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Valerie writes: “Someone in our family recently suggested that compact fluourescents weren’t worth it due to their high initial cost compared to incandescent light bulbs. We’ve switched all our lights to CFL, so my husband looked into the actual costs. I thought you might like the results” In this guest post, she lays out the numbers.
It makes good economic sense to switch from Incandescents to compact fluorescents (CFLs) — it’s not just a bunch of hype. Let me use our very conservative electrical bill to demonstrate how making the switch can save you money.
Our total consumption for July and August was 1195 kilowatt hours (kWh). This equates to 19 kWh/Day — far below the U.S. average of 29 kWh/Day. Part of this low consumption is because we’ve already replaced most of our incandescents with CFLs. But let’s say we haven’t, and assume that our electrical bill with incandescents is the same as it is now.
According to the American Lighting Association, lights account for 25 percent of a homeowner’s electric bill. But let’s assume they’re exaggerating, and put this to 20 percent.
Since we don’t use a lot of electricity in our household, 98% of all our electricity is charged at the lowest rate: $0.053 per kWh. About two percent is charged at $0.062 per kWh. For simplicity’s sake, we’ll just assume we get all of our electricity at the lowest rate.
Here’s the math:
- 20% of our total electricity consumption for 2 months: 1195 * 20% = 229 kWh for lighting
- 229 kWh charged at $0.053: 229 * $0.053 = $12.67 for lighting
- In our area, we also have the delivery, regulatory and debt retirement charges totaling $0.038 per kWh: 229 * $0.038 = $7.74 for lighting
If instead of using 60-watt incandescent bulbs we use 13-watt CFLs, we’ll be using 21.67% as much energy (13 watts divided by 60 watts is 0.2167). Applying this fraction to the cost of lighting, we now pay $2.75/month instead of $12.67, which saves us $9.92. Applying the other miscellaneous charges, we now pay $1.68 instead of $7.74, saving us $6.06. Using these numbers, we’re saving $15.98 per billing period.
It’s true that CFLs cost a lot more than incandescents, but their prices are dropping every day. Also, you can always get them on sale and/or use special coupons to get discounts. We replaced most of our incandescents in our house for around $85. (J.D.’s note: When we bought this house, we had a free home energy audit from Energy Trust of Oregon. They gave us six or seven CFLs for free!)
Even if, for the sake of illustration, we put the cost of incandescents at $0, CFLs will pay themselves off in just a few months. It’s been over a year now since we installed ours, and none have burned out. CFLs are rated for about seven years, which means that for the next six years, they’re saving us money. Even after stacking the cards against us, with the low electricity bill, paying the lowest rate, and assuming incandescents cost nothing, CFLs make sense.
Given that the bulbs should last seven years, we can expect to save at least $575.28, which isn’t bad for a couple of hours of work.
Michael Bluejay has an extensive page describing how to save electricity on lighting. Also, I sometimes see people worry at other sites that CFLs are not safe. Turns out this is mostly an urban myth.) Photo courtesy David Hobby of Strobist.
Addendum: One commenter pointed to this video that explains CFLs in plain English. Though CFLs contain less only 1% of the mercury found in the average home thermometer, they must be disposed of safely. For the best information about how to do this, contact your local solid waste department. You can take CFLs to any IKEA store to dispose of them. In the U.S., you can learn more about disposing CFLs at the EPA’s bulb-recycling web site.
This article is about Choices, Frugality, House and Home Monday, 29th October 2007 (by J.D. Roth)
October 29th, 2007 at 5:17 am
Watch this:
http://www.commoncraft.com/cfl
October 29th, 2007 at 5:18 am
Frugality in practice: Using the public library…
This post comes from J.D. Roth at partner blog Get Rich Slowly . Most of us have financial blind spots…
October 29th, 2007 at 5:23 am
Here in San Francisco (and possibly other places), our power company PG&E has been subsidizing the price of CFLs periodically. I’ve seen packages of CFLs in both hardware and grocery stores at very special prices, usually something like 4 for $1. These subsidized prices don’t last forever, but I’m fairly certain that they’re part of a nationwide effort. A couple of weeks ago, for instance, PG&E sponsored a “Turn Out Your Lights” night here in SF which was duplicated in cities across the country.
October 29th, 2007 at 5:26 am
Actually, there is a kind of disabled people who can’t stay in any areas with fluorescent lighting. The buzz and flickering makes them overstressed and kills their functionality.
The people I’m talking about are autistic, and you can read about the issue in an excellent blog post “We need to remove this access barrier before it gets put up” by famous autistic rights advocate Amanda Baggs.
link to blog post: http://ballastexistenz.autistics.org/?p=301
October 29th, 2007 at 5:27 am
This weekend, I bought a 4-pack of “60″ watt CFLs for $6.99, or $1.75 each, at Home Depot. I don’t have many bulbs in my apartment–I now have 5 CFLs and 5 regular. I hope this will make a positive difference!
October 29th, 2007 at 5:46 am
CFLs are definitely worth it! When my husband and I were using regular light bulbs, they were burn out after only a few weeks. But since we’ve switched to CFLs, not one has gone out! So on top of saving money on the electric bill because of CFLs, we’re also saving money because we don’t have to replace bulbs every few weeks.
October 29th, 2007 at 5:48 am
I tried to replace all the incandescent bulbs in my home with CF bulbs, but found that more than a few of the appliances simply did not allow for CF bulbs due to the design of the shroud or screen. I suppose this will improve in time, but it was a bit frustrating becuase I’d estimate that nearly 1/3 of the devices had to stick to the conventional bulbs.
October 29th, 2007 at 5:53 am
We’ve been replacing every incandescent with CFL when it burns out. Unfortunately we have a couple bad bulb outlets that seem to burn out CFLs quickly (2 days to 2 months). Ah the joys of the 30 year old house.
