which she refused to submit until I called her manager…yes, for whatever reason there was drama involved). Well, I got the house at the lower price, because I was willing to walk away.
Oh, a quick tip if you’re like me and feel a bit uncomfortable outright asking for a lower price. Instead of emailing or texting asking if the seller will take a lower amount…just send a message saying something like “I’m interested in the iphone you’re selling; if you decide to lower the price please let me know.” Instead of outright asking for a price reduction, you’re asking the seller to keep you in mind in case the product doesn’t sell, and he/she decides to drop the price. I know, same end result, but that’s the point. I’m not comfortable asking for a lower price, but I AM comfortable asking to be told if the price is lowered…just a little trick that helps me out.
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Studies have shown it’s also important to give the other party some kind of reason for why you want what you want. Saying “I can only pay $X” is not as effective as saying “I can only pay $X BECAUSE (insert reason here.)”
When you give people a reason for your position, they’re more likely to go along with it. Just don’t tell your life story – I’m not sure introverts would do that anyway.
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Heh…yeah I use that trick too, though I usually involve my wife (sometimes without her knowledge). I.e. “Can you do $100? My wife requests prior approval for anything over $100, and I’d like this to fly under the radar.”
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One of my best friends picked this tip up in law school (there is a whole class on negotiation, as you might imagine). Appealing to a higher authority can work in a lot of different ways. While planning his wedding he used this a lot by saying the price was high and he would have to walk away to check with his fiance. Anyone trying to make the sale is probably going to try to bring that price down such that the authority doesn’t come into play.
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I bought and rehabbed a house at the beginning of 2012. I generally don’t like negotiating, it makes me nervous. But when I met with the first contractor to get his estimate, I nervously said “Can you do any better?” and he knocked $100 off without even batting an eye. This gave me confidence to ask each contractor and almost everyone reduced their price by something without any real haggling involved. If I were better at it, I could probably have done even better.
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I have a love/hate relationship with this. On the one hand, I feel great that it’s so easy to do (“wow, I saved $100 without even trying!”). However, I hate it because I worry that I was being ripped off initially and that I could have asked for $500 off and they would have said yes. In my last job change, I asked for a salary of $8k more than the initial offer, and I basically got it immediately. I was thrilled at first, but the excitement was quickly over-written by the thought that maybe I should have asked for $10k more, or even $15k.
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Absolutely! Never accept the first offer on either side of the negotiation. If they’re willing to conceded X amount, and so quickly, what more might they move on?
It’s an awful feeling, buyer’s regret!
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My 15 minutes of fame! LOL!
I don’t know why the heck I don’t use #4 more often…I could definitely do that. I have no problem doing the research and bombarding a sales person with counter-offers…it’s just the mental hurdle of dealing with it face to face. The very idea makes me want to lie down in a dark, quiet room.
Brilliant tips, people!
BTW: I’ve been posting under Tracy (the Other One) recently, but in response to this shoutout, though I better use the original.
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The best thing about negotiating via email is that it’s very easy to pit offers against each other. Get a quote from the dealership 5 hours away, if it’s lower, make the local guy match it, etc.
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We bought our last car at Enterprise, which has a no haggle policy. It made the experience much more pleasant. I would certainly haggle on a new car, but I find bargaining for a used car really difficult. Plus those used car salesmen are soooo sneaky. They almost always find a way to make up the money they took off at the beginning.
I just had a girl on Craigslist haggle with me over a $5 item. Especially when you are dealing with people on e-mail, you have to be prepared that the seller will ignore you altogether. For instance, once I had an adult bike for sale on Craigslist for $10. Someone e-mailed and asked for $8. I just ignored him and donated it to charity. Frankly I’d rather do that than deal with a cheapskate.
So my advice would be, if you really want that small item on Craigslist, just pay what they are asking. Of course haggle on a large item of furniture or a car, but it’s not worth my time to deal with someone who asks if I’ll take $4 rather than $5 for an item that is already a good deal.
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I agree with this! My last two Craigslist purchases were a $20 solid wood TV stand and two CD storage towers for $10 total. The prices were already very fair so I didn’t try to talk the sellers down any further. Same for garage sales when stuff is selling for $3 or something. Why give the seller a hard time when stuff is already fairly priced? (I realize though that some of this is culturally ingrained.)
