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 Post subject: Need advice on dispute with bank
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 12:54 pm 

Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 12:38 pm
Posts: 2
Hello fellow GRS readers,

I've having an issue with my bank, and I thought some of you savvy finance folks might have some helpful advice.

Last Monday, I went into my local Wachovia branch where I have been banking for about two years. I went up to a teller and withdrew $240 (in $20s, a $10 and a roll of quarters). I saw the teller count the money to herself, but didn't pay much attention. She handed me an envelope, my cash and roll of quarters. I put the cash in the envelope and tucked it into my wallet, put the roll of quarters into my pocket and was on my merry way.

I walked back to my office a block away and took the cash out of the envelope to put into my wallet. I noticed I only had $130 in cash. I had been shorted five $20s. I went back to the bank and explained the situation to the customer service rep. They said they'd count the drawer of the teller (which they did) but if it balanced out (which it did), I was out $100.

They were not apologetic, nor did they offer me any recourse. I've been in touch with the branch manager over the last week, along with the corporate 800 number, to see if they could review my teller's surveillance tape to see how much money she handed me back. Everyone I've spoken to have been decidedly unhelpful, unapologetic and I've gotten countless pieces of conflicting information.

While I'm aware I should have watched more carefully while she counted the money, the sense of injustice and lack of recourse is just killing me! They are acting like this type of thing happens all the time and is not a big deal. For me, $100 is a big deal, especially from the bank where I do all of my banking and visit a few times a week for transactions.

Two points of clarification - the teller asked if I wanted to see my balance as part of my transaction and I said no (I monitor my balance very closely online), so I didn't get a receipt. Also, the total amount I was supposed to receive back ($240) posted to my online statement.

The whole experience has been very frustrating, not to mention the runaround I've been getting from my local branch and the corporate customer service office.

Has this happened to anyone else? Any advice on possible solutions or next steps? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Best,
Rebecca


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice on dispute with bank
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2011 3:48 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2011 6:33 pm
Posts: 841
Location: Illinois
Unless they run the tapes and actually see it happening, I think you are out of luck. Based on my wife's stories (she works in retail) I am appalled at the number of customers who routinely try to screw over the store and the cashier by claiming they got short changed (her store will review the tape and the customer is almost always lying) or trying to confuse confuse the cashier (who they must presume to be an idiot) by asking for something like three $20's, four $10's, two $5's, and five $1's when paying for a $15 purchase with a $100 bill. I imagine the banks get this a lot.

I'm not saying that you weren't really shorted. I'm just guessing the bank is suspicious and isn't taking it seriously.


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice on dispute with bank
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:23 am 

Joined: Mon Nov 01, 2010 5:15 pm
Posts: 960
bpgui wrote:
Unless they run the tapes and actually see it happening, I think you are out of luck. Based on my wife's stories (she works in retail) I am appalled at the number of customers who routinely try to screw over the store and the cashier by claiming they got short changed (her store will review the tape and the customer is almost always lying) or trying to confuse confuse the cashier (who they must presume to be an idiot) by asking for something like three $20's, four $10's, two $5's, and five $1's when paying for a $15 purchase with a $100 bill. I imagine the banks get this a lot.

I'm not saying that you weren't really shorted. I'm just guessing the bank is suspicious and isn't taking it seriously.

Good answer. I used to work at a bank & the lack of training is pretty normal so the teller may have just made an error. Banks also get a lot of scammers that will try to confuse the teller by asking for odd amounts of change or wierd transactions just so they can get an extra buck out of the deal.


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice on dispute with bank
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:31 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2009 9:01 am
Posts: 4506
Tightwad wrote:

Good answer. I used to work at a bank & the lack of training is pretty normal so the teller may have just made an error. Banks also get a lot of scammers that will try to confuse the teller by asking for odd amounts of change or wierd transactions just so they can get an extra buck out of the deal.


You have to realize that this is extremely unlikely to have happened and when it does, counting the teller's drawer will nearly always catch the error. And you can bet that they have reviewed the teller's surveillance tape.

I am also not saying you are lying or are even wrong. But I strongly suspect something else is going on here. Is it possible you misplaced the money?

Mistakes do happen. But that is why tellers almost always count the money twice in your presence and they have safeguards to track the amount in each drawer, not just the total dollar amount but actually the number of each denomination of bill. Surveillance tapes are a further backup. Even though you think you have been ignored I can virtually assure you they have investigated and have concluded that you were given the money.


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice on dispute with bank
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:24 am 

Joined: Tue Mar 11, 2008 12:19 pm
Posts: 1504
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Is it possible a co-worker or family member took the money?

As others have said, it is extremely uncommon for a bank to make an error like this. And if the cashier's drawer added up correctly at day's end, then it's almost impossible that the bank screwed up. I suppose in theory it's possible that Wachovia is engaged in a broad, organized conspiracy to rip off its own customers right in front of their faces, but if it were me, I would consider all other possibilities before blaming the bank.