Now, find a reader who can do the math on energy/money savings from replacing windows! We’ve got the original windows in this house which are single pane with aluminum frames and slides, bad sealing, and seep in cold air from outside all over the house.
October 29th, 2007 at 6:00 am
We have been swapping out CFL’s as lights burn out. We have only had one appliance that would not work with the cfl but I have already seen a difference in the energy costs.
October 29th, 2007 at 6:21 am
[...] Get Rich Slowly diskuterar flourescerande glödlampor. [...]
October 29th, 2007 at 6:23 am
Years ago I heard that flourescent lights use a lot of energy when you turn them on, so they only save energy if they stay on for at least an hour. Is that true of compact flourescents?
October 29th, 2007 at 6:33 am
I’ve also replaced as many lights as I can with CFLs. Out of the 15 or 20 that I put in, probably 3 or 5 have burned out way before the 7 year life statement.
Does anyone actually have bulbs that last this long?
Since they are getting so cheap, I guess it still doesn’t matter much if they last the quoted life because I’ll be saving more on electricity than a few replacement bulbs.
October 29th, 2007 at 6:37 am
One thing I’ve found out since I switched bulbs is that most CFL’s have a 3 or 5 yr warranty. If they go out before then, and you have your receipt, you can get them replaced for free. We haven’t had any go out yet, I’m hoping we won’t since I didn’t keep our receipts! (I’ll be keeping them for any new bulbs we buy)
October 29th, 2007 at 6:38 am
If “people” [a generic "people", but you know the organizations I speak of] REALLY wanted to help conserve energy, rather than these enviromental people taking out an ad for a presdential canidate, all they would have to do is take out 30-second commercials highlighting simple stats and how making a switch will save you money after x-months. Could this get any easier?
Rather than use scare tactics that we’ll all be under water if 30-years, the simplest and most effective way to reach the masses, is to tell them it will hit their wallet harder if they don’t make a change and in the process can help the enviroment in one of the many simple steps.
Great post, simple numbers and it’s this type of info that should be platered on billboards, not all the baloney. KISS works perfectly when dealing with this stuff.
October 29th, 2007 at 6:40 am
We’ve replaced some incandescents with fluoros, but we don’t have a plan to do all of them, for a few reasons
- they are really hard to find - either we can only get screwins when we want snapins, or vice versa
- they don’t fit in a lot of our light fittings - too long.
- the light quality is awful! The savings are nowhere near what they say , because you have to buy much higher wattage (or equivalent) than they say to be able to see in the room.
I personally dislike them because I *hate* lights that don’t come on when I snap the switch. That slight delay drives me nuts.
My quality of life is worth more than the savings.
I don’t know about elsewhere, but down here in Australia there is a government plan to phase out incandescents over the next few years (ie they will eventually be illegal)
This is a shame as there is work being done for energy efficient incendescents that will probably be available around the time the ban goes in
October 29th, 2007 at 6:40 am
I replaced all of the bulbs in my house for about $60 by going to Sam’s Club and getting them in bulk. We reduced our electric bill by $15/month, and we average about 1000kWh/month. The only bulbs that I did not replace are the lights inside the refrigerator, the oven, the range hood (which I could probably do), or the candelabra bulbs in our dining room that are little 40W bulbs. There are CFL bulbs for the candelabras, but they look hideous; we just try to minimize the use of that light.
October 29th, 2007 at 6:41 am
And I use CFL’s in my house, probably around 75% at current time, and I use them because they save me money and because I feel good using them.
I just bought 6-lightbulbs of varying sizes and wattages for $17 at a school fundraiser, bringing me up to neat 100% and I haven’t received them yet, but a local energy company puts on these events at schools. The light bulbs are one of the easiest things you can do to help out, if you feel inclined.
October 29th, 2007 at 6:43 am
I haven’t had much luck with CFLs. I bought two outdoor bulbs for my front door. I use an Intermatic timer to turn the lights on and off. I had read that CFLs don’t work well with timers, and that appears to be true. The lights did not work properly, and I had to switch back to incandescents. I also purchased some CFLs for some lamps, but none of them fit (they were all too tall; necessitating new harps and shades). Finally, I bought one for a ceiling light in my son’s room. I bought a model made specifically to work with a dimmer. It was terrible. I found that when I turned the dimmer down, the light became much “cooler” to the point where it looked like a standard flourescent light. It was unbearable. Bottom line: I like the idea of CFLs, but I don’t want “cool” light in my house. I think these bulbs still have a ways to go.
October 29th, 2007 at 6:47 am
We replaced our bulbs with CF bulbs and it does make a big difference on the bill. Easily worth the investment. We bought our first CF bulb in 1996 and it is still working great. Most of the ones we have are over 5 years old and I haven’t had any burn out yet.
October 29th, 2007 at 6:51 am
As a resident of Canada I know that the energy “lost” as heat from incandescent bulbs is actually welcome for about 9 months of the year since it contributes to heating a room that is in use. I still use CFLs though since I am usually more concerned with light from my lighting and leave the heating to my furnace.
The only concern I have about CFLs is their high mercury content. Since I am conscious of where my waste goes (especially hazardous waste) I would like to see a lot more public attention paid to the safe end of life disposal of CFLs. So much is spend on promoting their use but I think a lot of people are still unaware of the high mercury content and the need for safe disposal.
October 29th, 2007 at 7:06 am
I am not sure the pf economic breakdown of cfl’s but I can tell you that if they use less electrical energy then it’s got to be a good thing. The electrical grid is stressed, trust me, beyond belief. Think, you are lucky if the christmas lights go on. Think, not in my backyard for that transmission line. Think, we use more each year with no new equipment coming online. Think, if the power grid fails then no cool internets.