On the other hand, I talked a Craigslist seller down from $150 for a pair of dressers to $120. I rented a van and went to pick the dressers up… and it turned out the drawer bottoms were disgustingly stained. I should have bargained it down further, on the spot, but the seller knew that I had already sunk money in renting the van and probably wouldn’t walk away over $20 or something. So I gave up the $120 (and lined the drawers with fabric when I got home). I should have used tips #1 & 4 from this article and gotten a thorough description of the dressers’ condition before I made the trip.
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If you don’t practice on negotiating the little things, how can you expect to get better at negotiating the big things? Especially when most people only buy new furniture or cars every few years, it’d be hard to improve. Craigslist and garage sales are basically designed for haggling, so its a great low-pressure atmosphere to learn some negotiating skills in. As for people wasting your time, like you said, just don’t respond to stupid offers, or maybe bump your prices up a couple bucks so someone else can “haggle” it back down to your real price.
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When I am advertising on Craigs List I list certain items as PRICE FIRM to prevent people trying to haggle when they arrive at my house.
You need to be prepared for the fact that haggling can really irritate sellers, especially on very low cost items.
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You can certainly practice haggling on the little things, but I wouldn’t if it is an item that you really want. It is likely I or other sellers won’t respond to you at all via e-mail. You’re really not getting much experience AND you don’t get the item you wanted.
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If it’s something I really want or if it’s marked firm, I don’t haggle over it, but so often the little things are stuff you just happened to stumble across and don’t really need. In that case, I make a “deal” with myself; if they seller will take $X, I’m allowed to have it. If not, it wasn’t meant to be. And absolutely once a price is agreed to you don’t try to dicker it down again when you go to pick it up- that’s completely underhanded.
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I don’t tolerate people so cheap that they will haggle on an item even when I’ve priced it fairly (even generously) and listed it on Craigslist as “PRICE FIRM.” Those people go straight on my blocked email address & caller lists.
I’ve even had people answer these ads and agree to the price, only to show up at our meeting place later and try to haggle with me. I just walk away. (Congratulations! You’ve just spent more in gas money and time than you would have in one dollar bills!)
It’s one thing to be frugal, quite another to be RUDE. If a seller lists something with a “FIRM price” – be civilized enough to let it go to someone else.
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About a year ago I sold a 2005 Aprilia Scarabeo 500 scooter (500cc class, lots of storage…really nice). Put an ad on Craigslist for $500 (as I had to sell QUICK, I was flying out in two days). Believe it or not…I had someone ask if I’d take less!
If it’s a really awesome deal…I might not worry about negotiating, cause the first person to say “sure, I’ll pay the asking price” gets it.
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I like this article. I’m horrible at negotiating, so the step-by-step tips are very helpful. Luckily, I keep my cars forever, so don’t have to deal with car salesman very frequently….but at some point, I’m going to buy a house, and that’s an even bigger deal.
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Another introvert who hates haggling; just bought a new car for $200 under invoice after 2 hours negotiating the price. My advice is to take someone with you; my grown sons (a) argued my case in a way that I wouldn’t find comfortable and (b) kept reminding me that I could walk away at any time. Made me love them all the more
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On car buying, I hate it too but agree with the advice on dealing with the internet sales manager and also getting prices quotes via e-mail from competing dealers. But I’ve found even when I did that and had an agreed upon price, when I came to the dealership, they really pushed numerous add-ons. I recently bought a used Ford F-150 and had a really hard time arguing them out an extended warranty plan, which tacked on almost $2,000 on the price. I ended up just doing it to get out of there, but then canceled it within the 30-day cancellation period my state law requires (Texas). The ordeal made me realize these guys are pros and know how to work over people. They know their scripts!
A couple of other tips: Have plenty of time to kill. I think car dealers make you wait around (again to wear you down). It helped me to have a phone I could use to immediately e-mail competing dealerships to get updated prices in real time while I was negotiating in person.
Also, have a calculator and be ready to use it. Double check whatever math the seller has done (adding taxes, fees etc). It’s surprising how many times I’ve found errors (and never in my favor).
Finally, a great resource for new car buyers is edmunds.com, particularly the prices paid-buying experience forums:
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/WebX?searchResults@@.ef14c39
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Actually, my husband is an extreme introvert and he is better at negotiating than I am! He says little, and the salesperson doesn’t know what he is thinking. He also is not uncomfortable with no one talking, and I think that is a huge strength in negotiating. Dave Ramsey says its one of the rules, to just SHUT UP. I get very antsy in these situations and feel the need to fill up the silences, but he can sit there all day while they drop the price.
