Question for Business Owners

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YoungGun
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Re: Question for Business Owners

Postby YoungGun » Mon Nov 05, 2012 12:03 am

The impact would be bigger on your wife's accounts, but either way, the savings in the long run would add up (figuring you stick to this mind set from now till retirement, obviously if you only do this for a year or two, the difference won't be huge.)

Also, this isn't a set and forget method, it does require you re balancing every few years, or when you have major events happen (ie, "Hey wife, I would really like to retire five years early" or "hey, we had a surprise child and want to put them through college, so retirement will need to be pushed out five years.")

But this doesn't have to be as hard as it sounds. If you literally want to just follow along a target fund, then you can see how it changes every five years and just mimic it. Then if you feel like going a bit further and controlling your investments alittle more, it allows you to. Maybe you want just 2-3% more in stocks then the target fund.

This method isn't for everyone, but I know a handful of people that do it (including myself) because of the ease of it, and we find that the difference we save over the long run is worth the few minutes of clicking and selecting our allocations on vanguard's site. And as pointed out, at firs the difference may only be 0.0X%, but as your accounts get upgraded to admiral, the difference will become even bigger.

vanderbilt79
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Re: Question for Business Owners

Postby vanderbilt79 » Mon Nov 05, 2012 7:30 am

Bichon Frise wrote:
vanderbilt79 wrote:That's not to say this forum discussion will lead to my final decision.


That's b/c your mind was already made up before you ever posted here.

$20k is not a lot. You cannot replicate the target date funds all in admiral funds. best case is:

VTSAX 0.05 ER 55.1% AA = 0.02755%
VGTSX 0.22 ER 23.6% AA = 0.0592%
VBMSX 0.22 ER 21.3% AA = 0.04
TOTAL = 0.13361%

VTHRX 0.18 ER


Which brings me to my original question, should I go with Vanguard's suggested fund VTIVX based on my current age?

Vanguard suggests VTHRX for people within the age range of 45-49.
I just want to be something more than the mud in your eyes. I want to be the clay in your hands. - Mineral

Bichon Frise
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Re: Question for Business Owners

Postby Bichon Frise » Mon Nov 05, 2012 8:17 am

vanderbilt79 wrote:
Bichon Frise wrote:
vanderbilt79 wrote:That's not to say this forum discussion will lead to my final decision.


That's b/c your mind was already made up before you ever posted here.

$20k is not a lot. You cannot replicate the target date funds all in admiral funds. best case is:

VTSAX 0.05 ER 55.1% AA = 0.02755%
VGTSX 0.22 ER 23.6% AA = 0.0592%
VBMSX 0.22 ER 21.3% AA = 0.04
TOTAL = 0.13361%

VTHRX 0.18 ER


Which brings me to my original question, should I go with Vanguard's suggested fund VTIVX based on my current age?

Vanguard suggests VTHRX for people within the age range of 45-49.


Which brings me to my original point, you need to account for both your and your wife's accounts when you do this.

Step 1) Determine your AA. If you want what VG assigns to your age group, fine, do it. If you want something else, do it. If your question is what should your AA be, then ask. But, it needs to account for your goals, risk tolerance, etc. You really should decide this with a serious talk with your wife.

Step 2) Look at your wife's defined contribution investment options. Can you stomach them all for your AA? Is only 1 tolerable? Pick which funds you will invest in.

Step 3) Fill the rest of the AA "needs" through your rollover IRA. Perhaps this is a target date fund, perhaps not. You can use basic math to calculate an effective ER. It's shown above.

Step 4) Do it.

I suspect you need someone to hold your hand. While the DIY approach is rather simple and easy, it does require some work. If your time is too valuable, or you're too lazy (more likely the latter), then pick whatever you would like. It probably has little bearing on the end result, but I am of the opinion that a couple hours here and there to minimize risk is pretty cheap.

If you're looking for validation in your decisions, you're not going to get it from me.
Bichon Frise

"If you only have 1 year to live, move to Penn...as it will seem like an eternity."

avocado wrote:Good to see you back, I was starting to miss your incisive commentary!

vanderbilt79
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Re: Question for Business Owners

Postby vanderbilt79 » Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:26 am

I really appreciate your input, despite the crude judgements.

I found out that my wife's retirement is 100% stocks divided into 4 funds.

VPGIX
VPAOX
PRSVX
VPGRX
I just want to be something more than the mud in your eyes. I want to be the clay in your hands. - Mineral

Bichon Frise
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Re: Question for Business Owners

Postby Bichon Frise » Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:19 am

Start at the beginning. Step 1. What is the AA you want? This is usually the hardest question, but should really be resolved before you do anything else.

Here are some fitting portfolio ideas. http://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Lazy_Portfolios I use one of these myself, btw. I suggest one of the more simpler ones until you learn more.
Bichon Frise

"If you only have 1 year to live, move to Penn...as it will seem like an eternity."

avocado wrote:Good to see you back, I was starting to miss your incisive commentary!

Tightwad
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Re: Question for Business Owners

Postby Tightwad » Mon Nov 05, 2012 12:10 pm

vanderbilt79 wrote:I would like to continue contributing to this fund, though my business is without a doubt my main investment and will likely be sold at some point.

Let me point out that many self employed business owners think the same way you do..."my business is my investment"...until they get ready to sell it or retire then they find out it's not worth what they think it is. Just because you pour blood, sweat, & tears into building a business doesn't mean that someone else will agree with your valuation at the selling table.

vanderbilt79
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Re: Question for Business Owners

Postby vanderbilt79 » Mon Nov 05, 2012 12:43 pm

Tightwad wrote:
vanderbilt79 wrote:I would like to continue contributing to this fund, though my business is without a doubt my main investment and will likely be sold at some point.

Let me point out that many self employed business owners think the same way you do..."my business is my investment"...until they get ready to sell it or retire then they find out it's not worth what they think it is. Just because you pour blood, sweat, & tears into building a business doesn't mean that someone else will agree with your valuation at the selling table.


Good point. While I do think I will be able to sell the business for profit at some point in the future, I feel its revenue is where it will pay off for us long term. I see us more than likely owning the business beyond the typical target retirement age of 65.
I just want to be something more than the mud in your eyes. I want to be the clay in your hands. - Mineral


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