October 29th, 2007 at 7:10 am
I checked on the nearest haz-mat site for disposing of the mercury contaminated waste. 160 miles round trip! At 25 mpg, that is over 6 gallons of gasoline, at $3.00 a gallon, over $18 to dispose of one bulb responsibly.
However, I did keep the receipt and it is only 80 miles round trip to the store.
October 29th, 2007 at 7:15 am
My first bulbs were purchased about three years ago. I bought them because of the long life, the decreased energy costs were just a bonus. Of those, I have had one burn out. However, that bulb is on nearly 24/7, and it took it over two years to die. Since most bulbs are not used more than about 8 hours a day, my one that has died a natural death is pretty close to that seven year mark.
However, I have found them to be more fragile than regular bulbs. I’ve lost three or four from having them come apart at some point in the base, either where the glass attaches to the base, or on a seam in the base.
October 29th, 2007 at 7:21 am
I tried those CFLs, but the light that comes from them is so UGLY. I’m in an basement apartment with teeeeeny tiny windows, so I’ll skip the CFLs until they can figure out how to make the light a little less harsh.
October 29th, 2007 at 7:27 am
Great to see this “highlighted” -
A few points. Using CFLs lower your household CO2 emissions, since the electricity you consume is generated in many locales by the burning of fossil fuels - in Pennsylvania, dirty, dirty coal. So using them not only lowers your bill, bit lowers your ecological foot print.
1) they should be recycled at the end of life, because of their small mercury content. take back programs will expand. Currently Ikea will take back any brand.
2) watch out what the light description is. White or natural light is very, very harsh compared to incandescents which is very yellow and what we’re accustomed to. My husband freaked out the first time I put a cfl in a lamp, rather than in the basement or whatever.
A nice light is sylvania warm white 2700K, 13 watts which equals a 60 watt bulb. You can buy them in a contractor’s dozen box at Lowes, though not online.
Since I have replaced all my bulbs with CFLs in our house, I have taken to donating them and giving them as gifts, to increase their beneficial CO2 reductions.
http://moneychangesthings.blogspot.com/2007/01/cfl-bribes-practical-philanthropy.html
October 29th, 2007 at 7:34 am
Peter: I’ve seen that argument about bulbs giving off heat being good in cold climates over and over again. Your view of getting light from your lights and heat from your furnace is the right one. After all, a furnace is designed to *efficiently* produce heat, whereas a CFL is designed to *efficiently* produce light. An incandescent is rather inefficient on both accounts.
MissPinkKate: I’ve certainly run into my share of crappy CFLs (slow warm up, flickering, odd colored light), but there are good ones out there, too. Instead of throwing up your hands, try a few brands. You’ll be surprised at how good some of them are.
October 29th, 2007 at 7:57 am
You fail to disclose one of the most annoying symptoms of a switch to CFL bulbs…the “warm up” period that might be a deal breaker for some.
If you need to turn on the lights just for a few seconds to find something, you are going to be out of luck…it takes a good few minutes for the lights to get to full brightness. Once they are on, its a whole different story, but until that point…have fun walking around in dim light.
October 29th, 2007 at 7:59 am
Another thing to look for are rebates. The state of Iowa has a CFL rebate program I was able to get 50% off the purchase of my bulbs! I’m sure other states have similar programs as well.
October 29th, 2007 at 8:03 am
I bought a bunch that were on sale and replaced them throughout the house. I bought too high of a wattage though, at least I assume that’s why a couple of them buzz. I’ve had to use three lights instead of four in a couple of rooms.
And I’ve had I think four burn out so far. I’m interested in continuing to use them though!
October 29th, 2007 at 8:09 am
I think it’s very irresponsible for bloggers to post about the benefits of CFLs and not inform people what to do with the bulbs when they burn out. I have four mercury filled CFLs that I cannot in good conscience throw in the garbage - PLEASE TELL ME WHERE TO DISPOSE OF THEM!
October 29th, 2007 at 8:27 am
Here in SF we can get CFLs at a rate discounted by a grant from the power company (PG&E). I just this weekend bought a four pack of CFLs for $3.99. At $1 a bulb it’s a pretty easy decision!
October 29th, 2007 at 8:42 am
Regarding the mercury content…I was looking around on Michael Bluejay’s site linked to the article (nice site, check it out), and here’s what he has to say:
“CFL’s have a few downsides: The most notable is that they start dim and take a few minutes to warm up to full brightness (though that’s an advantage if you need to flip the lights on in the middle of the night — since they won’t shock you with the terrifying instant brightness of regular lights). Also, most CFL’s can’t be used on dimmer switches; to use them on dimmers you need to buy the kind marked for dimmer use. Finally, CFL’s contain small amounts of mercury, so if a bulb breaks you should use chemical-resistant gloves to clean it up. The amount of mercury in one bulb is so small that disposal isn’t subject to federal regulations, but to be responsible it’s best to dispose of old or broken fluorescent lights at your community’s hazardous waste facility, rather than throwing them in the trash.”
October 29th, 2007 at 8:43 am
I should add that with the CFL’s we’ve been buying, the warm-up period seems to have disappeared, guess they’ve improved that technology. Only a couple of our bulbs have the flickering start-up, and we’ve placed them in rooms where it’s not an annoyance.
October 29th, 2007 at 8:47 am
[...] takes a look at how much CFLs really cost. - I’m still not a big fan of CFLs (compact florescent lightbulbs) but I’m still buying [...]
October 29th, 2007 at 9:04 am
[...] takes a look at how much CFLs really cost. - I’m still not a big fan of CFLs (compact florescent lightbulbs) but I’m still buying [...]
October 29th, 2007 at 9:05 am
I got a three pack at Wal-Mart for $6.97. I;m in the process of switching all our bulbs in the apartment.