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This is soooo me. I can’t help but fill in silent moments when I’m uncomfortable!! Silence is definitely king in negotiating.
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re: scripts, they are out there and many find them useful. Ramit (I will teach you to be rich) is the king of scripts, he has them for everything. I think there’s one here on GRS for negotiating with comcast.
I haven’t tried them yet but if I had to negotiate something I would certainly want one!
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This is only semi-haggling related, but I love scripts.
I ran a book raffle for a non-profit group one year. In order to get some books, I contacted the publishers. I had a script to use at the opening and everything else was ad-lib based on the responses. If I ever made a call without the script, I wasn’t great at communicating what I needed from them or how it would benefit the donors.
It never sounded like I was reading from a script, I tried to make it sound conversational, but it ensured I got everything out in minimal time without being confusing!
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Pay in cash. Have that cash with you. You’ll be amazed at how accommodating car sales people will be with a stack of bills in their face.
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Maybe. If it were me, and I had really good credit, I’d probably let them assume I was going to have it financed. They get a kickback from the financing company, so it’s possible they may sell the car to you under cost, because they know they’ll end up making a profit on the financing.
I bet it depends on the dealership, but I’d go in, say I don’t have a trade, let them figure in financing…then once they take you to the finance office tell them you’re paying in cash. Of course, you should make sure you have the final price in writing, else they may conveniently “forget” making that offer.
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All very good advice! Especially if you can find a way to negotiate by email! Introverts communicate SO much better in writing!
And you’ll always be in the driver’s seat and come away with the best deal if you’re fully prepared to walk away!
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Excellent article!
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Good tips here. I very rarely have felt the need to negotiate a price, but there are a couple of occasions when I *should* have. Introvert, yep.
We have successfully resisted several attempts to raise our rents in various apartments. Usually by pointing out improvements we’ve made, or improvements the landlords have failed to make!
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I cannot agree more with the negotiating by email tactic. I detest dealing with car salesmen so I bought our last two cars completely via email. I didn’t speak with anyone until I got to the dealership to complete the transaction. I brought my email printout with the OTD (out the door) price and they honored it both times no problem.
Our oldest is getting her license soon and we’re currently in the market for another car. I’m waiting until the 2013′s are really on the lots before I start contacting dealers about leftover 2012′s.
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Ditto. E-mail negotiations with car dealership interntet managers worked like a dream for me. In December 2011, I bought my car for $4,907 below MSRP, $2,848 below what TrueCar said is invoice, and $148 below the lowest “point” on the bell curve of what TrueCar said was a “great price,” plus a 10 year extended warranty thrown in. It was a pleasure to do business with that dealer.
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I have no desire to haggle over a car, either. It’s almost like I’ll pay the extra cost just not to do that. The most I would do is what the commenter said; mention another dealership that’s offering it for less, so that the current dealership can throw in a deal.
But for things like utilities where I know I have a good chance of “winning,” I usually step up my game. For instance, I had to ask the pharmacy to re-check a price they gave me based on a secondary insurance. It was a hassle, but I felt like I had a good shot.
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I think instead of introversion the problem is more related to extreme self-consciousness, caring too much what strangers may think of you. Care more about what you think about yourself. If I paid more for a car because I didn’t want to appear cheap, greedy, or trashy to the salesperson, I would feel bad about myself every time I drove that car. I want to have a higher opinion of myself, so I force myself to negotiate even when it’s uncomfortable.
And realistically, the salesman probably isn’t thinking those things about you if you negotiate. But if you don’t negotiate, he will think you’re naive, stupid, or an easy mark.
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Yeah, I debated for a long time about what to call this and ended up going with introversion because it was only one word (but I believed it still got the point across).
But it goes beyond introversion. Extreme self-consciousness, like you said. Or people-pleasing. Or being afraid to commit. Difficulty making decisions, stuff like that.
To become a good negotiator, I think any underlying issues need to be addressed. However, I definitely did not feel qualified to delve into psychoanalysis. Maybe El Nerdo???
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Self consciousness is actually quite different than introversion, as I commented below. But both would potentially be a hindrance in negotiation.
