But I think when people believe things that don't fit the evidence it undermines their credibility.
Well I've been avoiding this thread. Sometimes I get sad and tired of the constant implication that because someone has faith they don’t see things clearly. That faith in God somehow limits a person intellectually or limits one’s credibility. Everyone believes in something. Having faith that God doesn’t exist or that evolution actually occurred takes faith - faith in one’s own understanding of the universe and faith in a theory. I guess my point was that in my opinion countries with foundations/influence of historically Christian values support freedom of religion more than those not founded on those same values.
What bothers me though, and always has, is when people believe in absolutes without making room for the possibility that they or their teachers could be wrong.
I don’t believe that people who teach that Jesus is the only way to God could be wrong. I believe the Bible is absolutely true and is the inspired Word of God. However, I believe you have the right to say that my belief system is wrong. That is the beautiful thing about free choice which is a protected right in this country. At least for the time being.
Some funny stuff though with Vintek, bpgui, and DH's comments.
Perhaps this thread has been too serious.
But in any case… Back to Healthcare, etc.
Yes, perhaps I do go off on tangents. I suppose I need to be more focused and succinct. Sometimes less is more my wife tells me.
I'm not even sure where to go back and start at. Here it goes:
However, the fact that the Bible doesn't mention these responsibilities don't fall on the State does not mean that it's morally wrong to do so. I daresay the actions of the State in these matters redresses the failures of the individual to follow the precepts laid out by the Bible.
Yes, I agree the church and families have failed their duty. Therefore government has overstepped its bounds in the U.S. The more the federal government takes over the more freedoms we will give up.
Remember, when the Bible was written, there were no democracies. But most of us here believe that, flawed thought it may be, that democracy is the best of the governmental systems produced so far. So the fact that the Bible doesn't mention something doesn't mean that it shouldn't be.
A pure Democracy would be difficult to live in. A Republican democracy, which is what we live in here in the U.S., is a somewhat decent system. You are right. Just because the Bible doesn’t mention something doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be. However, when the Bible mentions it IS the responsibility of family, individuals, and the Church to do something in particular this means the State is a last resort case scenario. The government taking over this role just means we as American citizens have failed our duty. Once again I have a problem with government telling individuals how to live. I agree that the risk is reduced with more contributors.
You ran off into a tangent again. Somehow my illustration about the 10 Commandments being codified into our laws and that the HRL being no different turned into your commentary about it being all but banned in the schools.
Once again, we both agree some form of Healthcare Reform needs to take place. My issue is the method this law has used and the degree to which this will impact citizens as well as generations to come.
As to Education: The basic problem with America, which is Education, is the lack of grounded moral principles being taught in schools. Instead, the theory of evolution is taught as fact. Students disrespect their teachers and parents. Students take their education for granted. “Teenagers” are allowed to make decisions regarding their sexuality on their own as they are handed out condoms. And students raise themselves with the help of their peers. The list goes on. Students aren’t taught to respect their teachers, principles, and parents in public schools. They’re not being taught basic principles like taking care of the elderly and assuming responsibility for themselves much less for their own family.
In regard to Social Security...
Taking care of the elderly used to be the responsibility of the family unit. I guess too many people weren't being taken care of by their children and so the SS system came into play. Before SS I guess it was expected that people would look after their parents in their old age. Today it seems this is no longer the case with the increase in demand for retirement homes, etc. I suppose also the fact that people were living longer contributed to the need for this system. I'm not sure the SS system will be able to support all the Baby Boomers though. I will be paying for the rest of my adult life into SS and I hope I will be able to actually partake in the benefits if I live that long.
While I agree with the concept of helping others I have seen firsthand what the cost of Medicaid
is to tax payers. I live in a low-income neighborhood. People that could work simply choose not to. And yes believe it or not these same people get free medical coverage with our tax dollars.
Let me give you an example: My neighbor smokes a pack (sometimes two) of cigarettes a day. She doesn’t work. She receives a check from the government for each of her kids who are “disabled.” The real issue is she has not taught her kids discipline and they lack male role model involvement. So she gives them meds for their wrong behavior. She gets checks every month from the government for her two children. This pays for the rent, alcohol, cigarettes, and she gets food stamps to help with groceries. Her rent is practically free. When they get too out of control she sends the kids with the help of Medicaid to mental hospitals for weeks on end. So she’s still getting the free checks from the government, the free Medicaid, has no responsibility for her children, and the practically free rent during this time. These are the people that I’m trying to help understand the importance of hard work, having good male role models, budgeting, and saving. Sometimes I just want to throw my hands up and say forget it all. But I remember if I can just help one or two kids get out of this generational pattern than it is all worth it.
Now there are the exceptions where people actually do not have the capacity to support themselves. But that is more the exception (say less than 10-20% from what I've seen actually could not work) than the rule. People just don't want jobs flipping burgers, working in retail, manual labor, etc.