October 29th, 2007 at 9:10 am
Australia is in the process of phasing out incandescents altogether!
http://www.malcolmturnbull.com.au/Pages/Article.aspx?ID=661
People are now saying LED lighting is even more efficient than CFL’s, but I think of them as Christmas decoration lighting. Anyone know about using them indoors?
October 29th, 2007 at 9:11 am
Any tips on brands/types of CFLs that have very little lag or warm-up time? Is there any rating or something that you can tell this by looking on the packaging? I hate the ones that flicker when starting, or have a noticeable 2-second lag between flipping the switch and actually turning on.
October 29th, 2007 at 9:20 am
Just last night my husband was brooding about what he’ll do when it isn’t possible to get “regular” light bulbs any more. We got some of the CFLs when we had an energy audit done, but we have older lamps and they don’t fit most of them, and when they do, the light isn’t pleasant. BUT on the other hand, my father was a great one for teaching his kids to turn off unneeded lights. As a result, it seems our light bulbs don’t burn out very often… and, we don’t do Christmas lights or other kinds of night-light pollution (see http://starrynightlights.com/blog/?p=52), so I’m not feeling any ecological guilt about not making this change yet. And what about LED lighting? Will that be replacing CFLs?
October 29th, 2007 at 9:24 am
I’ve been replacing incandescent bulbs with CFLs as they’ve been burning out. I’ve only been able to replace 2 or 3 bulbs since we bought our house though (almost 2 years) under this plan.
We have a number of small halogen lamps as well for lighting specific areas so we don’t have to light up a whole room if we’re just grabbing something from a shelf, or only hanging out in one corner of the room.
Unfortunately, CFLs can’t be put on a dimmer, so two of our more heavily-used rooms won’t ever get CFLs. Other fixtures, the bulbs just won’t fit and I’m not particularly interested in changing whole fixtures just to use CFLs unless I have to.
I do dislike the long warm-up time, even on the “fast” start-up bulbs, and the light color sometimes is a bit unnatural. But I’ll keep installing them as time goes on to reduce my power usage and for the convenience of not having to replace bulbs as often.
October 29th, 2007 at 9:27 am
I’ve been using CFLs for at least 10 years now. It rather surprises me that everyone else is just catching on.
Only one CFL has lasted more than a year. And that one’s 10 years old, so it’s an outlier. I’ve had some burn out in less than a week. They are not suitable for porch light use if there is any humidity.
October 29th, 2007 at 9:28 am
I recently put in CFL bulbs into the stairwell area of my apartment, since the sockets would blow out incandescent bulbs in a few months. The light is a little harsh from them, but then again I also bought 100W equivalent for better visibility on the stairs and in the lightless laundry closet. The 60W equivilents I bought for the living room are not harsh at all. In fact, I don’t even remember that they’re CFLs when I turn the fixture on.
I bought both packs at Walgreens for around $2 a bulb, normal price. None of them have a discernible warm-up time; I think they have pretty much figured this one out.
Thanks for the disposal information. I was actually not aware of that. I agree that they should be a little more open about the need to dispose of them properly, though they will need to be careful about scaring away people.
October 29th, 2007 at 9:28 am
Many businesses and stratas have made the switch because the longer life of the lights means fewer replacements — freeing janitors to do other work.
October 29th, 2007 at 9:37 am
I have used these for a long time. I find that the ones from Home Depot and Sam’s Club, though cheaper do not last very long.
I now buy them from a website called 1000BULBS where the price and color selection is good and they seem to be lasting…although seven years is a stretch by any standard.
October 29th, 2007 at 9:49 am
I’ve replaced every recessed light in my place with CFLs and found some that work in all my sconces. So it isn’t every bulb, but the vast majority. I’ve seen huge drops in my electrical costs. As far as them taking a few minutes to warm up, I’m hard pressed to imagine a situation where that’s really a dire problem.
I would say that they don’t make great dimmer bulbs. I have dimmer CFLs, but it isn’t close to being the same as an incadescent.
But I’ll happily live with that for the electricity savings.
October 29th, 2007 at 10:20 am
@144mph & others: They now make CFLs in various sizes. I had to buy slightly more expensive ones to fit in one of my fixtures as well, but that only means it will take another month or three to pay them off. Just keep your eyes open, and go to a hardware store to get the greater range of options.
@Pam: There was an episode of the Mythbusters where they poved that the “start up” energy cost of a CFL was a total myth. http://kwc.org/mythbusters/2006/12/episode_69_22000_foot_fall_lig.html
to quote:
Based on the amount of energy consumed turning on the bulb, they were able calculated how long the bulb would have to be turned off in order to make it worth the energy savings, i.e. “It’s best to turn off the bulb if you are leaving the room for”:
* Incandescent: 0.36 seconds
* CFL: 0.015 seconds
SO yah… don’t worry about that myth.
@Lea & others: Lea, it seems you’re in Australia, but here in the USA, your concerns are really non-issues. The bulbs are EVERYWHERE (even the grocery stores), they come in a LARGE variety of sizes, and the “warm up” time is down to under four seconds for the bulbs i own at least. I am sure that when in 2010 or so the law comes into effect that you can’t buy incandescent, you won’t have an issue of finding them, and in all the different sizes that we Yanks enjoy.
@MissPinkKate: There are a large variety of colour spectrums available for CFLs now. Just go to a store that has a good return policy, and try them until you get one that looks right. Please don’t give up on trying to save both $ & then environment because it will take some time.
@Joe Banks: If you read the WHOLE article, you see that JD gives links to where to dispose of the CFL’s properly are listed. You don’t see people making a fuss about people being able to buy Mercury thermostats, now do you?