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Great tips. I ran through the numbers with putting an offer in on my house by my parents and other trusted people in my life. Super helpful and gave me the confidence that I was making the right offer.
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I love my Mom’s technique. She does her research and decides what kind of car she’d like with what extras (required and might be nice). She then goes to multiple dealerships on the same day and tells them all, “I’m going to buy a car today. This is what I want. Tell me the best price for what you’ve got. Then I’ll come back and buy the car from whoever gave me the best deal.” If they try to play games with her by changing the price or otherwise not being straightforward, she just says thank you and goes to the next place. It works great for her. You could potentially do this over the phone or via email.
I’d watch out for the sales person adding “advertising fees” etc. after the fact and walk away if they play that game. My husband always asks for the “walk out the door” price to avoid those extras that show up after you think you’ve agreed on a price.
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This was our approach when we bought our last car in July, although we said we were going to buy the car by the end of the weekend and we started our shopping on Saturday morning. Most will tell you if they can match your lowest price over the phone. I ended up signing the paperwork at 8:00 PM on a Sunday evening, after the dealership had officially closed. However we do live in Southern California and we could drive to approximately 12 different dealers (for the same make of auto) within one hour.
We have never paid more than $500.00 over factory invoice. We have purchased a fair number of cars in the past 20 years as I have a company car but I negotiate the purchase myself. (with help from my husband) We bought our last car at exactly factory invoice, which means the manufacturer was offering some type of rebate back to the dealer.
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You can use a tag team method! My sister wanted a new car so she took me to play the “bad cop.” We had a code word so I would know when she wasn’t happy with the offer.
Each time the sales guy came back with a number- I would tell him the new car price needed to come down and the trade in needed to be higher. You can mention another dealership has a lower price- AND never mention which one by name. It’s none of their business and always come back to the issue at hand- the final price.
They need you more than you need them. If you are unhappy- just walk out! Don’t fall for the – let’s talk monthly note. The only thing to discuss is the final price. I would suggest try financing through your bank or credit union and getting a total number before going into any dealership. Never give them that info until the end when your price is final.
I’ve offered to go with several co-workers who were looking.
Just my two cents!
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I am not an introvert, and I do enjoy and am good at negotiating.
That said, I have one tip for introverts and extroverts alike.
State what you want specifically, clearly, and nicely…
AND THEN JUST STAND THERE TILL YOU GET IT!
Unless you get an absolute flat out “no” from the highest up person you could possibly speak with.
Just remaining in their presence will be a catalyst to give you what you want and get you out of there!
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I have to add one more tip. Don’t bring your mother to the dealer where your family friend is the manager. While I was discussing the price, my mom told our family friend that she wanted to make sure that he was getting something out of the deal and that we weren’t taking advantage of him. I gave her a hard time over that one and remembered it each time I saw my monthly payment. I just have to laugh.
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This article makes me have second thoughts about our addition. We did not bargain with our general contractor on anything. He presented the bid and we were happy with the price and his credentials, so we went ahead. Certainly over the course of the project we have mentioned when there were price discrepancies or if he dropped the ball and charged us for something he said he would throw in. But I can’t imagine haggling that much with a general contractor on a massive project. To me that would seem like I was nickel and diming them. You might save a hundred here or there, but what are you sacrificing in terms of the quality of the project? Perhaps this is a fear similar to the fear of having a server spit in your food, but I want someone working on my house to work hard and do their best. If they feel cheated or think I am a jerk for haggling, then don’t you think that might be reflected in their effort or the end result? A car is different, because the product is static. A service is more variable.
We tried a discussion once on a potential basement finish. He came in with a number and then we wrote back and said, “Well, we were thinking it would be around this.” We never heard back. My guess is that it often doesn’t work with contractors you have no relationship with prior to the bid.
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With all due respect I think there is a certain strain of contractors that come from another planet. I can’t tell you have many have started a job and never finished, have given me a quote and then never returned our calls when we accepted it.
I know there are lots of responsible honest ones out there, but there sure are a lot of nutters, also.
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Anne, I completely agree. We have had our fair share of duds as well. In my experience, heating and cooling seems to be the worst. That’s why if you get a good one who has been in business for decades, I think it’s important not to nickel and dime them. With contractors, sometimes you certainly DO get what you pay for. Plus with bids, it’s often not fair to come back and haggle with an experienced contractor and say, “Well, so and so company bid me this, so that’s what I expect you to work for.”
