Ask the Readers: How much rent should I charge my in-laws?
Published on - January 18th, 2013 (by Ellen Cannon) Money issues among family members are difficult, to say the least. A reader named The Lessor wrote to us recently about his sticky family situation:
I have a brother-in-law who decided to pursue ministry work overseas. He is married to a European girl and they live with her mother most of the year. Each year they return to the U.S. to keep citizenship/residency, visit with family, and fundraise for additional money to keep them living overseas. They usually spend three to four months in the U.S., living in my spare bedroom.
My wife misses her brother greatly when he’s gone and likes for him to stay with us. I, however, can become annoyed when guests stay for an extended period, especially since they eat a lot of food, use a lot of utilities, are often messy, and generally put a lot of wear and tear on items in my house during these long visits. For the first time in over five years, they have offered to pay us some money to offset the costs associated with their stay.
My question to you is how can I calculate an amount that is reasonable for them to pay? I feel like there are a lot of unseen costs (such as my constant need to clean up after them). If the amount I charge is too high, they may choose to stay somewhere else next time, leaving my wife heartbroken. Any advice is appreciated.
Benjamin Franklin is said to have remarked, “Fish and houseguests smell after three days.” (Happy birthday, Ben! He would have been 307 yesterday.) So, The Lessor, you are not alone in your uneasiness with long-term houseguests, even if they are family.
My advice would be to figure out how much their annual visit adds to your budget. How much additional money do you spend on food during the months they stay with you? How much does your utility bill go up? The wear and tear on the house as well as the value of your time spent cleaning up after them are trickier to put a price on. A housecleaning service charges between $20 and $40 per hour (of course, this depends on the size of the house, the region of the country, and so on). Maybe if you charge them for cleaning up, they’ll actually do it themselves.
So, Readers, what do you think The Lessor should do? How much should he charge his brother- and sister-in-law for their annual stay?
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Sadly, from the modest experiences I had in a semi-similar situation, “soft” arrangements (“How about you buy 1/2 groceries for the month?” or “you can stay here, but please clean up after yourself”)just do not work beyond the first couple of weeks.
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When I’m a guest at my sisters I shop for and buy at least half of the groceries and try to clean up more than half of the time (with just the two of us). I’d think a proportional amount for your inlaws would be fair, including cooking and shopping. Perhaps you could offer for the them to stay obligation free for a week or two. I’d make this a conversation with all parties (but first with your wife). Best of luck!
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I have had this problem,when My husbands sister stayed with us and I worked, She did not do anything around our home and expected us to have dinner on the table I worked shift work and came home to dirty dishes ect.I feel that since they are coming to sty with you and if you and your husband work, that they are the ones whom should pick up after themselves, and also help with the housework and laundry. After all God did not want us to take advantage. they are family, treat them like family and not guests in your home.
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When my son moved home for his last year of law school, I told him I just wanted to breakeven on the additional expenses. I charged him for the increase in utilities and the additional food. He also contributed for the cleaning lady.
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One wonders if they are giving the mother-in-law any money to help pay for things in Europe.
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Lots of wonderful comments! Couldn’t read them all, so I hope this isn’t covered. I bet your town has some sort of rooming house with meals. See what they charge for room and board per person, use that as a starting point. I bet it leaves you some room to give a hefty discount! Hire help, you bet! And don’t let the “family discount” operate: (Shouldn’t family wish to compensate fully or more than fully, because YOU are THEIR family?) I never could figure out why this should work in only one direction.
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When I have family visit me for a while like this we have a community purse. Which means we all put say 100 dollars in an envelope per person and all joint expenses such as food, petrol come out of the purse.
No problems ever but if one person has little or no income they would contribute a smaller amount no problem they are family.
As I have an illness I always say anyone can stay as long as they look after themselves. So for instance don’t do their washing show them how to use the washer. Hand them clean sheets to change their own bedding. Ask them what their speciality is in the kitchen. Let them cook it.
They are family so should understand but it’s not worth filling out over money.
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I don’t think you’ll get the answer you need here because the most important person you need to hear from is your wife. This is your wife and her desires that you are balancing. I think it is wonderful that you compromise on this when it makes your wife so happy. But I also understand it can become annoying as when the stay is so long. I don’t think having additional money in your pocket will prevent your annoyance (so then what is the point of asking for money). And if you ask too much and the BIL suddenly stops coming next year, or limits his visits to short visits, your wife will blame you. I would talk to your wife about what she thinks, be honest as to your annoyance, and then talk to your BIL when he arrives so everybody is contributing.