@Money Changes Things: From what i’ve read, they haven’t QUITE gotten the spectrum issues of LEDs figured out yet. Sounds like the florescents of about 10 years go. Probably good for things like the pantry, or a closet, but most people seem to find them not good enough yet for places like the living room. :[
@Pete: I just bought the Menards (a mid-west home-improvement store) brand, and even those didn’t have the issue you saw. Try the GE Brand, my friend seems to like those? Again, a good return policy is your friend, as is the guy working in that department!
PS: Sorry for the length of this post, alot to respond to.
October 29th, 2007 at 10:22 am
Note: The only CFL’s i have that have a “warm up time” are the ones that i had to buy that were specially sized. all the other ones (the daylight spectrums) start up instantly.
October 29th, 2007 at 10:56 am
I think I might have “dirty power” at my home, or something. I’ve tried CFLs, and they blow out (with a buzz and smoke!) after a short time. This has made them too expensive for me to use in my old house, but I plan to try again when I build a new house.
Here’s an article I found interesting:
http://www.homeenergy.org/archive/hem.dis.anl.gov/eehem/93/931113.html
October 29th, 2007 at 11:09 am
I personally dislike the CFLs. I don’t like the quality of the light, and they don’t work with dimmers (we have a lot of dimmers). The bulbs do a weird flicker if you activate the dimmer. I have heard that there are bulbs that work with dimmers or dimmers that work with CFLs, but I’m not interested in spending more $$.
I hope those who are swapping out incandescents for CFLs are waiting ’til the incans burn out…
Off my soapbox now.
October 29th, 2007 at 11:49 am
For those that live near an Ikea, they take fluorescent bulbs back. The only trick is remembering to take them and remembering not to bring them back home again!
October 29th, 2007 at 12:48 pm
I have used CFL bulbs for over 20 years first in Europe and now in NA. I am a little surprised that nobody (unless I skipped over a reply) has any concern about the energy used to produce the CFL bulbs. Furthermore, the energy used for the packaging (garbage & energy use) is way higher. Net Net we might be better off with these bulbs but it is not as simple as comparing wattage and lumens. Especially if these bulbs do not last as long as promised. For a large part we might only export energy use to other juristictions (China) with worse environmental standards. So overall it’s not necessary all better for the environment.
Only my 2 cents.
October 29th, 2007 at 12:52 pm
I have a question I hope someone can answer for me re: CFLs.
Our bathroom has round globe vanity light bulbs…4 on each side of the mirror.
Can you replace the bulbs one at time with CFLs as they burn out…so there will be some reg bulbs and some CFLs until they all get replaced ??? Is there harm in mixing them ???
With 8 bulbs at a time to purchase and the fact they need globe bulbs and not the standard CFL design it is going to cost a small fortune.
Any help or insight would be greatly appreciated. Thanks~
October 29th, 2007 at 1:02 pm
@KSays:
There is no issue AT ALL, physically. There is 0% chance of “harm.” You might notice a slightly different shade of colour, is the only thing. Keep your eyes open for sales, ask around, call the power company if they have any plans/deals going on, &c.
October 29th, 2007 at 1:10 pm
K, if it’s the style fixture I’m picturing, you probably can mix just fine from an electrical standpoint.
The light quality in the room, OTOH, will be really weird.
Also, make sure that the color of the bulbs that you get “works.” Things appear much different under CFLs than incandescents, especially when they’re first switched on. It took me a couple weeks to adjust to the fluorescent in my closet; I had to keep asking my wife to double-check my clothing picks to make sure I wasn’t going to work in mismatched colors.
October 29th, 2007 at 1:44 pm
LED bulbs are now in the $40 range and are usually not recommended for anything more than hallways, etc., so the pay payoff could be years and years for something used so rarely. I work at a utility - I always recommend customers try out a few lights before replacing the bunch, and different brands appear to have different qualities of light. However I have seen dramatic changes from CFLs when customers are committed…
October 29th, 2007 at 1:49 pm
Sorry, but I just find the light from CFLs (and other fluorescent lights) godawful. No amount of fancy tint tweaking will fix it. If you ever use a spectrograph to compare incandescent or natural light with fluorescent light, you will see that no fluorescent light has anywhere near a full spectrum. Tick tick tick. Two or three bands corresponding to the gases in the bulb. That’s it.
I have a well-ingrained habit of turning lights off when they’re not in use, and that’s good enough for me. I’ll use candles before CFLs.
October 29th, 2007 at 1:55 pm
Addendum. Spectra from various lighting sources are shown here.
Note the huge spikes in the emissions spectra of CFLs, despite attempts to “clean up” the light with various phosphorescent coatings.
October 29th, 2007 at 2:19 pm
My only beef with CFL is the slight delay in them turning on! I mean, when I flip a switch…I want light immediately! You know? I don’t want a flicker and then 2 seconds later light, I want light when I flip the switch!
October 29th, 2007 at 2:24 pm
I had one light fixture that had been blowing bulbs for years. When I switched to CFL it smoked and made a frying sound. I removed the light fixture and found a burned and loose wire,came from the factory that way. Replaced the fixture and no more problems.
October 29th, 2007 at 3:14 pm
When I had energy trust of Oregon http://www.energytrust.org/ come out to do an audit at my place, they replaced all the bulbs they could (26 total - they didn’t have replacements for my chandelier) absolutely free! I had just bought the place, so I didn’t have a baseline for how much savings resulted.
October 29th, 2007 at 3:15 pm
[...] has a good, detailed article on just how much you can save by switching to fluorescent bulbs. I don’t have any additional numbers, but I do know that when I moved from an apartment with [...]
October 29th, 2007 at 3:28 pm
Ok, let me explain some things:
1) CFLs come in all shapes, colors, and sizes. You can get ones that match the yellow warmth of incandescents, or ones that look blue like sunlight and plenty in between.