Oftentimes the shady ones bid low intentionally so that you will go with them. Then they tack on all kinds of extras as the project is progressing. While my general contractor hasn’t been the cheapest, he has never come back and said something would be more than he originally bid. If anything, he has come in under the bid. We are the ones who have added a few extra things along the way.
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I like a lot of the comments here. One other thought to add is that there are programs (Costco comes to mind) that do negotiating on your behalf. I have no idea how good these deals are, as I’ve never used them, but they might be worth looking into.
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We are planning to use Costco for our next purchase. Friends that have used it were very happy, and our experience so far has been great.
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Great tips – especially the win-win part at the end. So often we get distracted by just trying to win, that we forget about the other side. And I don’t even mean this in an altruistic sense, I mean that strategically we end up in a better position if we approach the negotiation trying to please both sides. That discourages adversarial or hostile negotiations, which is key to getting anywhere. Once someone gets fired up, your chances of closing a deal fall dramatically.
Thanks for the pointers
Tim
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My husband and I sort of have a team effort thing when it comes to negotiating. I do the research and thinking; he does the talking, only because he doesn’t care. (Though I wouldn’t say he’s the best at it.) I really just hate talking to people.
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It is one thing to feel uncomfortable while negotiating for a new car. This is normal. It is an entirely different thing to say that it makes you feel “trashy.” I think this commenter needs to get over herself.
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I can’t believe what a great discussion such an off-the-cuff comment of mine generated.
One point worth clarifying: Some people are confusing introversion with shyness or lack of self-confidence. They aren’t the same (although any of those traits might play a role in not wanting to negotiate), and these tips are helpful in all of these cases. Personally, I don’t avoid negotiation because I’m shy (I’m not at ALL) or because I’m insecure (I’d only be insecure if I had no price info, didn’t know the process, or didn’t know what I wanted), or because I care what the salesperson thinks of me (I don’t give a crap. Why would I? I don’t know ‘em).
Introverts are drained and exhausted by interacting with people(even sometimes those we love to to be around). I need to have a high ‘positive’ energy level to even consider a trip to a mall or a party, and I need alone time to recharge afterward, even if I had a good time. THAT is introversion. It is sometimes hard for extroverts to understand this, because they are the opposite, and recharge from interacting with people or ‘busy’ stimulating environments.
I tend to marshall my social energy so that it can be directed effectively to friends and family and required social events, etc., not toward psychological one-upsmanship of a total stranger. As Julie said above, maybe trashy isn’t the best word. I’m not up on myself…I just truly find haggling demeaning to BOTH parties. It’s hard to explain why: sort of like it’s a violation of an unwritten social contract of fairness? By default, the haggle-inducer (LOL) is already violating the rules of fair and moral interaction (because they aren’t going to set a fair price) and by engaging with them, I’m sinking to their level. Selling things is important and I presume we both value these goods. Why not just set a fair price, and I will pay it happily and quickly and be on to more pleasant things, and both parties in the transaction will be happy rather than losing our dignity trying to see who can screw the other one over?
Regrettably, I realize that’s not how things work. However, there are a number of approaches here that would work fantastically well for me that I haven’t tried (probably because we only buy cars every 10 years): email; silent treatment…brilliant idea and easy because it rids me of the need to haggle much at all; and the one I WANTED to do last time but couldn’t…walk in holding 20 grand in cash, and wait for the opponent to crack.
I’m totally saving this post! What a great article and comments.
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Awesome comment. If I could make another post out of it, I would
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Thanks for not taking offense to my comment Tracy. I am glad you understood my point. We have always negotiated for cars, and I have never considered myself to be “trashy.”
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As a introvert myself, thank you for clearing that up for readers. We’re mis-understood enough by some people.
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One tip I have noticed that seems to work really well is to state very clearly what you want and how much you are willing to pay – and then just go completely silent. Don’t say a word especially if they just start babbling. I often seem to “overstate” my case and chatter on too much. My better half is a pro at the silent treatment. He has even used this technique over the phone and endured 15 minutes of complete silence. And then got what he wanted.
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:sniff: That’s so beautiful! :wipes tear:
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As an introvert, my favorite way to negotiate is behind someone else. I ask my partner to negotiate for me since it’s in his best interest as well to get a great price. He negotiates on behalf of his union in frequent labor negotiations and has no problem with the language and behavior.