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I was in a similar situation a few years ago. Rather than take cash, let them buy groceries and cook on alternate weeks. Also, take turns cleaning up after meals, cleaning the house, yard work, etc. They are not guests, they are family, and family helps with the chores.
Also, let your wife be the one to broach the subject with them. It’s her brother. so she can put the request as sister-brother.
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For those who have said, “ask them to do chores and clean up after themselves,” the fact that this couple has stayed free for years and NOT done this of their own accord, speaks volumes. If someone was letting me stay free for three (!) months a year, I would be going out of my way to clean up, cook meals for everyone, do yard work, be as helpful as possible. So asking them to start now is not likely to work.
I would charge a flat fee to cover food, utilities (if you have Mint you can look at last year for the months they stayed and see the numbers), and the cost of weekly cleaning while they are there. Having a housekeeper will cut down on the annoyance of the mess and be a nice offset to having extra people in the house.
Other ideas:
You could explain that their visit does have a significant financial impact on you — so if they find somewhere else to stay, you’ll be able to make a financial donation to the mission to help their fundraising. That’s only if your wife agrees, though.
Let them stay one month, not three. That is still a LOT of time!
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This would drive me up the wall, as I’m a very private person and would lose my mind having a family member staying with my boyfriend and I for months on end, EVERY year. What an invasion of privacy – even if they’re paying for it. The cleaning issue would drive me bonkers. They sound like such lazy, dirty mooches – ugh!
First and foremost, I would sit down with your wife for an honest and up-front talk. It sounds like this bothers you a lot, and you feel taken advantage of. It’s quite possible your wife has no idea that you feel this way. It seems like she’s oblivious (or uncaring) toward to the added costs and frustrations of hosting her brother and his wife for an entire season every year.
Personally, I’d let my partner know that 3 months is too much for me, and while I love that they have a great relationship, it’s too long a stay. If you can’t bring yourself to tell your wife that, you should suck it up and get used to it because you are going to be hosting these people for free for the foreseeable future.
If, however, you can have a successful and calm conversation about boundaries and your feelings (I don’t feel comfortable with your family living here for 1/4 of the time for free without paying for anything and constantly making things dirty, it makes me feel taken advantage of and depressed), you will get somewhere.
Personally, if you are a 2 person household, I’d add up the cost of half of the utilities, half of the food bill, the FULL cost of a cleaning service (you didn’t need one before them, and you certainly shouldn’t be cleaning up after them like they are little children).
As guests in your home, they are using your space, resources (food/utilities/cleaning time), and privacy, all things any self sufficient adult should be able to provide for themselves. Again, they are GUESTS in your HOME, so THEY need to conform to YOUR standards of cleanliness. This shouldn’t be negotiable, and it’s ridiculous for them to assume you will “drop” to their standard.
If they’re able to keep the place clean, don’t get a maid, but make your standards very clear and let your wife know that there will be one warning and then a regular maid charge. I would veto this “no maid if you keep it clean” idea if it has been tried before (asking them to clean up after themselves without success) and simply charge the cleaning fee.
I’d give them a break on the “rent” and go to 30-50% of market rate rent for a room (they ARE family). If you wife doesn’t think this is fair and is too much of an imposition, remove the rent from the table, but insist on half of food, utilities, and full price of cleaning. There’s no reasonable argument from your wife that can conclude they shouldn’t be responsible for all or part of those bills. Heck, if I was a long-term guest I would try to pay an ENTIRE utility bill or an ENTIRE grocery bill to thank my host for the costs incurred.
When you present the costs to them, they won’t really be able to argue with it if you present it as a “These are the costs you add to our household when you stay here.” type conversation.
They chose the life they are living, and your wife is CHOOSING to enable them to mooch. Good on you for deciding to take a stand! Just remember, you ARE being taken advantage of. Religious missionaries or not, a mooch is a mooch!
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Amen! This strikes me as a boundaries/communication problem more than anything. I love my own brother dearly, and we are close, but I can’t imagine inviting him to stay (with his partner) at my house for 3-4 months a year, every year, without seriously talking it over with my husband (and frequently).
The letter-writer could charge a fair amount in rent to the BIL, be paid, profit even, and STILL feel resentful if the burden of their stay is also emotional.
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Well, I have been on both sides of the table and I know what it’s like. As a newly graduated student, I stayed with my sister and brother-in-law for around 6 months whilst searching for a job. I feel bad about it to this day but the only other option was to shell out at least 400$/ month for housing while I had no job. But I never made a mess and never invited friends over and never cranked up the TV volume or anything like that and I pretty much never interrupted their lives. Yes, they did pay for my utilities and food. And, I hope I can return their favor in other ways when they will possibly visit me in the future. Writing a check and calling it even seems too business-like and it’s a pretty sure way to offend my sister.