2) new CFLs don’t flicker. If you aren’t judging your bias on a recent CFL, then don’t talk to me about it.
3) CFLs do take exponentially more energy when they start up than when they are one. BUT, it’s only for an instant, and it takes less than a second for that energy spent to be saved by a CFL. If you have the choice of leaving a CFL on, or turning it off while you go out to your car to grab your briefcase, turning it off will save energy (although maybe not enough for the effort).
4) CFLs take less than a second to turn on, and that’s being generous. They are nothing like the flourescents at work (although at my work we just bought instant on bulbs).
5) CFLs do have (imo) problems being stocked in local stores with significant variety. I bought a few on amazon, because they actually had dimmable, warm color, low profile ones I wanted for my desk lamps.
If you haven’t tried a CFL bulb in the last five years, go out and buy a couple different ones at a hardware store. If you can’t find one you like, please tell me, and I will give you a pat on the back.
October 29th, 2007 at 3:37 pm
We switched over almost all the bulbs in the house to CFL’s a few months ago. When we had a mix of bulb types, I didn’t like the CFL’s as much (the light is blue-ish by comparison) but now that there aren’t many incandescents to compare it with, I’ve come to like it. Ours brighten within a minute, and when fully lit, the room is brighter than it was before.
For disposal - our city says if you can’t get the CFL’s to a haz-mat site, then wrap burnt out CFL’s in two plastic bags and put them in the trash. I was on a real tear on this topic a couple weeks ago because at a Green City festival, one table was handing out CFL’s for free, and another was telling us we could not dispose of them safely!
The woman from the city solid waste department said the best thing is to begin bugging manufacturers and retailers to take them back, similar to how computer companies are now starting to take back old computers. With enough consumer pressure, the manufacturers and retailers will set up mechanisms for disposing of CFLs safely.
October 29th, 2007 at 3:47 pm
“The woman from the city solid waste department said the best thing is to begin bugging manufacturers and retailers to take them back, similar to how computer companies are now starting to take back old computers. With enough consumer pressure, the manufacturers and retailers will set up mechanisms for disposing of CFLs safely.”
Except that they stopped that after like a month because it costs too much money.
October 29th, 2007 at 4:01 pm
I tried those CFLs, but the light that comes from them is so UGLY
Pay close attention to the color temp of the bulbs on the package. You’ll want something in the 2500-3000K range of color temp, which will look most like an incandescent light. Values above that can look rather blue and yeah, kinda ugly.
October 29th, 2007 at 5:24 pm
We have a lot of heat-wasting halogen wall fixtures in our apartment, unfortunately. Nobody yet makes a CFL bulb that can replace the heat-source-that-happens-to-output-light in a Halogen wall fixture.
However, I went to Lowe’s and found a good variety of CFL bulbs, and replaced virtually every lap, wall light, and some flood-light style bulbs in a track-light fixture.
The light from the 15W coated floodlight is great once it gets going, and I love that the three 15 watt CFLs are as bright or brighter than the three hot-burning 75W floodlights that we got rid of.
I can now turn every CFL bulb in my house, in every room, for the same amount of energy it formely took to light up my kitchen alone.
October 29th, 2007 at 6:20 pm
Actually the reason ‘disabled’ autistic people can’t stand fluorescent light is because they can actually see the flickering. Even compact fluorescents eventually get old and start flickering.
“Normal” people see this too, it affects them by screwing with their mood and productivity (but they don’t consciously realize this). Compact fluorescents also produce enough ultraviolet to degrade plastic near them and fade colors.
Not to mention that most CFL are highly vulnerable to dirty power and so they just break (anything with electronic ballast), so they do not actually last nearly as long in practice as rated in some houses. And when they break often the glass gets cracked by the final arc that does them in releasing some mercury.
CFLs are really bad. I came home one day and one was flickering like Doom, a burnt plastic smell was in the air, and after turning it off and removing the bulb the plastic was melted. I have NEVER felt danger of my house burning down because of an incandescent bulb.
October 29th, 2007 at 6:48 pm
[...] How Much Do Compact Fluorescent Bulbs Really Cost? ? Get Rich Slowly Technorati Tags: money , savings [...]
October 29th, 2007 at 7:25 pm
I replaced all my regular bulbs with CFL and have gradually gotten as many family members in different households to do the same. My sister is VERY happy not to have to change bulbs as often. And everybody is happy about the money savings. For me the only little trick I had to learn was that my ceiling fan has a dimmer, and you have to get special CFL’s for dimmers. A little harder to find but worth it.
October 29th, 2007 at 7:29 pm
My experience with CFLs in the US bought at Walmart is that they die much quicker than advertised, and often quicker than incandescents. Also, 2 weeks ago I bought a NEW lamp at Walmart that had a circuit breaker built into the cord that tripped if I used a CFL!!! The manufacturer’s website said to return it if I didn’t like that feature, so I did. However that was a hassle. There was no special warning on the box.
October 29th, 2007 at 7:31 pm
I agree with ‘autistic’
The fact is that CFL bulbs put out fluorescent light. Not incandescent light. Fluorescent light truly looks like crap in my home.
It is not warm nor inviting. It has a sterile feeling to it.
I dislike it very much.
October 29th, 2007 at 7:45 pm
I completely agree, I prefer the more “daylight” spectrum of CFL’s. Also for those of you who forgot physics class, electric heaters (lights) are almost 100% efficient, the other other 5 or 6 percent is given off as light, aka incandescent bulbs. So yes the heat does heat your home as efficiently as central heat. Duh.
October 29th, 2007 at 7:54 pm
[...] How Much Do Compact Fluorescent Bulbs Really Cost? ? Get Rich Slowly [?] Share This [...]