Sometimes you just gotta outsource.
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In every negotiation, I do my own research first before making any transaction. I have been seen many instances that sellers offer items at exorbitant prices. Hence, it is important to know how much you should be paying for.
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The best way to negotiate for a car is simple, always walk away. Salesmen are trained to never let interested customers walk away unless they have given them the best deal.
In my last purchase, I went through the whole negotiation process to see how low they would go, then when I got to the lowest I thought they were will to bend. I left to go eat lunch, and told them I think about it. If they let you leave, you got the best deal. Plain and simple.
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I actually take some pride in my ability to haggle at car dealerships. Dealing with the internet sales people is a great tip: you do all your negotiating from home and they tend to be high volume sales people at the dealer so they’re more interested in keeping that volume high and cutting deals to do so. As many have stated, there are basically 4 things you need to do:
1) Do your research. Find out the invoice pricing (what the dealers pay for the car) or blue book value on the car you’re looking for. You can find this info at edmunds.com. Realize that with new cars, even if the dealer goes down to invoice price, they are still making a profit as they have sales incentives and the auto manufacturers typically pay dealerships a residual fee for the lot space (basically for holding inventory before it sells). So they will always have room to drop the price to invoice or below. If you have competing dealerships in the area, you can also try to push the “destination charge” off the price tag.
2) Go shopping on the last weekend of the monthly sales period. Dealers have incentive to fill quotas on a monthly schedule. They are more likely to make deals if you walk in and stand firm to your goals on the final day of the month as the dealer at that point just wants to reach their volume quota. This works best if you happen to be at a dealership that is trying to be the #1 dealer in the region/state or the country. If the dealer’s already hit their volume quota and they’re not willing to drop the price, then walk and find another dealer who is willing to drop the price.
3) Always be ready to walk. Even if they’ve met everything you’ve asked for, walk just to see what happens. You’d be surprised at the things they’ll toss into the deal when you get up from the chair and start heading for the door. Floor mats, wheel locks, you name it.
4) Have your financing in place BEFORE you go to the dealer. Get a quote for a loan from your bank/credit union or lendingtree.com and know all the specifics before you go to the dealership, so you at least have a fall back to compare their financing offers. Take whichever deal works out better for you. If you’re paying cash, you should definitely push to bring their price down…at least propse “can you do a little better if I pay cash?”
good luck!
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Yes, that’s my name. A couple of comments on the original post:
there’s two kinds of psychological material that runs through…one is the “trashy” part, which I think, although it may reflect family ethos or personal taste about the vulgarity of buying and selling, is more likely a displacement of anxiety about the whole process, as an introvert. That’s a therapy issue, although, as many commenters have said, you can get over much of it with study and practice. The second kind can be more easily put aside: when you are buying something that sells for a living, please don’t give a single bit of energy to worrying or speculating about their quota, their children’s braces, or whatever!! Golly, this is just business. If they can’t afford to do a deal, they will refuse. Period.
It makes sense that a lot of the discussion focuses on the two largest purchases that most of us will face: houses and cars. A lot of money is at stake, so the anxiety level and the second-guessing factor goes way up. One thought is to try out negotiating techniques on real deals that are non-trivial, but less is at stake–buying a refrigerator or a good camera, for example. You will be dealing with professional salespeople who often have discretion, and you can learn from experience.
Finally, although I have studied negotiation in professional school, and got pretty good at it in my regular working life, as I retired and resumed a “bad-burner” career as a musician & songwriter, I find negotiating fees and holding my ground to be VERY hard…I hate the feeling of being personally de-valued or begging for a gig, which flies in the face of my advice that it’s only a business transaction! So, on the emotional aspect: it depends… ;=)
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I am what some people would consider an introvert, but negotiating and essentially asking for more makes me extremely uncomfortable. I think these tips are super helpful even for people who aren’t necessarily introverted. I read an article once that said that there are studies that prove that negotiating over email shows much better results.
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Silence is golden.
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Although some of these tips require me to uncomfortably fight through my fears of negotiating, I find it very comforting that my concerns are not just my own because it seems there are a lot of others like me. This gives me the reassurance I need to go to that dealership or haggle at a garage sale without a complete feeling of being trashy.
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