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice on dispute with bank
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:46 am 

Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2010 3:31 pm
Posts: 356
Basically you were given half the money and you didnt notice?

Also not saying it didnt happen, but the story is so improbable that the bank has the right to be suspicious of you. If the drawer counted out, then the options are limited.

Either the teller is excellent at sleight of hand and managed to fool both you and the surveillance tapes by pocketing the cash, or the bank has an institutional practice of stealing small sums of money from individual customers, or you lost the money.


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice on dispute with bank
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:23 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2009 9:01 am
Posts: 4506
As improbably as it seems to me that the bank made a mistake like this, it is also strange that you would post for advice on this forum if this were a scam. S I am willing to believe this is an honest error on someone's part.

Is it possible that the money fell out of the envelope while in your car or while you were walking back to your office with it?


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice on dispute with bank
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:49 am 

Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 12:38 pm
Posts: 2
Thanks to you all for you advice and thoughts.

It isn't possible I misplaced or dropped the money. I put it all in an envelope before leaving the teller's station (admittedly, not counting it first). I was short five $20 bills and yes, apparently did not notice. I triple checked every pocket, purse, area in my wallet, floor of my office, and retraced my steps twice once I realized I didn't have the full amount I withdrew.

I have been getting the runaround from both my branch and the corporate office after I've requested someone to review the surveillance tapes. The branch says only the corporate office has access to the tapes, the corporate office says only the branch has access to them. Now no one is returning my calls, so it seems I have no recourse and should drop the whole thing. I just was wondering if anyone had encountered something similar and could give me any other tips or ideas on how to follow up with the bank.

Either way, I've decided to close my Wachovia account and open an account with my local credit union. I've been left with such a bad taste in my mouth about the whole thing and have gotten a glimpse into their standards (or lack thereof) of customer service.


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice on dispute with bank
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 11:20 am 

Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2010 3:31 pm
Posts: 356
Unfortunately if the bank says "we gave you the money" and you say "no you didnt", then your only options are to let it go or file a small claims court lawsuit(and probably lose unless they dont show up). You could try to file theft charges against the teller, but that will probably go nowhere since there is little physical evidence.

I know you say its not possible you lost it, but we have all known people to swear on their very soul that they dont have my (keys, files, tools, whatever) only to later find out that person borrowed the item, misplaced it, and then forgot about ever borrowing it in the first place.

It happens to everyone.


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice on dispute with bank
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:08 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2009 9:01 am
Posts: 4506
Savarel wrote:
Unfortunately if the bank says "we gave you the money" and you say "no you didnt", then your only options are to let it go or file a small claims court lawsuit(and probably lose unless they dont show up). You could try to file theft charges against the teller, but that will probably go nowhere since there is little physical evidence.

I know you say its not possible you lost it, but we have all known people to swear on their very soul that they dont have my (keys, files, tools, whatever) only to later find out that person borrowed the item, misplaced it, and then forgot about ever borrowing it in the first place.

It happens to everyone.


Unfortunately she can't even do that! Banks like Wachovia are federally regulated by a couple of different organizations (FRB, OCC, etc. depending on the issue). You can't sue until you have exhausted regulatory appeals. The bank has probably already afforded 10 times the benefit of the doubt that any bureaucrat will.

As you said, these kinds of things happen to everyone. Banks do make mistakes occasionally and people do lose things and then sincerely believe they have not.

It is unfortunate but we can all take a lesson away from this - count your money before leaving the teller.

I had almost the opposite thing happen to me one time many years ago. I walked up to an ATM at a bank I walked by every day. I started to put my card in and saw there was money in the dispense slot. Being an honest guy (or knowing I was on video, take your pick), I took the money and went straight into the bank and turned it in. They took it extremely seriously, had me fill out a form saying where I had found it and asked me to count it in front of them before anyone from the bank touched it... It was actually pretty surprising that they were so concerned about it and how seriously they took it. Obviously someone had withdrawn it and then forgot it in the ATM.


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice on dispute with bank
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:37 pm 

Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2008 12:29 pm
Posts: 1305
Location: Seattle, WA
The closest thing that ever happened to me was the time when we took out some $100 bills with which to buy traveler's cheques. We went straight from the bank to AAA to buy the cheques. The clerk at AAA used a special marker on them to show that they were the right kind of paper or something. Well, one of the bills failed. We got slightly less checks than we were planning and went back to the bank. They had no idea what the deal with the marker was, but (perhaps because they didn't know what the marker was) were willing to trade us a different bill without a hassle.

You could keep pushing to get the tapes reviewed. They might not be willing to share them with you. Other than that, maybe the clerk used slight of hand (is it really impossible for a clerk to pocket a few bills?) or you just dropped it. You may never know. Once you walk away from the counter, there's about zero chance that the bank will just take your word for it that they didn't give you the right amount of money.


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