October 29th, 2007 at 8:20 pm
Hey, what about LED lighting. I believe that those are even more efficient than CFL lighting. You could probably line a whole wall of a room with LEDs for the same consumption as the CFL and they have way way longer life. Hmmm? Oh, and NO mercury.
October 29th, 2007 at 9:13 pm
I’m working my way through converting the fixtures in our new apartment to CFLs. Most of our lamps already have them. My longest lasting bulbs so far were installed nearly 8 years ago when I moved to my first apartment in college and have been used as the primary light in my bedroom for those 8 years! Given expensive New England energy prices, I figure those two bulbs have saved me at least $156 so far.
October 29th, 2007 at 9:51 pm
To do a full comparison, all energy must be accounted for. This includes heat. A regular light bulb gives off small amounts of heat which is added to the total heat in a home. This heat amount is small, but does add a slight amount to the total homes heat. Compact Fluorescent bulbs give off virtually no heat. So while you save some in electricity, you should (theoretically)have to pay a slight amount more for heat. This will decrease your total savings.
October 29th, 2007 at 10:00 pm
For those of us who can see the steady flicker of fluorescents, CFL or otherwise there is no greater torture than being trapped indoors in what amounts to a disco with dozens to hundreds of strobe lights going all the time.
Think living permanent stop motion photography any time you are indoors.
Besides the flicker the light is sharp and gives severe head aches to those with good eye sight over the whole spectrum. I’m told its not as bad if you wear glasses because the frames block the peripheral vision which controls the autonomic light level adjustment in the eyes.
Please people try to think before you tell me what I can or Can not see.
I would spend far more on head ache meds than I would save on electric bills.
October 29th, 2007 at 10:03 pm
Fluorescent bulbs also tend to generate less heat which is great during the warmer months. They also pay for themselves over time through less energy consumption.
-Raymond
October 30th, 2007 at 1:30 am
We just switched all the bulbs im our house to CFL’s… It’s a good sized house, and our electrcity bill is about $300-400/month. Spent about $600-700 to replace all the bulbs. Even replaced the dimmer ones. You have to make sure to buy the right color (soft white works to replace incandescant), and usually the incandescant wattage that the bulb compares to is usually more than what it states (example: If the bulb claims a 9W CFL is like 40W incandescant — its more like 50W) - but a few returns and lessons learned we are adjusting to them.
Haven’t had a new statement come in yet to show savings, but kept all the receipts (warrantys from 5-9 years on different bulbs), so I wont be buying any new bulbs for at least 5 years.
They do have a small warmup time, but really only obnoxious in the bedrooms and only for a second. Most of the fixtures in my house use the 60 watt candelabra small base lights, with 6-10 bulbs/fixture… such a waste of energy!! hopefully the CFL’s help…
we’ll see
I would like to more about disposal though. Otherwise Im a fan!
October 30th, 2007 at 1:44 am
GNC-2007-10-30 #313…
Recorded this show with little or no sleep in the past 48 hours so fair warning it should be entertaining from a sleep deprivation stand point. Sponsors: [Save 10% off on any order at GoDaddy.com!] Use Code Todd [Try GoToMeeting……
October 30th, 2007 at 4:20 am
Everyone compares the retail cost and energy usage of CFLs and LEDs with conventional incandescent lamps. How come nobody talks about manufacturing costs–dollar amounts and energy and raw materials consumed? Though inefficient, incandescent bulbs are cheap to manufacture and the materials are inert, and easily recycled. Each LED and CFL takes significantly more energy to make (perhaps more than energy saved while using!), and the materials left behind after they fail are toxic and non-recyclable. You have to look at the whole picture.
October 30th, 2007 at 8:30 am
@ClickerTrainer (#41):
“They are not suitable for porch light use if there is any humidity.”
Hm - my porch lights are CFLs, and I’ve had no trouble in Atlanta summers. Granted, I use the kind that have a plastic shell/bulb around the CFL bulb itself (got them at IKEA) so perhaps that shields the fluorescent sufficiently. Still, the lights next to the porch doors are going on 4 years or so.
October 30th, 2007 at 8:43 am
[...] Valerie cuenta que su consumo de julio a agosto fue de 1195 kWh, meses durante los cuales tenía las bombitas comunes, las incandescentes. Ella calculó que eso equivale a unos 19 kWh al día. [...]
October 30th, 2007 at 9:24 am
I find it funny that you made a point of posting that note about the safety of the CFL bulbs while at the same time hosting an ad in the rotation that is a very anti-CFL site
October 30th, 2007 at 10:00 am
Dude: No, an incandescent isn’t nearly as effective as a central heater, as there’s no way to distribute the heat. Rather, you blast a bunch of excess energy out as heat in a highly localized space. They a bit like a radiant space heater suspended near the ceiling in the center of a room. You’re *way* better off using your furnace for heat and a light for light. As you so aptly put it, “Duh.”
The heat generation argument also cuts both ways, as during A/C season you are dumping excess heat into your home that needs to be pulled out.
October 30th, 2007 at 10:10 am
When I bought my house on September 06, the first thing I did was replace every light bulb with a CF. My summer electric bill hovers around 16kWh which is very good compared to the US average.
You don’t need to go broke buying CF blulbs and you can replace most regular bulbs with compact flourescents. I bought mine at Costco where they sell packs of 8, 13W bulbs for $3 or less. If you need bulbs for decorative lighting, Wal-Mart has good 7W bulbs that fit things that use them.
October 30th, 2007 at 10:45 am
I have switched to using CFL bulbs and have had great success so far. They seem to last longer and if they are going to save me money in the long run how can I complain! You can find out more useful information about CFLs here also: http://www.nvisioncfl.com/
October 30th, 2007 at 12:52 pm
Another way to save money on lighting is not replacing bulbs when they burn out. For instance, I’ve got a vanity in my bathroom with a row of 5 lights, 2 of which I leave unlit and 2 are CFL’s. Also, my bedroom has a row of track lights on which I leave only 2 functioning bulbs. All my double ceiling fixtures have only 1 bulb under the glass (usually CFL) and you’d neven know the difference.