On the other side, my mom’s brother has been staying with my parents for about 30 years now. Yes, it does seem like a really long overdue stay. But he is not married and he doesn’t have any family of his own. So although there are some problems because of his stay, my parents just let him be.
So, my point is, when it’s family, you do have to make some accommodations. But, more importantly, it’s up to the house guests to behave themselves and make it easier on the host.
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Wm, there is a huge difference between being a recently graduated college student and being a mooch for a third to a fourth of the year, every year. I would absolutely let my family stay with me in that kind of circumstance. Help them get on their feet, find a job, and get started in life.
Moving out on your own isn’t easy, and having family support is a valuable resource. It’s also obvious from your post that it was a temporary situation while you got started – the situation described is recurring with an employed and married adult, specifically one that is messy!
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They stayed with you in the past and didn’t offer to pay at all-doesn’t smell good… From my personal experience, it’s best to ask them to live in a rented room (there are places that rent for short periods of time). You will have better relationship with them, less anxiety for yourself, better relationship and privacy with your wife, better control on your expenses, less wear and tear, lower bills-and your wife will learn that its best for them and for you as a couple.
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You don’t know what has transpired in the past. All I know is that family usually doesn’t communicate that well. I imagine the wife has said things to her brother like, “You are welcome to stay as long as you need.” “It’s no trouble at all.” “We love spending time with you.” It is especially probable that these exchanges have occurred since the writer has made it clear his wife somewhat cherishes these visits. Do you fault
people for responding to such things and taking them up on the offer?
My mom will often say, “Oh, I loooove having friends over for dinner.” But after they come she will privately (to me) complain about how long they stayed and how much they ate. I even watched her at Thanksgiving tell a man (whom she had complained vociferously about staying to long in the past) that he was welcome to stay longer! These are the difficulties of human exchange. We don’t often say what we mean.
I am rather dismayed by commenters actually putting these visitors in the horrible people (“moochers” “dirty”, etc. etc.) category. But, alas, I guess that is the nature of the unforgiving internet.
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As someone who lives in somewhat exotic and desireble places, this issue of visitors hit close to home. For me, I’ll suck it up and tolerate family who are visiting, but not those who want to live with me, which is the case in the original letter. They aren’t there to catch up on old times with family, or to see what HomeTown has to offer for a week or 2; they are *living* there. That’s when it becomes free loading to me–when the person is using someone else’s home because they don’t have one of their own. (And the reason the don’t have on is by choice, not house fire or job loss or anything like that.)
So I think I’d go with something like, “Hey, things are just really crazy for us this year and while we definitely want to see you guys while you are in town, unfortunately, we won’t be able to put you up for any more than 2 weeks. If you want help finding a cheap long term hotel, or with anything else, let us know. We look forward to your visit!”
Opening the door to charging is, in effect, validating their choice and their assumptions that your house is a great place for them to squat, so I’d not do that. If my spouse insisted, I’d charge not just what it cost me in actual extra expenses, but also something to offset the terrible inconvenience. I’d probably charge about $500 (though I am from a very high cost of living area where $500 would be half the rent on the tiniest studio apartment in a very bad neighborhood.) and use some of that to pay for a housekeeper and an occasional night in a hotel for me.
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I’m having trouble wrapping my head around the thought that this couple are so messy, careless, and wasteful. It’s not that I don’t believe The Lessor — I do!
But how are they able to do their ministry work with these bad habits? Aren’t ministers supposed to be frugal, careful, and clean? Isn’t that a big part of their chosen lifestyle?
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I keep thinking about this and wondering what the real issues are. I am beginning to think that the problem is having extra people in the house for 3-4 months. In that case I might suggest that Lessor rent an apartment near their house for the BIL to stay in for the 3-4 months. Lessor pays the rent and takes the cost as a tax deduction as charitable contribution. This way his wife has her sister near, the BIL can do his fund raising and Lessor doesn’t have extra people in his house for an extended period of time. Just a thought.
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Why should Lessor rent an apartment for them? They are adults; if they need an apartment, *they* should rent it, not Lessor! Why are their living arrangements his problem?
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Why on earth would their family foot the bill for other adults to live for 3-4 months on a yearly basis? The missionary couple has chosen this life for themselves, which means they need to make choices that will financially support it. It’s no-one’s responsibility but their own.
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Charging a nominal amount of money will make you feel better and make them still feel okay about staying with you. Whatever will cover your actual physical costs–extra money that comes out of your pocket by having them there.
For a while my brother was semi-homeless and would come stay at my apartment every weekend to shower and sleep. I immediately sat down and went through ground rules with him–he had to take the sheets on and off the couch every day, he had to do dishes every weekend (and not just his–hey, I was paying for hot water), etc.
I was careful to explain that these rules were not because I didn’t want him there. In fact, I loved seeing him every weekend. I just wanted to make sure that I never resented him being there and I am aware that I get territorial. He understood and wanted to make sure I didn’t resent it either. He wouldn’t have come up with doing those things on his own, but he was happy to do them if it meant a free place to stay and keeping me happy.
Your in-laws probably just have no idea your idea of housekeeping is different. Give very specific rules, and explain that it’s in the name of harmonious co-living, not to try to drive them away.
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One nice thing is this is actually a good opportunity to bring up the cleaning and such in a diplomatic way. For example, something along the lines of, “I certainly wouldn’t expect you to pay a lot of rent. Really, as long as you help keep the place clean, do a share of the cooking, that kind of thing, I wouldn’t want you to pay more than your share of the food and utilities. Say $X a month.”
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Found the comments very interesting. Here is my 2 cents:
Instead of charging a fixed rent, ask the BIL & family to do these things:
1) Buy two weeks worth of groceries per month (effectively splitting the groceries)
2) Take over one or two of the household bills (water and electric)
3) Let them know that you wil need their help with keeping the house neat and clean, and everyone will take turns helping out (or put together a schedule).
Numbers 1 and 2 will make the guests have some “skin in the game”, and will hopefully encourage conservation (turning off lights, using less water, etc.)
Number 3 is common sense. I will clean up after house guests for a few days, even a week. After that, they need to pitch in. Cook some dinners, do some dishes, tidy up, etc.
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I personally would feel bad charging my in-laws for visiting unless they were really treating it as an apartment they were renting. If that’s the case, I would charge them what you would charge a housemate (figure up the rent for a house in your area and divide by the number of bedrooms or check on craigslist as others have suggested).
When my parents stay with us, sometimes for an extended visit, they are helping with childcare, chores, and buying groceries and a meal or two out. Sure, the utilities go up a little bit, and there’s a few extra loads of laundry after they leave, but the benefits for me are more than worth it.
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I would figure out the market rate for a roommate situation with the room — then charge accordingly. For example, will you give them the friends and family discount? Or will you charge a premium for B&B service? Work out this figure with your wife so you’re both comfortable with the number, and any reaction the in-laws may have.
Emma Johnson
WealthySingleMommy.com
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Balancing business relationships with family can be tricky, at best, but it is important to look at this as a business relationship. They’d pay rent if they stayed in an apartment and they’d pay to stay in a hotel; and there wouldn’t be food or other amenities to take advantage of.
I’d take a look at the rent for small apartments in your area. Those numbers will probably be too high, but they’d give you an idea of what they’d be spending if they stayed elsewhere. Look at your current monthly grocery and utility costs and see if you can find records of what you spend last year when they visited. That should give you a decent idea, at the very least, of the extra you shell out of pocket when they visit.
Another option is to ask for contributions as they go along. For example, charge a nominal fee to go towards your utilities, maintenance, and wear and tear, but ask them to do the grocery shopping every other week (take turns); be responsible for preparing certain meals; and to be responsible for some chores (create a chart if you have to).
My dad always said that you can visit the house once or twice, but after that, you’re no longer guests. Your BIL and SIL are no longer guests. They should contribute to the household while they’re there.
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I think the money question can be answered by reviewing monthly expenses and what your time is worth (since some of your personal time might now be spent with others). Sure, for some families/couples/individuals that could use the “second income” this is a great opportunity. However, some people are comfortable living on their own and this would be more of an inconvenience than anything. When it becomes inconvenient or bothersome, I don’t think it would be wrong to ask for a little than just enough to cover expenses, supplies, wear and tear, etc.
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Commentors remarks on the author’s unhappiness with his houseguest’ behavior are based on their understanding of the terms he used to describe their actions. But without specific examples, we don’t know what his definitions are. For example: my definition of a “messy” bathroom is water and towels left on the floor, and toothpaste and hair left in the sink. My mother’s definition was a sink that hadn’t been scrubbed and polished after it was used, or towels that weren’t perfectly folded and centered on the towel rod.
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Danger, danger, Will Robinson! There is no way you can win this. Charge them an accurate amount and it will be seen as too much, charge a lesser amount and you will still run afoul of your wife, BIL, etc. just because money changed hands, charge them nothing and you will be short-changed. Good luck!
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