October 30th, 2007 at 12:56 pm
Back when Costco first sold the CFLs (Feit brand, made in China), I bought a whole bunch and replaced all bulbs in my house. Then I noticed that the CFLs from Costco burns out after only a few weeks, whereas the incandescent bulbs were there forever, and that it actually was more trouble that it is worth and switch back to incandescent. But lately, since the CFL price have come down, I switched back to CFL, and I stick with name brands.
As an aside, the cost comparison back when CFL was expensive would be similar to today when it will cost about $15k to install solar panels that will save a house $100 a month in electric bills, so it will take over 10 years to breakeven. Not worth the trouble for most people, until the price comes down a lot more.
Note the flourescent light emits UV and can cause photographs and other UV sensitve materials to fade. The white paint on my cabinets are now yellowish. This is why you never see CFL in museums.
Also note that flourescent tubes (ones that operate with ballast and starter) consume more energy (due to induction) when it is turned on and off frequently.
There is no substitue to turning off the light when it is not used.
October 31st, 2007 at 12:24 pm
Make sure to keep your reciept for these. Although you said you haven’t had a problem yet, GE (and possible others) guarantee the bulbs to last at least 5 years. I recently had one burn out, after only about a year of use. Unfortunately I don’t have the reciept so I’m out of luck. Keep that in mind
November 1st, 2007 at 7:57 am
The key to using CFLs successfully is to do a little homework beforehand - choose a good brand that has the EnergyStar label. Also, use the proper “color temperature” - 2700K is most similar to yellowish incandescent light. Note the lumens which is the true measure of brightness. Use CFLs in light fixtures that you use for a couple of hours at a time (e.g. living room). Use them in fixtures that allow air flow.
I replaced all the lights in my apartment outside the bathroom with the ‘N:vision’ brand of CFLs back in April. Its now November, and not a single one has burned out. The light is bright, warm and pleasant.
I am very happy with fluorescent light. You just need to do a little homework first.
November 1st, 2007 at 11:22 am
Personal Finance Roundup…
How Much Do Compact Fluorescent Bulbs Really Cost? [Get Rich Slowly] “We’re saving $15.98 per billing period..” Making the most of your flexible spending account [Bankrate] “A little knowledge and planning can keep you from wasting the money in you…
November 1st, 2007 at 12:21 pm
[...] his post: Here’s the [...]
November 2nd, 2007 at 8:06 am
The author needs a new calculator. Most of the calculations are wrong!
e.g. 229 * $0.038 = $7.74 is incorrect!
It should by $8.70!!
November 2nd, 2007 at 11:36 pm
Thanks allen & dakboy for answering my question. I looked on Amazon and it looks like 8-9 bucks each for the vanity globe CFLs so it is good to know I dont have to replace them all at the same time. I also learned a lot about CFLs from the other comments too. Thanks.
November 5th, 2007 at 4:07 am
Man, you guys get a pretty decent rate for electricity, here in Australia we are paying about AU$0.13/kWh on average.
November 5th, 2007 at 2:15 pm
The true cost of CFLs is the way they create a dingy quality of light that gives people headaches and makes them subtly uncomfortable. Not healthy.
November 16th, 2007 at 9:32 am
[...] let’s get personal - what does this mean to you, the consumer? Well, look at it this way: If you use about one-eighth the energy with a CFL as with an [...]
November 22nd, 2007 at 7:45 am
1. I’ve had bad luck with the Commercial Electric CFL bulbs that Home Depot sells. I now tape the receipt to the package, mark the date on the base of each bulb, and take the bulbs back when they burn out. I get in the 0.5-2 year range, when they are “guaranteed 7 years.” Anybody know of a brand of CFL’s that lasts fares better over time?
2. The mercury is an issue. There should be mandatory take-back programs. Manufacturers that put a toxic element like this in a product should be required to have free collection and recycling programs in place at the point of purchase. The programs we have in place in Minnesota are not consumer friendly, thus making it a chore to recycle old bulbs (unless you save your receipt, and take them back to the store when they inevitably fail before their guaranteed lifetime).
By using CFLs, you are reducing the amount of mercury that goes into the environment from coal-fired power plants. But without adequate collection and recycling programs, and a high compliance rate, CFL mercury just shows up elsewhere in the environment.
November 28th, 2007 at 7:43 pm
Three problems prevent me from buying into CFL bulbs completeley.
The first is flicker. As a person with a serious nastigmus I am very sensitive to it. I will never have anything but incandescents or halogen bulbs on my desklight or for reading next to my bed.
Item number two is lifespan. Every fluorescent bulb ever made has claimed to outlast incandescents bulbs by 5, 10 or even 20 to one. In reality, none to date have come close. I have had many die at 500 hours or so (less than half the life of the cheapest incandescents). Fortunately most of these failures are due to balast problems and the electronic balasts in the CFLs should prove superior. Time will tell…
The final item is ambiance. They just aren’t soothing. Within a week, my neighbor and I put up new porch lamps. I replaced some old lamps with brass lamps and two clear 15 watt bulbs. He put a normal houseing and an LED bulb. My house looks warm and inviting, his is glaring and garish. Given that the porch lamp is only on when we expect company (perhaps 2 hours a week), I don’t see it as much of an energy hogg so I will gladly pay the minimal cost.
I have converted about half of my lights to CFLs and probably won’t go any farther. That is about all that I see as appropriate. The rest may go halogen for a 10-15% savings over incandescent (is halogen incandescent - a topic for another discussion). That’s where I stand….